CranialRectosis' Twitchity Mini-Tricopter build

[JimCR120]

I realize I'm a newbie at all this but I am happy to compare notes if it can of any help.

First I wan to ask, if everything of my tricopter seems to be somewhate working, should I avoid any Cleanflight or Triflight updates?

With what is currently working, I am available to compare/verify what is working. I don't know if I can be of any help but if I can I want to. You all have certainly been there for me and others. I would like to return the favor.

I can do screen shots or whatever you need.

 

[cranialrectosis]

Thanks, Jim.

Tricopters are fiddly things. Once I get mine working I tend to leave the settings alone. This probably doesn't work to my advantage as I fall behind on the electronics and the settings.

My advice is to have more than one copter. This way you can fiddle around with one and still fly the other.

I have been thinking about rebuilding this copter for years. I was running Simon K ESCs on a 3S rig. This ran a Naze 32 rev 5 and SunnySky 2204 2300kv motors from 2014 and a board cam from before they had pivot brackets. This copter was built BEFORE you could buy a 32mm PDB. It was built BEFORE HQ props came in 6".

When I built this copter, carbon fiber frames were a new thing.

I tore this apart with the understanding that it would take time and a TON of fiddling. The broken ESC didn't help nor did the broken Windows 10 drivers that cost me time.

I also need to rebuild my 4" Alien and my 3S WarpQuad. The Alien will cost me <> 5 hours tops and the WQ about 3. This tricopter has already gone over 12 hours with about 6 hours spent on the tail servo and Windows 10 drivers and 1.5 hours spent troubleshooting a bad ESC.

Tricopter maintenance costs me more time than my other 5 copters combined, and it's ALWAYS because of that servo. It's why I put it off so long and partly why this weekend was so challenging. A LOT has changed in 3 years.

Tricopters are to copters what linux is to PCs. If you just want it to work, go simple like Apple. If you like the challenge, quadcopters and planes are fun, but tricopters are for madmen.

 

[JimCR120]

I hear you. I'm not sure however if I would do an "upgrade" without knowing what improvements to expect. Falling behind in this sense would mean not taking advantage of an improvement. The previous posts however gave me the impression that an update actually made things worse.

I'm a Mac user and a tricopter owner, builder, & pilot (in training) so I'm not sure what that says about me. I do like things to work but I also like challenges. Isuppose the things I buy, I want them to work as advertised and the things I build I understand there might be tweaks along the way.

Anyway, I don't intend to upgrade anytome soon and if you need to compare to an older version, I stand by with the open offer to help.

 

[LitterBug]

One more thought on the DMS210 servo wiring,
Yellow = Feedback
Orange = Signal
Red = Power
Black = Ground.

If the Yellow and orange were accidentally switched, I'm not sure what would happen.

Cheers!
LitterBug

 

[cranialrectosis]

OK. I have some time to try this again.

I have formatted C and am back on Windows 7 again. I have installed Zadig and followed the instructions on RCExplorer including re-flashing the triflight_0_5_F3Fc hex file with the full chip erase selected. The flash worked!

I clicked connect on Cleanflight and get a message stating :"Warning the firmware on this device needs updating to a newer version. Use CLI for backup before flashing. CLI backup/restore procedure is in the documentation.

There is no config tab. When I exit the CLI, Cleanflight disconnects.

I am right back in hell again.

EDIT:
I found a new version of triflight from the Ikaino Git. Trying that now.

EDIT2:
It appears this version of triflight is also not supported by Cleanflight. I see no way to enable voltage or current monitoring. I get a message under power that states I need to "upgrade" my firmware.

EDIT3:
I am back to where I was a few weeks ago. I have figured out that you shouldn't go into tail tune mode while connected to the PC. After that, I enter tail tune mode (disarmed) and push left or right roll (all my switches and sticks work correctly in Cleanflight). The copter beeps one time. I then use the yaw stick and nothing. I can hear the servo hum, but it does not move.

Thanks for the feedback LB. I double (triple and quadruple by now) checked the servo connections. Yellow is going to FB, Orange to 2, Red and Brown to BEC on the FC and I soldered the 6v jumper for BEC on the FC. I am considering going straight to the PDB for power at this point.

I am eager for suggestions if you have any.

 

[cranialrectosis]

I just realized that when I connect the copter to USB and connect a Lipo, the ESCs do not complete the chime and the none of the sliders work in the motors tab when I select the option to activate the motors.

Without USB, the ESCs chime all the notes I expect and the motors and servo respond correctly to my radio.

My PC still tells me that my USB device doesn't work even though Cleanflight connects and I am able to manipulate the settings, including the transmitter settings and mode. I know these work.

EDIT:
On a lark, I put props on. The copter flies. I just cannot get triflight's tailtune to work or Cleanflight to allow several items such as motor activation, live mode for servos or voltage/current monitoring.

 

[cranialrectosis]

So the copter flies. It's not great.

I cannot synch the ESCs. Cleanflight gives me no way to move the sliders. Period. The sliders do not move.

When I disconnect from USB and start up the copter with my transmitter at full throttle, the ESCs do not go into programming mode.

These are the ESCs I am using.
https://rcexplorer.se/product/aikon-sefm-30a-blheli_s-esc/

Any thoughts?

 

[makattack]

I think your esc's are set to no stick programming. You'll have to change that setting from blhelisuite. It will work through cleanflight passthrough. The latest triflight is based off betaflight, so cfconfigurator won't work but betaflight configuration will.

Note: those escs are blheli_s so technically, if you want to run dshot for the best response, it doesn't require esc calibration anymore. If you are running one-shot or regular pwm, you will.

HTH!

 

[cranialrectosis]

Holy smokes Mak. I think this may do it!

I reflashed (again) today and I think my trouble may be that I never rebooted the board from DFU mode or something odd like that. At any rate, this morning I can get tailtune to work. Now I'm going for D-shot 600 (max per the instructions on these ESCs) and go that route.

I am soooooo excited! I may get my tricopter back today.

 

[cranialrectosis]

I am still stuck on calibrating ESCs.

The ESCs I have show the capacitor is removed. I should be able to run DShot600. I have confirmed a photo RCGroups showing which cap to remove with my own. There is no capacitor in the way.

I have flashed my ESCs with the latest BLHeli C-H-25 16.6. I have turned off programming by TX. I go into the motors tab and turn on the motors and they don't spin.

It's really odd. When I connect a lipo I am used to hearing chimes. 3 chimes followed by low throttle and then high throttle chimes. I only hear the first 3. The ESCs are not detecting a valid low throttle signal even in calibration. When I try to run the motors in the BLHeli Suite, I hear those chimes when I am way up high in the throttle almost like BlHeli has my throttle channel reversed.

Thoughts?

 

[makattack]

Hmm... that does sound odd. Almost like the FC and the ESC's aren't talking on the same language. So, just to get our level set, here's what you have now:

Triflight .7 beta 1 installed, with DSHOT600 configured for the esc/motor protocol
BLHeli_S 16.6 installed with TX throttle calibration disabled

Hmmm... it should just work. I don't have esc's capable of DSHOT600 (caps in place) but have verified I can run DSHOT300 on those.

Perhaps try DSHOT300 just to see if it changes things?

 

[cranialrectosis]

Yeah I did. I tried Oneshot and all the DShot variants.

What is killing me is that I can't test the motors in the BlHeliSuite.

I also do not find any dShot firmwares in BlHeli. This guy shows a DShot variant in the BlHeliSuite, but his version is out of date. BlHeliSuite doesn't look like that anymore.

I couldn't calibrate in Oneshot, but I thought it was due to CF and triflight not cooperating.

At this point, I suspect I have at least one more bad ESC... That would be 2 for 4 or it could be some sort of problem with BlHeliSuite and triflight.

 

[PsyBorg]

Hey guys... I see a lot in here about the FC and firmwares and esc's... Why not take a look at the radio settings or better yet start with a whole new profile in case something you are unaware of is muckin thing up.

I am with you in RC hell though as I just spent two full days here between drivers, firmware, guis all of if.

I wiped out all the drivers in my computer again. Then I finally started at the radio and updated the Taranis to the newest stuff once that was able to talk to my pc. Then I thought well lets take a poke at the FC and low and behold I flashed it and it took. THEN it even connected to the newest gui where I was able to flash the ESC's to the latest once I did all the solder work to put it back together. I JUST got back in from a one battery test and my Alien flys once more.

Maybe a deep breath a step back and literally starting over at the beginning will help instead of bouncing here and there "Thinking" what may be wrong like I did until today?

 

[makattack]

Yeah I did. I tried Oneshot and all the DShot variants.

What is killing me is that I can't test the motors in the BlHeliSuite.

I also do not find any dShot firmwares in BlHeli. This guy shows a DShot variant in the BlHeliSuite, but his version is out of date. BlHeliSuite doesn't look like that anymore.

I couldn't calibrate in Oneshot, but I thought it was due to CF and triflight not cooperating.

At this point, I suspect I have at least one more bad ESC... That would be 2 for 4 or it could be some sort of problem with BlHeliSuite and triflight.

Yeah, I think blhelisuite is basically doing the same thing as the FC for tx throttle calibration. I didn't have to flash a specific dshot BLHeli_S firmware... BLHeli_S is the only firmware variety that supports DSHOT. Regular BLHeli doesn't support DSHOT. You mentioned you have BLHeli16_6, version C_H_25(v2) which appears to be the build that's correct for those ESC's according to: http://www.aikon-electronics.com/index.php?id=6

The fact that it does beep the motors indicates they're sort of working...

It's almost sounding like it's an issue on the FC side of things somehow. This is the RCExplorer F3 board right? I have one of those too (only running an older triflight .5, and with bh_heli regular firmware capable ESC's. Let me check to see what the new triflight will be like on this platform. Might take a few days though. I need to get off the forums and get started on my taxes! :black_eyed:

 

[LitterBug]

Did you pass the output of the BabyPDB BEC to the pads on the bottom of the F3FC? If not, power may not make it to the edge BEC pin. I skipped that altogether on BabyTri#2 and wired the servo + directly to the BabyPDB.

I am at a loss here without being able to plug in and play around. All three of my F3FC builds have worked just as they should with no fuss. I have not messed with DSHOT yet. My gear is capable, but just want to get everything working with what I know works. Will flip that on later when I can compare to see if it makes any "noticeable" difference for me. I'm using Oneshot125 and have the calibrate option enabled in BLH so I can flip back and forth between Beta/Triflight and dRonin/Triflight. dRonin does not support BLH passthrough, so I just leave the calibration option on and calibrate every time I flip back and forth between firmware. Just finished up Baby Tri #2, and am using TriFlight 0.7 Beta1 with BetaFlight configurator. I no longer consider CleanFlight an option due to their recent dump everything and revert to BetaFlight. They have me in a corner on an F3OSD board which urks me to no end too...

Here is a "diff" from Baby Tri #2:

CLI
# diff
# Triflight 0.7 Beta 1 / RCEXPLORERF3 3.1.6 Apr  9 2017 / 13:08:24 (bf500bf)
servo 5 1096 1930 1487 40 40 100 -1

feature CURRENT_METER
map TAER1234
serial 0 1 115200 57600 0 115200
serial 1 64 115200 57600 0 115200
aux 0 0 1 1450 2050
aux 1 27 1 1950 2050
aux 2 1 0 1450 1550
aux 3 2 0 1950 2050
aux 4 12 2 1450 1550
aux 5 30 2 1950 2050
set min_throttle = 1035
set serialrx_provider = SPEK2048
set deadband = 5
set yaw_deadband = 5
set tri_tail_servo_speed = 294
profile 0

rateprofile 0

Really, the only changes I needed to make were configuring the RX and flightmodes. I tweaked deadbands. The servo parameters were all done by the unarmed tailtune. (tri_tail_servo_speed and servo 5)

Based on previous success, MWOSD connected on UART1, RX on UART2, Logging on UART3. Do NOT put an OSD on UART2. It back feeds 5V on the 3.3V rail causing issues with voltage and current monitoring.

Pad 1 = Tail motor (CCW)
Pad 2 = Servo
Pad 3 = Right Front motor (CW)
Pad 4 = Left Front motor (CCW)

Cheers!
LitterBug

 

[LitterBug]

I need to get off the forums and get started on my taxes! :black_eyed:

You and me both bro!

LOL

 

[cranialrectosis]

To recap where I am. The copter flew this morning so I know everything is connected properly.

I tried to calibrate my ESCs in Cleanflight and was unable to do so. Mak mentioned CF doesn't support triflight anymore so I went to Betaflight and bammo, I have current monitoring, TailTune works and the motor tab sliders are no longer stuck. They don't move the motors but the sliders slide. In CF they don't move at all.

I still could not calibrate ESCs. They do not go into programming mode through the FC with or without USB support.

Mak also mentioned Dshot and these ESCs are already prepped (no cap) for it. I got the latest blHeliSuite and flashed and made updates to the settings but still no calibration.

I have Cleanflight set to Oneshot125.

When not connected to anything, on power up the ESCs give me 4 chimes, not 5. They sound right I am just missing the 5th chime.

When in the BlHeliSuite (with the lipo connected and after the 4 chimes) when I select check I hear the 5th chime. I see a popup that states Found multiple ESC configuration in Silabs mode. ESC 1:--- ESC2:--- ESC3:---. If I click check again I get something like this:
Found Multiple ESC configuration in SiLabs mode:

ESC# 1 : C_H_25 - Rev. 16.6 - Multi
[MASTER]
(BLHeli Bootloader d)

ESC# 2 : C_H_25 - Rev. 16.6 - Multi
[SLAVE]
(BLHeli Bootloader d)

ESC# 3 : ---

Clicking check a total of 3 times gets me to this:
---------------------------
Information
---------------------------
Found Multiple ESC configuration in SiLabs mode:

ESC# 1 : C_H_25 - Rev. 16.6 - Multi
[MASTER]
(BLHeli Bootloader d)

ESC# 2 : C_H_25 - Rev. 16.6 - Multi
[SLAVE]
(BLHeli Bootloader d)

ESC# 3 : C_H_25 - Rev. 16.6 - Multi
[SLAVE]
(BLHeli Bootloader d)
---------------------------
OK <
---------------------------

I can read and write setup and all 3 ESCs are the same.

When I go to the motors tab the ESCs reboot. I hear 4 chimes. I cannot control the motors. When I use the BLHeliSuite calibration, I hear the FC chirp 2 times and the ESCs chime 4 times when I re-connect the lipo (throttle on full). Afterwards I still cannot move the motors with BlHeli.

This should be taking the FC out of the loop other than the passthrough. I don't have an Arduino or I would go that route.

Right now I am thinking bad ESC or flight controller but it flew this morning.

 

[PsyBorg]

My Kiss FC was throwing weird problems but when it locked everything in it would fly perfectly. It was only after it stopped talking to the computer that I could not wake it back up again. One time motor two would not arm. Sometimes it would time out and reboot and work fine other times I had to cycle power in various flight modes to confuse it into working. Then it decided to start randomly quitting mid flight which made it look exactly like a fail safe which threw me off in a different trouble shooting direction. In the final stage the FC would boot properly according to lights and beeps. Three esc's would work fine and one would go thru the boot process and beep but as soon as it was ready to go the light would go out and I couldn't get it to do anything. All due to me more then likely getting the FC splashed with a drop or two of rain or snow back in January trying to fly too early because it felt warm.

 

[cranialrectosis]

It would be a real drag if my new F3FC is bad out of the box. That would be one bad ESC out of 4 and a bad FC.

Gonna start over and try flashing the FC again in BetaFlight. If this fails, I think I will pull out the FC and PDB and use the RE1 with its PDB and go dRonin. I'm out of high end ESCs at this point. If another FC doesn't work I may try some KISS 24A ESCs and just start over.

One other note. Through all of this Window 7 tells me USB Device Unrecognized and shows some STMicroelectronics Virtual com port as the culprit. In Device manager the device is com port 3 (where I am connecting) and it shows working.

Anyway you slice it, I need to start discharging all the lipos I charged today.

I did get my wife into an Easter Egg hunt today and I smoked up a half rack of baby backs this afternoon. At least we ate well.

 

[cranialrectosis]

This is my diff from BF:

ÿÿi$M>StARM;AIR MODE;ANGLE;HORIZON;HEADFREE;FAILSAFE;BEEPER;FPV ANGLE MIX;OSD SW;TAIL TUNE;$M>–†

$M>ni$M>gÜÜÜÜÜÜÜÜw$M>hèèè“
CLI

# diff
# Triflight 0.7 Beta 1 / RCEXPLORERF3 3.1.6 Apr 9 2017 / 13:08:24 (bf500bf)
servo 5 1000 2000 1500 40 40 100 -1

feature TELEMETRY
feature CURRENT_METER
map TAER1234
aux 0 0 0 1325 2100
aux 1 27 0 1775 2100
aux 2 30 0 1725 2100
profile 0

rateprofile 0
rateprofile 0


#

"Really, the only changes I needed to make were configuring the RX and flightmodes. I tweaked deadbands. The servo parameters were all done by the unarmed tailtune. (tri_tail_servo_speed and servo 5)

Based on previous success, MWOSD connected on UART1, RX on UART2, Logging on UART3. Do NOT put an OSD on UART2. It back feeds 5V on the 3.3V rail causing issues with voltage and current monitoring.

Pad 1 = Tail motor (CCW)
Pad 2 = Servo
Pad 3 = Right Front motor (CW)
Pad 4 = Left Front motor (CCW)" EXACTLY like mine.