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Can you build a plane that uses wing warping for control?

JimCR120

Got Lobstah?
Site Moderator
#1
Here's a question I've been wondering about... Has anyone successfully tried making ailerwings? (I just made that word up though I doubt it's truly new.) But like the somewhat bird-like articulating tail that you showed over a year ago I would be interested if movement in the wings is feasible where the entire wing is the aileron.
 
#3
Here's a question I've been wondering about... Has anyone successfully tried making ailerwings? (I just made that word up though I doubt it's truly new.) But like the somewhat bird-like articulating tail that you showed over a year ago I would be interested if movement in the wings is feasible where the entire wing is the aileron.
feasible.....yes.....practical with current building methods and material.....not so much. Wing warping is one approach and most likely easiest or wing pivots....which would require some seriously robust servos and VERY tiny tiny tiny throws....robust and precision typically don't go hand in hand.
 
#4
Matter of fact I looked into wing warping briefly after seeing that episode you mentioned....considered it too much of a challenge and not very scalable...so gave up quickly
 

pgerts

Old age member
Mentor
#12
Wing warping is like you say something for vintage Wright flyer and a very few other planes.
The wing is "soft" and wires will pull the wing to "warp" in the outher ends.

Something different was used for fast slope gliders with very stiff glass wings where you did not want to "destroy" the wing with ailerons.
The wing "rotated" on its main wing spar with help of a servo moving the very back end of the wing slightly up and down a fraktion.
The control is very precise and the method allows for really aerodynamic wings.

It is normally not used today as the servos can be built in the wing without any visible control horns, pushrods and "almost invisible" ailerons as everything is so built in the wing shell. (Talking about competition gliders in the range of +2000 dollars.)
 
#13
I see that it is being brought up by others here and as I briefly touched on in the "ask chad" thread.....wings that pivot on spar will require robust servos with high resolution. I ventured down this road for a short time but didn't have the level of commitment required to see anything through. Even looked into stepper motors rather than servos for pivot actuation because I could not nail down any servos that I trusted to hold up to the stress and or re-center perfectly 100% of the time. The intent was to build a SUPER simple tailess flat foamboard parkflyer with full canard style elevator and single pivot wing or "wingleron" lol. Settled on single wing pivot rather than more conventional setup due to economics, complexity and as a matter of testing the idea would have resulted in a faster build. Had a bit more sucess with the wing warping idea, wouldn't need the high level of resolution on a pull-pull servo setup. Fishing line, guides and a flexible material with memory at wing tip TE. I still think some sort of wing warp would be the most doable.....just too many issues to overcome with a pivot system.....gosh just imagine how tiny your throw would need to be when you take into consideration the entire wing is moving.....will it hold up or will the control mechanism crater under the stress...for that matter what are the stresses....will it center perfectly everytime or will you have to micro-manage level flight?????? lots of questions.
 
#14
speaking of wing pivot....one other note....I was so concerned about centering and micro-managent that I resolved to use only in conjunction with a gyro if I was to go that route....let the gyro take care of the micro-management.....this would even alleviate the centering issue or at the the very least make it a moot point as anything less that level flight due to poor centering, the gyro would smooth out.
 

JimCR120

Got Lobstah?
Site Moderator
#17
I appreciate the new thread made with my question and the responses, especially the video from pgerts showing a sailplane application of the very thing I was asking about (kind of showing, the cameraman had a bit of a time trying to keep it in view).
 

Ak Flyer

Fly the wings off
Mentor
#18
Another thing with this, it wouldn't take that much power to control it if you pivot just ahead of center. It's like having counterbalanced control surfaces on most 3D planes. I don't think it would be all that hard.
 

Foam Addict

Squirrel member
#19
I think that I have a way the precision and force could be combined. This is for a movable wing for a tilt wing. Take a 50 gram digital mg servo, and secure it to a hard point in the plane, next, build a channel around a 14 gram digital mg servo to slide in. Then, attach a linkage from the 50 gram servo arm, to the 14 gram servo body, and then a linkage from the 14 arm to the wing itself. The 14 gram servo would only move the wing, while the 50 would move the 14 and the wing.
I'll post a pic later.
 

Ak Flyer

Fly the wings off
Mentor
#20
What is the benefit?

If you look at the forces involved and the absolute precision required in large 3d helicopter flight you'll see all the power and precision you would ever need. The servos are out there.

If you have a good solid wing spar like a carbon tube spar, with the ability to pivot freely, then a servo with an arm at the rear of the wing would have more than enough control and if you use a good quality servo then centering wouldn't be a problem. If you think about it the centering wouldn't be any more of an issue than it is with ailerons. If you aileron servos don't center you just as much trouble.