Carl Goldberg Ranger 30

[dgrigor02]

Here is the video. 1804 motor, 6X3 gemfan prop, 500mah 3S. 70% throw, 30% expo. Wing dihedral 2". My preferred CG was 1 3/4" from the leading edge.

This is your original wing resized to 114%, the tips cut to length ( which ended up being 2" from the end on both the top and flat bottom part of the wing ). Your original fuse from post #12, your larger rudder.

I want to learn sketchup from Tommys videos just haven't taken the time.

I normally would use the majority of the field to fly and do more sweeping turns but tried to keep it close so its not too small for the video. Battery was low in camera so kept it short. I didn't try inverted becuase I would want to be higher up as I'm not that good at it and likely be too small for camera. Even at full speed it didn't have any tendancies to want to drift up.

I liked using the flaperons at 50% to slow it down but still won't fly slow enough for indoor.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q0CqErl9tak&feature=youtu.be

Here is the mods to the wing:

Original wing from post #12 resized to 114%, 2" dihedral is what I went with.

Tip cut down 2" and the bottom flat part also 2". Traced the tip shape. So the wing is the same shape just the cord is now a bit wider. Your same spar.

Just in case measurments aren't visable in pic,

First leading edge crease at 1" center of wing to 3/4" tip,
Second crease 1 1/4" from first crease center to 5/8" tip,

Aileron line 1 3/8" from trailing edge and 7/8" tip. Length of aileron 10 3/8" starting 2 1/4" from the tip.

Front of plane:

Used an "A" fold instead of "B" fold the demensions will need to be a little wider to compensate. Then end would be a "C" fold to make the thurst angle. It is approx 3/4" long. Normal right hand thrust from the standard minipod.

I added 45 degree angle to the top since the formers are now 1" thickness shorter.

Just a reference pic of the underside, I cut back the bottom so that I can slide the battery in without taking the wing off:

 

[TooJung2Die]

I just drew one up and built it today. I will get pics tomorrow. Should be able to fly in the morning. So, maybe flight vid also.

I scaled don the HStab span. 14" was crazy long for a horizontal stabilizer when the wing was only 30" span.

I have captured the wing shape, but it looks like too little wing area for a plane this size. The proportions seem funky to me. Like, the nose is really long also.

We will see.

You're right, it is different. It was intended to be a free-flight or U-control airplane. Modification is needed for RC that's for sure. I like the long nose. It makes positioning the battery for CG easy. I left most of the bottom on the nose open for that reason.

I added a quarter size hole in the bottom of the tail for airflow. I had the motor cut out twice under extended full throttle. Probably overheated the ESC due to lack of cooling air flow.

I'm very interested to see how your under camber wing flies. Is the tail on your fuselage going to be open for airflow? It looks wide enough.

 

[TooJung2Die]

Here is the video. 1804 motor, 6X3 gemfan prop, 500mah 3S. 70% throw, 30% expo.

Holy Smoke! That's amazing flying. :applause:
That's what my airplanes look like for about 3 seconds before they hit something stationary like the earth.

Great job with the RC Mods. I wish I could put the 4 channel Ranger I made in the hands of a good pilot.

Now we have a few good Ranger 30 designs to pick and choose from. Mix-n-Match. Make it unique!

I found out how to mix in flaperons. What fun. Enable the flaps at low throttle and it just floats. Thanks for the tip.

Jon

 

[dgrigor02]

I had fun messing around with it. Thanks for starting the thread.

Plane does everything I wanted it to, quite a bit of fun and not near as twitchy as some of the other smaller planes such as baby baron and the pun jet on 3s.

I started with the 3 channel champ and first flitetest one I actually was successful at and learned on was the tiny trainer as well. By the time I was done with it there were 6 more popsicles sticks in it from when I started.

I like the mighty mini size up to 800mm wingspans as the neightborhood park really isn't big enough for the 40"+ ones so always looking for more this size to try out.

 

[TEAJR66]

Dgrigor02, If you like the smaller planes, you will like this one also. This is the Mini Sport Trainer Swappable. Runs perfectly on the FT "A" power pack. 500mAh battery 2S-3S is plenty. I've flown it on 1000mAh hours just fine but it wasn't needed. Kind of overkill.

The plans have a reference line in the center of the wing for some dihedral, but building the wing without it does not hurt it, just makes it more roll sensitive.

Here are a few pictures.

Here are the plans if you want to try it.
View attachment Mini Sport Trainer Swappable.pdf

 

[TEAJR66]

Here is my version of the Carl Goldberg Ranger 30. This was done in DTFB, and made 4 channel RC.

This plane flew using the FT Power Pack "A" on a 3S 1000mAh battery and a 2S 500mAh battery (6x3 prop). It also flew on a 5X3 prop with the 500mAh battery just fine. On 3S the plane was very sporty. On 2S it was very mellow and enjoyed flat level flight. The 2S barely gave it the power to pull a loop.

Given the fact that there are many other planes in this class that perform better, I won't be maintaining this plane in the hangar. It would probably serve better as a three channel plane if the wing area was a little bigger.

The rudder was very responsive while the ailerons were anemic. The combination of the high wing with that dihedral and the size of the ailerons (I only used the size that the original plans had laid out as decoration), made ailerons only responsive at full deflection. That made the plane feel as though the ailerons were all or nothing. The rudder rolls were twice as snappy as aileron rolls.

If you are an experienced pilot, this would be a great project to play with and tweak. The plane makes a great starting point for customization. I would not recommend this plane as a new pilots training plane.

I did not bother with the turtle decking on the nose (that would definitely improve its appearance). I also used the FT Mini Power pod with the right thrust. Down thrust is one layer of DTFB at the front with the back of the pod flush with the top plate.

Here are the pictures.



Here is the flight video. This is the second flight because I left the lens cap on during the first flight. I am a jeanious!

I think TooJung2Die did an excellent job with this plane and his modifications are probably the way to go. Dgrigor02's version looks pretty promising also. But, if you are still interested in my version, here are the plans.

View attachment Ranger 30 Foam Plans.pdf

 

[TooJung2Die]

Tommy, Your results while not entirely successful are very useful. You proved that the under camber wing works and larger control surfaces are needed. I saw the tiny ailerons on the original airplane and thought they were more for decoration than flight. Bigger is better in this case. I found no detriment to keeping the extra long horizontal stabilizer of the original even though it is obviously larger than needed.

When the time comes to rebuild I'm going to take the best of everything worked out so far. Even though the constant chord wings work very well they don't have the delicate look of the tapered wing of the original airplane. Function over form is more important when learning to fly so I'm sticking with what works until I get better at flying.

The Mini Sport Trainer reminds me of a tiny Das Stik.

This has been a fun journey!

Jon

 

[dgrigor02]

I'm really surprised the thin cord you could get to fly. My first try with original wing shape lasted about 10 seconds. So that is an accomplishment.

I am perfectly happy with how the 114% wing cut to length flys. I'll give it a try later on 2s. Plan to add LEDs for a little night flying as well.

 

[TooJung2Die]

Tommy and dgrigor02, Thanks for posting the videos of you flying the Rangers. It inspired me and I flew with a different attitude today because of it. It showed me I've been way too cautious. What's the worst that can happen? I get to build a new airplane? I have to remember these Dollar Tree foam board aircraft are disposable and crashing is not failure.

It was fun to get crazy and try stuff just to see what will happen. Both the Ranger and Tiny Trainer survived to fly another day.

Jon

 

[TEAJR66]

The crash was the end of the video. It was not the end of the plane. I picked it up and flew again. The landing gear collapses on a hard landing, that's what the rubber bands do. As soon as you pick up the plane, the gear snaps back. I even let my buddy fly it. He had it in the air for about 10 seconds. That crash blew out the bottom front of the fuselage where the battery came through. I ripped off the broken foam and put the battery under the pod with rubber bands around the pod skewers. Rite back up she went.

The plane fly's fine. But, I like some other planes better, so that is where I will focus my efforts. In the mean time, the Ranger 30 is on the shelf behind me. It is waiting to be flown again or for its electronics to go into another project, whatever comes first. Rite now it is looking like its guts will go into my 28" PT 19, soon.

 

[TooJung2Die]

It's getting wrinkly due to a couple of less than perfect unplanned landings (crash). This little airplane has earned a spot in my permanent hanger. Flying it has improved my skills and it's unintimidating size lends itself to trying new maneuvers and tricks. With the 3 channel wing and a 2s battery it is a docile and predictable trainer. With the aileron wing and a 3s battery it is quick and sporty. It's a good size for flying in the smaller park close to my house. When it comes time to build another I'll definitely use what dgrigor02 and Tommy learned on their builds to make it closer to the original appearance but still just as flyable.



Jon

 

[TooJung2Die]

The best of everything, one more plan.

Using the wing dgrigor02 designed in post #61 as a guide I made another tapered wing. It flies excellent. It's remarkable how a few minor changes can make a big difference. It still has a 30" span but the cord is a bit wider and there's a bit more under camber on the wing tips. The creases are closer to the leading edge. I used the 1" dihedral that worked so well on the first aileron wing. I think it flies as well as the constant chord wing. I can't tell the difference.





I made another fuselage too. I used the wider fuselage plan with zero wing incidence. This time I used the original horizontal stabilizer and the tall rudder. Once again the airplane looks very much like the original Goldberg Ranger 30 free-flight design. I was thinking that with the extra 3/8" width, there's room for doublers inside the nose. It would then have the same inside width as the original fuselage and more strength up there. Maybe I'll do that the next time I rebuild.

I'm not a big fan of the power-pod idea. I have a motor for each airplane in the hanger so they all have a fixed firewall.

I've learned to do snap rolls, multiple loops and climbing corkscrews with this latest Ranger. This Ranger flies better than I hoped it would when I started this project and has given me the confidence to get risky when flying.

I assembled all these parts into one more plan. It all fits on one sheet of 20"x30" foam board!

Plans: View attachment Goldberg Ranger 30 RC.pdf

There's another airplane I built as a boy but never got to fly. The Schoolgirl biplane designed by Ken Willard. It was a Top Flite kit. It hung from my ceiling for many years but without the funds for a radio it never flew. I found the plans on Outerzone: http://outerzone.co.uk/plan_details.asp?ID=816 I have the next project for my second childhood. This is fun!

Jon

 

[dgrigor02]

I just got a new Power Pack B sized motor in today. It flys so well I was going to upscale 140% ( 42" wingspan ) and use the normal size powerpod. See if slightly larger will still fly well. I know you wanted the 30" mostly for the smaller size but thought give it a try.

To try to get it one step closer to the original wanted to make a minor tweak to the tail by using a split elevator so the vertical tail can sit flat.

I rarely change pods but figured probably can get more interest if it better conforms to the FT standard. It is nice that we you do nose dive the pods takes most of the damage rather than the fuselage.

 

[TooJung2Die]

It'll fly even better at 140% with a tweak or two. You probably knew there was a Ranger 42 ARF back in the early '70's? It was an early foamy. Goldberg designed a Ranger 21 rubber powered airplane too. PDF plans for the Ranger 21 are available online.

 

[TooJung2Die]

Done for now..

It doesn't look much different than the airplane in the first post. The big difference is in the way it flies.




I'm going to sit back and enjoy flying it while I get to work on the Schoolgirl biplane.
Jon

 

[dgrigor02]

I haven't been able to get any good pictures of the 42 to see if it's just a bigger one or that top wing looks a bit different shape.

 

[TooJung2Die]

I haven't been able to get any good pictures of the 42 to see if it's just a bigger one or that top wing looks a bit different shape.

From what I can see in the few fuzzy photos available the leading edge is swept and the trailing edge is straight.

 

[BobK]

Well the weather has me building, turns out the clear Dollar Tree gift wrap when painted on the inside doesn't look horrible when applied. Weight here is 174g with 41" ws which is heavier than I would like but we'll see how it goes I guess.

 

[TooJung2Die]

Well the weather has me building, turns out the clear Dollar Tree gift wrap when painted on the inside doesn't look horrible when applied. Weight here is 174g with 41" ws which is heavier than I would like but we'll see how it goes I guess.

It looks great from here. I like what you did with the tail feathers, The split elevator has been talked about doing, more like the original design. The super wide horizontal stabilizer in the plans doesn't detract from the performance as far as I can tell. It seems to be a common feature of free flight airplanes for which this airplane design was intended. I have a 1806/2300kv motor in the Ranger, same as in the Schoolgirl. It's more than enough thrust for me with the 30" wing. What motor do you intend to use?

Jon

 

[BobK]

It looks great from here. I like what you did with the tail feathers, The split elevator has been talked about doing, more like the original design. The super wide horizontal stabilizer in the plans doesn't detract from the performance as far as I can tell. It seems to be a common feature of free flight airplanes for which this airplane design was intended. I have a 1806/2300kv motor in the Ranger, same as in the Schoolgirl. It's more than enough thrust for me with the 30" wing. What motor do you intend to use?

Jon

It is turning out pretty well I really didn't have a plan on scheme when I started, kind of simple and getting a bit bright on me now though with these colors lol. I did reduce the horizontal stab by 3.5" so with the scale up it spans 16", I also carved 3/4" off the nose and added it to the tail..the nose looked incredibly long but maybe it won't work well now. No real idea on motor yet, I have a inrunner in my tiny Trainer that makes that plane a rocket with a 6" prop..I might try that on this, but I also have a few outrunners..maybe an AXi 2212/34 with a 10" prop, both are easily interchangeable.

I like the split elevator, I left some foam between the halves and used a popcycle stick to connect them, the fin is attached to the tail skid then cut to match the bottom of the fuse. I don't know what a good weight should be at this size, I'm hoping 10-11oz. range RTF.