3meter FT Shinden (will not use imperial units if possible :)

[mrjdstewart]

i have the Shinden plans if you want to look at them. PM me.

@Rasterize and myself are going to be doing a 250% Cub soon so i will be paying close attention to all these big builds.

good luck,

me

 

[localfiend]

I think the Plans release is actually close this time. Sponz is polishing up the final version, and Rasterize has something in store as well.

Scaling up to the thick foam shouldn't be a problem. You'll have to adjust gaps though. 3 meters is a good bit bigger than the standard upscale. I think my plans were for a 38" wingspan, and a 29" length.

 

[Ryan O.]

A few things, I was worried that the Retracts would cost a lot, but it should just barely fit into my budget, but it will delay other projects. I was wondering if making the spot where the nose gear is mounted should be sacrificial so if I don’t flare properly it won’t damage much because most of the electronics will be further back. I am building this from my own design, but Shinden plans would be helpful to determine CG because my airfoil will be similar, but larger and molded foam. Fortunately one of the image of the Shinden online has the outlines for different parts of the fuselage. I will use two standard size servos for the canards. Every servo will be standard, and I will use differential programming on the rudders. If I need to cut Carbon Fiber I will use a tool under water with a proper mask and eye gear too. The sheer webbed soar for the wing might need a secondary spar for extra strength.

 

[Ryan O.]

i have the Shinden plans if you want to look at them. PM me.

@Rasterize and myself are going to be doing a 250% Cub soon so i will be paying close attention to all these big builds.

good luck,

me

Cool, do you have the link to the threads. The Cub must scale pretty well, abd somehow fly even better 🙃

 

[localfiend]

If you're going to make your own plans, I highly recommend building an identical smaller version first. CG on the shinden is critical, and the majority of the RC versions of it that have been built had rocky beginnings.

 

[Ryan O.]

If you're going to make your own plans, I highly recommend building an identical smaller version first. CG on the shinden is critical, and the majority of the RC versions of it that have been built had rocky beginnings.[/QUOTE

This is quite a large build so I'd recommend thinking about the gear earlier rather than later. A few things I'd recommend considering:

• What AUW are you anticipating? Even a FB model at this size can easily hit 20+ lbs. You'll need to use gear that can handle that kind of weight and design the gear mount into the structure/spars for the wing to spread the load out.
• The Shinden has some pretty long legs and you likely wont be able to cheat much on them due to the need for ground clearance on the prop, particularly during rotation and landing. Off the shelf may be hard to find so you'll probably have to build your own struts.
  • CF tube is light and strong but relatively brittle. You'll likely need to use pretty solid aluminum or steel tube, especially if the weight starts to get up there. You MIGHT be able to get away with big music wire struts but they will be heavy too. You'll need big wheels as well. Dave brown has a great line of large foam wheels that are really lightweight, but you can't leave the model sitting on them for long periods of time without getting flat spots. I'd definitely check them out.
  • Whatever material you go with for the struts, the length, weight of the material, and weight of the wheel will likely mean you'll need a BIG retract unit. Hobbyking has some at reasonable prices, but I would look for ones that are rated for a fair amount MORE than you expect this to come in at. They need to be strong enough to pull up all of that weight.
• Consider WHERE you are going to fly her. The runway at Flite Fest last year was MUCH better than in previous years and many of us were able to fly heavy warbirds with wheels around 4". Previous years were much rougher. Who knows what the conditions will be next year. That field is rough though and your gear (particularly that LONG nose gear) will take a beating. Struts, Trunions, and mounts will have to be built to handle it. Think about oversizing the wheels from scale if you can.

As someone who has a 20lb P-40 model about the same size as this build I can tell you that getting reliable gear for her was a huge headache and in the end cost $$$$. A lot of $$$$ . If you want to fly her for more events than just FF and have her last you'll need to build her with this stuff in mind. You COULD make her a belly lander, make the lower portions of the wing vertical stabilizers "breakaway" so they slide off on landing, and run a folding prop. Would save a TON of weight and complexity. You could then use a bungee launch setup to get her airborne (to keep yourself or a volunteer away from that prop).

Just my 2 cents. I'm happy to discuss landing hear options. Just let me know if you have questions and want to bounce ideas off the community.

I am leaning towards the bungee mechanism for the plane. I normally fly at a field that is normal sized. This will fly at FF and Warbirds Over Wisconsin at Fon Du Lac airfield which is a really large grass runway. If I go with the bungee it could probably fly at my local field due to the lighter weight. I did some research and couldn't find a collapsable glider style prop that was 18-20 inches, but if I go with a normal prop and reinforced vertical surfaces that are slightly larger it can land without striking the prop. During bungee launch I'll have to come up with something to keep the nose at a good angle of attack. I think 6s should be enough power for this plane to fly without retracts. I was looking at two 6s 4000mah 60c lipo batteries that are like what are used in EDF planes. I am not sure if those would give decent flight time yet.

 

[Ryan O.]

I found a motor and ESC combo for 6s power. I don't plan to fly it extremely, only what warbirds could actually do like canopy rolls, loops, hammerheads, split S, and inverted. Here is the motor link https://emax-usa.com/emx-mt-0444-gt5325-260kv.html
Here is the ESC link https://hobbyking.com/en_us/hobbyking-yep-100a-2-6s-sbec-brushless-speed-controller.html

 

[wilmracer]

During bungee launch I'll have to come up with something to keep the nose at a good angle of attack.

A set of PVC rails is typically used to keep the aircraft in slightly nose-up stance before release. If you attach the release hook at the right spot the nose will come up on its own. I found for most of my pusher jets somewhere between 30-35% of the distance from the nose to the CG (measured back from the tip of the nose) would give a reliable, gentle climb. Move it back further toward the CG and you get more agressive pitch up of the nose on launch. Further toward the nose will be flatter and increases the chances of dragging her across the ground.

 

[Ryan O.]

So the Hi Start is looking less possible for the second event I want to fly at, but I have a plan for that. Since my prop is smaller than the scale propeller It is probably possible to take off with the bottom stabilizers functioning as landing gear. If i make them strong enough they can support the plane. I can also make a little trolley like main gear that falls off like the ME 163. It will need to hold the nose at a slight up angle to allow the plane to take off. The two bottom stabilizers can be built doubled up monster foam (or tripled up normal foam) with piano wire and plywood strengthening. Landing can be done without the trolley gear. This idea is more likely to be allowed at Warbirds Over Wisconsin.

 

[mrjdstewart]

I found a motor and ESC combo for 6s power. I don't plan to fly it extremely, only what warbirds could actually do like canopy rolls, loops, hammerheads, split S, and inverted. Here is the motor link https://emax-usa.com/emx-mt-0444-gt5325-260kv.html
Here is the ESC link https://hobbyking.com/en_us/hobbyking-yep-100a-2-6s-sbec-brushless-speed-controller.html

those YEP ESCs are great but I would highly recommend getting the programing card as they come setup for helos from the factory.

me

 

[SP0NZ]

I think the Plans release is actually close this time. Sponz is polishing up the final version, and Rasterize has something in store as well.

The plans are 95% complete. I need to work out some details with Flite Test for this release, but the Shinden should *finally* happen in early 2020. Keep in mind that this will not be released as a kit, nor will there be a Flite Test build video for it. At least not for this initial release of the free plans.

 

[Michael9865]

The plans are 95% complete. I need to work out some details with Flite Test for this release, but the Shinden should *finally* happen in early 2020. Keep in mind that this will not be released as a kit, nor will there be a Flite Test build video for it. At least not for this initial release of the free plans.

Awesomeness!

 

[mach1 rc]

The plans are 95% complete. I need to work out some details with Flite Test for this release, but the Shinden should *finally* happen in early 2020. Keep in mind that this will not be released as a kit, nor will there be a Flite Test build video for it. At least not for this initial release of the free plans.

Can't wait

 

[FoamyDM]

So now that Flite Test came out with Maker Foam I will try to convince my local hobbytown to get sone sheets. I don't need the giant box, and I can't afford it anyway. The reason I need to get some of the larger foam first is that the whole plane will be based on a cenert box spar that will be reinforced with basswood. Everything from the motor to the wing and nose gear will be attached to the box, so the stronger the better. I still don't know what to do for the retracts, but those can wait.

Same here about getting local makerfoam.

 

[Ryan O.]

Same here about getting local makerfoam.

Mine needs enough interest for 1 box.

 

[Ryan O.]

I found a cheaper ESC that doesn't need programming. The motor draws 80a at the setup I am using but the ESC I'll use is 100a because I don't want to overheat the ESC during flight.
https://hobbyking.com/en_us/turnigy-plush-32-100a-speed-controller-w-bec.html

 

[Ryan O.]

The plans are 95% complete. I need to work out some details with Flite Test for this release, but the Shinden should *finally* happen in early 2020. Keep in mind that this will not be released as a kit, nor will there be a Flite Test build video for it. At least not for this initial release of the free plans.

Thanks, that would save a lot of time for prototyping the miniature model for CG. All I would need to design a mini master series wing.

 

[Ryan O.]

In my local area we might buy one pack of maker foam as a group purchase where everyone pays for the amount of foam board they need. I only need one sheet for the fuselage spar, but if this works I would get a few for the vertical stabilizers, canards, sheer webbing for the wing spars, motor mount area, and future builds.

 

[Ryan O.]

The motor came and it should be sufficient power. Her is it for scale next to my ground effect plane with a radial F pack motor:

 

[The Hangar]

The motor came and it should be sufficient power. Her is it for scale next to my ground effect plane with a radial F pack motor: View attachment 153127

That's a giant motor! I love it! How many cells do you plan on running it?