• This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn more.

Betaflight, vs Cleanflight or butterflight

#1
Hey I have been using betaflight now for about a few months now, just got back into RC and just started getting into quads. I am finding betaflight to be really bad, inaccurate and really a pain. Anyone have any opinions an wether cleanflight or butterflight could work better, and also wether you can switch to them after using betaflight easily. I just do not see betaflight being that great, and after talking with guys I have come the the idea betaflight might just be that a beta platform, it may one day be great, but seems to me to be a bit lacking.
 
#3
This may be, but sometimes it gets better, as BetaFlight may not be willing to make the changes cleanflight is. I hear lots of great things that cleanflight is doing, and many that have switched. It’s something I am thinking on, I will try it, I am not happy at all with betaflight, if I gain nothing, then I have lost nothing, I think though I do have much to gain from what I am told by others. I just wanted to put it out here and see what others think. I also heard great things about butterflight as well. I have no real world experience with it, and wondered if anyone did and or had any advice in switching. I think I have nothing to lose at this point, betaflight is far to twitchy, changes that do not save right, having to do some changes over and over just to get it to stick. At times I wonder if the accelerometer is really calibrating properly. The battery semitones has lots to be desired in its accuracy. Many things I have questioned and many have said to me on other forums I am on to switch to cleanflight or butterflight, so I am posing this question here as well.
 

cranialrectosis

Faster than a speeding faceplant!
Mentor
#4
BetaFlight is or was the published cutting edge betas of CleanFlight which was a knock off and upgrade (hmm a knock up?) of TimeCop's BaseFlight...

My point being that if you stick with the hobby for a few years, you will switch ROMs a few times. dRonin has or had a nice ROM for a long time. Check it out. You might like that best of all.
 
#5
BetaFlight is or was the published cutting edge betas of CleanFlight which was a knock off and upgrade (hmm a knock up?) of TimeCop's BaseFlight...

My point being that if you stick with the hobby for a few years, you will switch ROMs a few times. dRonin has or had a nice ROM for a long time. Check it out. You might like that best of all.
Thanks, this was kind of my point. Do not get me wrong, I think betaflight is ok, but I have heard from some friends, that are in the industry that have betaflight ear, that betaflight team are very hard to work with and often will not listen to good common sense. I guess my point is, if I am seeing issues with betaflight from my limited experience, then do I wait till it gets fixed, and how long do you wait, and or do I just move on and try something new. My only fear is once you start with betaflight, can I simply download something like cleanflight, connect my quad up and use it like I was with betaflight, or will it cause issues with using cleanflight after using betaflight. Since I am new I do not know what kind of issues could arise.
 

cranialrectosis

Faster than a speeding faceplant!
Mentor
#6
BetaFlight and CleanFlight have been flinging poo at each other for years.

Unless they are a really good pilot, most people probably won't see the difference. Do you care if you use Windows or Linux to send a message? Most people don't think about it. They grab what they find convenient and send the message. People who give a dang about it probably aren't much fun at parties.

They flash the same because at the core, they are the same. BetaFlight is what was created when a split inside the ranks of CleanFlight happened. Follow the instructions. Wear a wrist strap when handing your FCB. Don't drink a soda on the workbench next to your FCB while flashing... you get the idea.

As I understand from your description, the latest version of BetaFlight is buggy but an earlier version of BetaFlight worked. If this is accurate, I recommend reverting BetaFlight to an earlier version of BetaFlight. I think you will find it simpler to adjust to such a reversion than flipping to CleanFlight.

During the flashing process (again, follow the instructions), choose an earlier ROM for your board.

I had a Naze32 rev 5 that I ran BaseFlight, upgraded to Cleanflight, then upgraded to BetaFlight and finally to dRonin. So long as you aren't running DJI hardware, it's your motherboard. Run whatever ROM you like.

Fork it! Make your own ROM.

But be warned.

You mention limited experience. Flashing your ROM may wipe out your settings. Changing ROMs will introduce you to different interfaces completely. You won't have limited experience when you are tweaking your settings on your 4th ROM for the 27th time. You'll be a salty, veteran.

In other words, if the copter flies well, just fly it. You'll have more fun at parties. :)
 
#7
BetaFlight and CleanFlight have been flinging poo at each other for years.

Unless they are a really good pilot, most people probably won't see the difference. Do you care if you use Windows or Linux to send a message? Most people don't think about it. They grab what they find convenient and send the message. People who give a dang about it probably aren't much fun at parties.

They flash the same because at the core, they are the same. BetaFlight is what was created when a split inside the ranks of CleanFlight happened. Follow the instructions. Wear a wrist strap when handing your FCB. Don't drink a soda on the workbench next to your FCB while flashing... you get the idea.

As I understand from your description, the latest version of BetaFlight is buggy but an earlier version of BetaFlight worked. If this is accurate, I recommend reverting BetaFlight to an earlier version of BetaFlight. I think you will find it simpler to adjust to such a reversion than flipping to CleanFlight.

During the flashing process (again, follow the instructions), choose an earlier ROM for your board.

I had a Naze32 rev 5 that I ran BaseFlight, upgraded to Cleanflight, then upgraded to BetaFlight and finally to dRonin. So long as you aren't running DJI hardware, it's your motherboard. Run whatever ROM you like.

Fork it! Make your own ROM.

But be warned.

You mention limited experience. Flashing your ROM may wipe out your settings. Changing ROMs will introduce you to different interfaces completely. You won't have limited experience when you are tweaking your settings on your 4th ROM for the 27th time. You'll be a salty, veteran.

In other words, if the copter flies well, just fly it. You'll have more fun at parties. :)
Wow, great post. Yes I am new, I am really getting the hang of betaflight and now understanding way more from good folks like you. I still feel betaflight has more polish in the program to go. I say this from my experience in testing software in a beta state. To me this software seems buggy, not the version the whole thing. For instance I am in betaflight and in the OSD section, now I set it up and when I pick a font, it shows the right one I want, save it, go out come back font is switched to default, I can only select default that will save, done this a dozen times, same result, that is a bug plain and simple, but not the only one, there are many more I have found. After talking with Cleanflight guys and Butterflight, I am told this is something that is not there, yes at the bottom of it all it does the same thing, just CLeanflight and BUtterflight do it with less bugs, and more polish and its laid out better and easier to understand. From what I understand it just makes sense to switch, I think I am going to switch as Betaflight just is simply unpolished and as I can see it, the guys on the programming team are very unreasonable from guys I know that do know them. Not sure why, and I can see why it broke into different versions, and to be fair it must have differences, as to the reason they decided to part company, someone must have thought these changes were needed. I hear from guys that switch, the change is night and day.I often make changes in betaflight , only to go back and find either the change that was made and saved did not stay. Or the change had no effect, I often make changes in settings that really should do what I would expect only to find even at the most extreme side of the setting it has no effect. I have discussed this with cleanflight guys and they agreed that was there reason for switching and they found the same setting in cleanflight actually did what they expected, two settings, in a program that should do the exact same thing, only in one it works and the other it does not. I know there are fan boys here that want to support betaflight, but I feel the time for my support must end and abruptly as it really needs work and the team from betaflight have no real interest in correcting the many bugs, and the settings that seem to be connected to nothing. It wont hurt to switch try, I can always switch back should I want to. Seriously though, if there really was not serious difference there would not be 3 independent versions, I mean after cleanflight, then cam butterflight. Must be something to it, its enough for me to switch and try, I really lose nothing. I do Hope the best for betaflight, it seems more and more are leaving it.
 

FDS

Well-known member
#8
The font changes only show up in the actual OSD, not in the preview screen in the configurator.
What you are classing as “buggy” is just the result of developing the software on a small budget within the limits of the dev teams free time.
If you want polished, slick looking systems with corporate accountability behind them then you are going to need to pay for that and use a closed source system. Betaflight is perfectly acceptable at it’s core function of getting your quad flying smoothly, personally I want to spend my time flying not programming, so I just set the defaults, do my rates and set switches then get on with flying.
That approach has worked fine on all 5 quads I have built.
Sure a little simplicity can go a long way and not every change to Betaflight is an improvement. I just use it because there’s always lots of how to support on YT and it’s free. If there was a simple, free set up that worked as well across a range of quads then I would switch.
I don’t think the majority of pilots are that wedded to software, it’s just a means to an end, flying, not the end unto itself.
 

IanSR

Active member
#9
Try emuflight, it's yet another offshoot / branch but I put it on mine and it flew soooo much better than betaflight.

I've since switched to inav and this flies similar if not quiet as good, but it's so much more reassuring to know if crap hits the fan at the flick of a switch it'll come back and land at your feet, instead of either dropping out the sky or flying back in your general direction then crashing anywhere within a 200 meter circle around you.
 

cranialrectosis

Faster than a speeding faceplant!
Mentor
#10
I'm sorry, but changing flight controller software for better font performance...

Did I read that right?

I guess it never mattered to me if I crash or if I crash. To me the real question is 'is it on fire' or 'oh crap that's a FIRE!.

Just cranking your tail there @Tazman. ;)

Flight controller ROM is a means to an end and are constantly in flux. By the time you figure out which one is best and do all the research, your data is stale. You can hunt for the perfect ROM or you can fly. I think most of us just pick one, tune PIDs until it doesn't shake and go fly. If you stick around a few years, you will have 5 quads on 3 different ROMs.

Switching ROMS is a hassle. Do it for a reason that warrants the time. If you think your copter will fly better, do it. If you want to experiment and see for yourself which is better, do it (save a backup). If you want to do it to join club CF, I hope you at least get a sticker out of the deal.

"The enemy of a good plan is the dream of a perfect plan."- vonClausewitz
 
#11
The font changes only show up in the actual OSD, not in the preview screen in the configurator.
What you are classing as “buggy” is just the result of developing the software on a small budget within the limits of the dev teams free time.
If you want polished, slick looking systems with corporate accountability behind them then you are going to need to pay for that and use a closed source system. Betaflight is perfectly acceptable at it’s core function of getting your quad flying smoothly, personally I want to spend my time flying not programming, so I just set the defaults, do my rates and set switches then get on with flying.
That approach has worked fine on all 5 quads I have built.
Sure a little simplicity can go a long way and not every change to Betaflight is an improvement. I just use it because there’s always lots of how to support on YT and it’s free. If there was a simple, free set up that worked as well across a range of quads then I would switch.
I don’t think the majority of pilots are that wedded to software, it’s just a means to an end, flying, not the end unto itself.
No, when I say they do not save, they do not save, I know the difference between the OSD in the configurator and the actual OSD in the googles, they do not change at all, it stays default and is buggy. Cleanflight as I am told has none of these bugs and is why so many are abandoning betaflight, I can really see why, I have downloaded it and am now implementing it, what a change, its like night and day. Sorry to say, try it yourself you will not go back. Betaflight is dying, its on life support. I see why the devs split and took different directions. Betaflight just is not polished as it should be, and it predates cleanflight and butterflight. If you want to use time constraints as an excuse for them, why is cleanflight and butterflight soooo much better, I am seeing it now, my changes are actually taking effect, and I see now the settings that seemed to have no actual meaning in betaflight, really do work in cleanflight. I can say the devs really do look after cleanflight better than the devs of betaflight. Betaflight is litterally that, its beta.
 

sprzout

Knower of useless information
Mentor
#12
So...Betaflight may have its cons...But it has its pros, too. I know it's fairly well supported, and every quad racer I know runs either that or KISS, not Cleanflight or Butterflight.

Does that mean they're horrible? Not necessarily. But, that said, I have to say that there's usually a reason why so many people use a particular item, whether it's a transmitter, or a car, or a computer, or a mobile phone, or whatever - it does what they want it to in the manner they want it. I have to think that if so many of the quad manufacturers out there that make FCs are utilizing these softwares, they're doing so for a good reason - they have stability with a particular version and know the ins and outs for their hardware.

If you find that Cleanflight works best for you, so be it...Keep using it. I'll keep with Betaflight for my quads because I know it works, and I'm comfortable with it - and i know the boards support it. I'd rather not brick a board with something that is untested...
 
#13
So...Betaflight may have its cons...But it has its pros, too. I know it's fairly well supported, and every quad racer I know runs either that or KISS, not Cleanflight or Butterflight.

Does that mean they're horrible? Not necessarily. But, that said, I have to say that there's usually a reason why so many people use a particular item, whether it's a transmitter, or a car, or a computer, or a mobile phone, or whatever - it does what they want it to in the manner they want it. I have to think that if so many of the quad manufacturers out there that make FCs are utilizing these softwares, they're doing so for a good reason - they have stability with a particular version and know the ins and outs for their hardware.

If you find that Cleanflight works best for you, so be it...Keep using it. I'll keep with Betaflight for my quads because I know it works, and I'm comfortable with it - and i know the boards support it. I'd rather not brick a board with something that is untested...
Cleanflight is hardly untested, same with butterflight, you also will not brick your board with them anymore than betaflight. Cleanflight and butterflight, are just better built. The place I got the tip to switch was from some of the top racers, I went to a racer forum to try and see if I could get anymore info on how to get betaflight working better, the advice I got was pitch it and use either cleanflight or butterflight, this form a racer. I didnt just decide to switch overnight, I went to a variety of forums in hopes to learn more about betaflight, my intentions were to continue with betaflight. After many hours and days of chatting with some interesting guys that actually do race, they said they made the leap and never looked back. I tested it today, not only did it work, but the bugs that plagued me with betaflight were gone, the quad never flew better, and I must say what an improvement. I started this post prior to switching this is my first day with cleanflight, and I must say its doing better than betaflight, I can see why the dev team split up and some made e better version of betaflight, I was also told the reason for the split was due to the devs that are still on betaflight not being reasonable and making changes aNd fixing bugs. It is no wonder that cleanflight is actually better. I am new so I have no favouritism to betaflight, I can also switch and not fell bad. I feel that gives me a better view on which one is actually working better. To me the name is not the issue, its which one makes the quad fly better, and the is cleanflight, its not just a choice, if something does something to make something run better, then that to me is what you go with, I see so many fan boys, but I am not one of them. So now I am a cleanflight tried and true, I am also try butterflight for fun, it cannot hurt and its easy. Unless you have actually tried I think you cannot really have an honest opinion.
 
#14
So...Betaflight may have its cons...But it has its pros, too. I know it's fairly well supported, and every quad racer I know runs either that or KISS, not Cleanflight or Butterflight.

Does that mean they're horrible? Not necessarily. But, that said, I have to say that there's usually a reason why so many people use a particular item, whether it's a transmitter, or a car, or a computer, or a mobile phone, or whatever - it does what they want it to in the manner they want it. I have to think that if so many of the quad manufacturers out there that make FCs are utilizing these softwares, they're doing so for a good reason - they have stability with a particular version and know the ins and outs for their hardware.

If you find that Cleanflight works best for you, so be it...Keep using it. I'll keep with Betaflight for my quads because I know it works, and I'm comfortable with it - and i know the boards support it. I'd rather not brick a board with something that is untested...
I also do not think the FC boards are particularly built with Betaflight in mind to be honest, and cleanflight and butterflight use pretty much the same board routines, they just have a more polished version, they have worked out the bugs, and I have found many settings in betaflight that actually are not even working, you can set them, they are like a placebo, just there for show, where as in cleanflight I actually see the setting working, that is something I had to really raise me eyebrow to. If you are happy with betaflight and can live with the bugs and false settings, hey as long as your quad flies and you are happy with the results great. I could not be happy with the resilts, my quad flies smoother, and responds much better, its like I was told day and night difference.
 

cranialrectosis

Faster than a speeding faceplant!
Mentor
#16
No, when I say they do not save, they do not save
Sorry, man. Missed that part.

ROMs will come and ROMs will go (but there will never be another Aron Eisenberg). I have and have seen lots of people make expensive upgrades for all the wrong reasons.

However, not saving is a solid reason.

There are great and wonderful reasons to change these things. Stuff not working is one of them.

Did you check out dRonin?
 
Last edited:
#17
Sorry, man. Missed that part.

ROMs will come and ROMs will go (but there will never be another Aron Eisenberg). I have and have seen lots of people make expensive upgrades for all the wrong reasons.

However, not saving is a solid reason.

There are great and wonderful reasons to change these things. Stuff not working is one of them.

Did you check out dRonin?
Sounds like the voice of experience talking, I do appreciate you words, thanks for sharing.
 

Bricks

Well-known member
#18
Not being a real quad guy I have a question do some boards play better with different Rom`s. As Tazz never mentioned what board he is using, I have 3 250 size quads and one board that will not work with BF or CF it was not designed to work with these ROMs, it is an older board flies fine for what I do, I would have to dig it out to remember what ROM I had to use.
 
#19
Not being a real quad guy I have a question do some boards play better with different Rom`s. As Tazz never mentioned what board he is using, I have 3 250 size quads and one board that will not work with BF or CF it was not designed to work with these ROMs, it is an older board flies fine for what I do, I would have to dig it out to remember what ROM I had to use.
Hey sorry, I am using tiny whoop quads, I have one board that is FrSky in my TInyHawk-S, then I have a BetaFPV 85x, it uses a CrossFire Board, now I am still really new and I am not sure what all works with Betaflight, and I am not very impressed with betaflight considering the years it has been out, then considering how long cleanflight an off shoot of betaflight which has been out less, happens to be better in its programming. I find even though cleanflight is exactly the same as betaflight, its settings have better real application and the stay set, unlike betaflight, some settings actually do nothing you set them and they show no change in your qaud as they should. Cleanflight settings all affect the quad as they state, and the settings set properly. Cleanflight is the polished version of betaflight, I see why the devs split off from betaflight, the team on betaflight in my opinion are lazy and seem unresponsive to end users requests to make changes that are needed, they get offended when guys make suggestions like we are users and have no right to make suggestions. Betaflight is run by immature devs, not sure why, but I do understand why the devs left and started cleanflight, as the name implies it is clean. Not more can be said. Sorry I have no more info on boards, just what I use, but I do know a great many that have built quads and use it. I also know GepRC all there stuff use Betaflight. I think anything that uses Frsky, Crossfire, flysky, etc the most popular protocols, ROMS are not the right word to be used here, a ROM can be flashed with anything, its a matter if the ROM uses the protocol in question. I think betaflight is more so for most popular protocols like a few of the ones I mentioned. There are about 4 or 5 more protocols that betaflight for sure uses, I cannot remember, if you go to betaflights site it should give you a list I suspect of the protocols that are supported. I also think the cleanflight and butter flight being spin offs of betaflight will support the same as well, they are simply guys that are more dedicated and reasonable the started a spin off of betaflight to make the changes that the guys at betaflight are to childish to take care of.