Cutting foam sheets... with a needle!
- Thread starter dkj4linux
- Start date
dkj4linux
Elite member
Very nice, Mark! That really is a relatively simple, larger-format, machine... I love the generous work-area it provides.
Now that I have just about satisfied my curiosity with the Phlatprinter-style machine... I need to give this one a go. I've also got my C-beam machine build about 40-50% done now and those end-plates would be a perfect project for it.
Good work! I look forward to seeing some of the planes you cut on this machine
-- David
moebeast
Member
Very nice, Mark! That really is a relatively simple, larger-format, machine... I love the generous work-area it provides.
Now that I have just about satisfied my curiosity with the Phlatprinter-style machine... I need to give this one a go. I've also got my C-beam machine build about 40-50% done now and those end-plates would be a perfect project for it.
Good work! I look forward to seeing some of the planes you cut on this machine
-- David
I need to make some adjustments to the end plate drawing. I originally planned to use the Low Rider's belt guide pieces for the x-axis, but I don't have any small rollers on hand. After the gantry was assembled and the stepper mounted, I just put the 608 bearings about where they would work and drilled holes for them. I need to make some sort of guide to keep the belt from running off the bearing. I could just move things around so the MPCNC part will work. I would also like to work up some sort of cover for the Ramps board.
The power supply is a Dell DA-2 for a mini form factor PC. It is rated for 18 amps at 12 vdc. Much simpler than the old ATX that I used on my MPCNC. The cord coming out of the brick is about 4 ft long, so the gantry can travel the full length of the door with the brick laying on the floor.
I've avoided putting any holes in the door. I think I will glue some guides down to align the vacuum pad and let the vacuum hold it in place. Or maybe some hot glue in the corners. After I cut the two slotted pieces, I used vacuum to cut the top piece.
After I work out the details on the side plates, I will work up another article. This thing should be less intimidating than an MPCNC.
Now that I have it working, I really don't have anything I need to cut. I have seven planes waiting to be built. My club is having a swap meet this month, maybe I could go into production mode and try to recoup some of my investment...
moebeast
Member
New side plates and belt guide are posted. Foam Ripper found on #Thingiverse https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:2520214
Mark
dkj4linux
Elite member
Thanks, Mark.
If I'm understanding right, you can sandwich a bearing between fender washers or printed washers to help guide the belt around the bearing... use spacers as necessary to allow outer race to roll freely
-- David
moebeast
Member
Yes, I could just do it that way like the original MPCNC, but I put my rollers so close to the table that I would have to grind the washers down to not interfere. The rollers could just be shifted up a bit, but where they are the belt lays perfectly flat on the table. On the other hand, some clearance under the belt may be better if trash gets under there. Something to think about.
Another topic of interest to me was the super cheap linear motion control on the z axis. I used the 5/16" bolts as we discussed earlier. I had to grind them down in one spot that was thicker than the rest. When the thing was assembled, at full extent there was some binding. I put a bit of lubricant on the bolts, and it seems to be working perfectly (at least for foam board required tolerances).
-Mark
josh yoder
New member
I built a sidewinder Cnc router from Dave Gatton. I made a needle foam cutter and finally made some successful test cuts tonight. Is there anyone on the forum who would share their g-code for flite test planes so I don't have to do the file conversions? I'm really dumb with computers and I dread trying to do this myself. I'm using mach3.
moebeast
Member
Most of us are using Marlin flavored gcode which might work or might not. The guys you should talk to about the Mach3 files are on the Rascal CNC thread. Kevin has a Ganton machine. They are sort of anti-needle cutter, but the files should work.
ironkane
Member
It's really fairly simple to go from a Flite Test PDF to Gcode. You'll need Inkscape and Estlcam.
Open Inkscape.
That's about as short as I can make it. But covered most of it. Learning the details yourself is best.
Open Inkscape.
- On the menu go to File/Document Properties.
- Set your Page size to 762 x 508mm (30 x 20) so that every time you open Inkscape, that will be your default. Also select Show Page Border.
- Next and very important, Import, not Open your Flite Test PDF. All you should need to do is drag the imported drawing so that it fits in the page border.
- Now all you have to do is clean up all the non-esential graphics and anything else that's not going to be a tool path.
- Right-Click the drawing and select Ungroup. It may not show on the first time you right-click. Keep trying until you can. You may have to unrgoup several times. When you start seeing multiple objects instead of a single one, you'll be able to start removing them.
- Once you're able to select individual items, left-click and drag to select an object/s. Delete all the junk.
- A very helpful tip: Use "Select Same/Fill and Stroke" from the right-click menu or the Edit menu. Select one of those bevel cut indicator lines. Right-click it and Select Same Fill and Stroke and all those diagonal lines will now be selected to delete with one key press.
- Once you removed everything that's not being cut with a needle, save the file as a SVG and on to Estlcam.
- Set your Work Area to be 762 x 508mm just like Inkscape.
- Open the SVG you created. Use the Move tool to align to work area. Try to avoid the Resize tool. Scale would have to be exact between pages or nothing will fit.
- Select the Engraving tool. This cuts down the center of the line. Part tool cuts to the outside and Hole to the inside. Engraving can do both of those as well. Select Automatic Shape for uninterrupted shapes or select Manual Shape for all the rest.
- For Auto, click the shape and set the cut parameters. Z depth needs to be deep enough for clean cut. Feed rates around 600+. You'll need to experiment. Want unbroken lines? When you're in Inkscape, click on any line that's touching another and using the arrow keys on your keyboard, shift it off one click. Just enough to break contact. Trial and error. Ctrl-Z is your friend.
- Manual shape detection is trickier. It's basically connect-the-dots with some assistance. Zoom in for detail work. Zoom out for long lines. Watch the green line that you create as you drag the mouse. As long as they are following the lines of the drawings, you can continue until just before you start to drift. Then right-click and it will generate multiple connected points.
- After you've done this a few times, it starts to get really easy. I can do most of the plans in around an hour or less depending on complexity (including the Inkscape part).
- When you're done, save the project and then save the CNC program. It defaults to .nc, but it's .gcode . A window will pop up that simulates a cutting run. Press the Play button. Press the fast forward button multiple times to speed it up. Click one when done.
- If you have a Ramps board, you can run the gcode straight from Estlcam. Just open the .nc file and hit the start button. Don't forget to fire up the needle first. And zero out your table too. As long as you don't manually move anything, Estlcam will remember zero.
That's about as short as I can make it. But covered most of it. Learning the details yourself is best.
Last edited:
blackkrystal73
Member
I have a SideWinder by Dave Gatton also, I use a spindle. The G-code should be the same I figure? its just x,y,z right, as long as your long axis is Y like mine. i use Sketchucam ( plugin for sketchup). I use Fusion 360 for my other cutting needs , but sketchucam is my favorite solution for cutting planes.
Do you have a plane in mind or are you just asking? I would be happy to supply you with a G-code file so you can test with. Let me know, I'll help anyway i can.
Kevin
randyrls
Randy
Video showing file preparation
Josh; It is fairly easy once you do it the first time. As Ironkane said, download and install the two free programs you'll need. this video by John describes and demonstrates the process.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W2ngSAn8qpM&t=661s
Thank you John for this video!
Better would be to share the STL files instead of gcode.
On my web site is a page of "Life Rules" Number 8 is "70 to 80 percent of being able to do something is being willing to try!"
Josh; It is fairly easy once you do it the first time. As Ironkane said, download and install the two free programs you'll need. this video by John describes and demonstrates the process.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W2ngSAn8qpM&t=661s
Thank you John for this video!
Better would be to share the STL files instead of gcode.
On my web site is a page of "Life Rules" Number 8 is "70 to 80 percent of being able to do something is being willing to try!"
You misspelled Jason
but thanks for the thanks and the share :applause:You mean the SVG/DWG files? STL files don't come into it. STL are 3D mesh files - useful for 3D printing but not what we're doing here. SVG and DWG are vector formats which are what we want for generating gcode.
I do agree that sharing gcode isn't that useful. There are too many variations from machine to machine and controller to controller....even from user to user depending on each machinists (and I'd say yes even if you're "only" cutting foam board with a needle you still count as a machinist once you're operating a CNC) preference about how to cut something.
That said you can probably get gcode from one setup to work on another but it may take some minor tweaks. The one "big" thing I'd watch out for is how the code is generated.
If you're doing center cuts (engraving in estlcam) then whether you're using a needle or a spindle the geometry is probably going to be close enough. But...if you're defining inside/outside (pocket/part) cuts where the CAM crates toolpaths inside/outside of the lines instead of right on top - then you're going to run into issues. This is because the CAM takes the diameter of the tool into account for those and offsets the tool from the path to compensate. So gcode for a 3mm endmill doing inside/outside cuts will be about 1.5mm off when run on a needle. (I may have done this accidentally once or twice when I forgot to check which tool I had enabled in estlcam :black_eyed: ) That wouldn't give very good results.
I have shared a number of my projects on my google drive, here are links again. They all include the SVG/DWG files generated from the PDF's, most include the original PDF's and many include estlcam files, some even include generated GCODE. Though I wouldn't recommend using the gcode. I don't even use it - I re-generate it fresh each time since I'm constantly refining my setup and usually just save the latest straight to my SD card. (the only time I save Gcode to the google drive is when I'm working on generating gcode while the machine is running so my SD card isn't available.)
X-29:
https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B5JVPXZ3vDfBUTg5LXVOeHRTOUk
Baby Bugatti:
https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B5JVPXZ3vDfBTFdLRFR4ek1Wanc
FT Cub:
https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B5JVPXZ3vDfBSnVFRXVrdVlYVjg
FT Explorer:
https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B5JVPXZ3vDfBWEVLeHRWeGpNNFU
Mini Corsair:
https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B5JVPXZ3vDfBeGdNLVJBSEJMX00
Mini Sparrow:
https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B5JVPXZ3vDfBSXdEYlp2UkdRbUk
My Ink sample stand:
https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B5JVPXZ3vDfBUC0xOE9iTzlDR00
My Bigger Ink Sample Stand:
https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B5JVPXZ3vDfBUGZBUE9MTGRKNVU
A 3D skeleton goldfish puzzle:
https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B5JVPXZ3vDfBU0ctOS0zMHVrMHc
If there's a particular plane anyone would like done as an example I would consider doing a video showing the full process on it. Most of these I just get an itch to build something and crank it out - then realize as I'm done that I should have turned on my screen recorder first
Looking great Tommy! I love the little shelf on your table, I wish I had room for something like that. I left room next to my machine on top but it gets cluttered FAST...having it on a separate level would be really nice. If I ever rebuild my table I may have to steal that idea.
One small suggestion - trim up your Z rails and make them shorter. They act like a lever when they're that long and can throw things out of square. It's one of the big reasons Ryan strongly recommends against attaching anything to the Z rails (like vacuum hoses or cables)
One small suggestion - trim up your Z rails and make them shorter. They act like a lever when they're that long and can throw things out of square. It's one of the big reasons Ryan strongly recommends against attaching anything to the Z rails (like vacuum hoses or cables)
Noted. I have two different set of Z rails. Those longer ones were used because I just could not get dimension correct in my head. The shorter rails will require that I cut that pretty rod that I just bought. Once the newness is worn off, I will cut the threaded rod and use the shorter rails. I only built it for DTFB cutting, hence the short legs. So a short Z was the intent.
Feel free to use any thing that might inspire you. Goodness knows I have poached enough ideas from this community.
Now I just need to learn the programs. Seems there are many flavors of G Code out there and Marlin is a picky eater.
ironkane
Member
Looks good! I was going to mention the Z tower too. Short legs is a good start. I would suggest a vacuum table if you have a table saw and dado blade (Harbor Frieght FTW). Cut a grid with a hole in the center and print up a adapter flange for a shop vac hose. Strip the paper off a sheet of DTFB and poke holes in it and use it as your waste board. Loud, but holds well. A sound dampening enclosure is on my ToDo list. It will keep your DTFB nice and flat.
moebeast
Member
It's really fairly simple to go from a Flite Test PDF to Gcode. You'll need Inkscape and Estlcam.
Open Estlcam
- Set your Work Area to be 762 x 508mm just like Inkscape.
- Open the SVG you created. Use the Move tool to align to work area. Try to avoid the Resize tool. Scale would have to be exact between pages or nothing will fit.
- Select the Engraving tool. This cuts down the center of the line. Part tool cuts to the outside and Hole to the inside. Engraving can do both of those as well. Select Automatic Shape for uninterrupted shapes or select Manual Shape for all the rest.
- For Auto, click the shape and set the cut parameters. Z depth needs to be deep enough for clean cut. Feed rates around 600+. You'll need to experiment. Want unbroken lines? When you're in Inkscape, click on any line that's touching another and using the arrow keys on your keyboard, shift it off one click. Just enough to break contact. Trial and error. Ctrl-Z is your friend.
- Manual shape detection is trickier. It's basically connect-the-dots with some assistance. Zoom in for detail work. Zoom out for long lines. Watch the green line that you create as you drag the mouse. As long as they are following the lines of the drawings, you can continue until just before you start to drift. Then right-click and it will generate multiple connected points.
- After you've done this a few times, it starts to get really easy. I can do most of the plans in around an hour or less depending on complexity (including the Inkscape part).
- When you're done, save the project and then save the CNC program. It defaults to .nc, but it's .gcode . A window will pop up that simulates a cutting run. Press the Play button. Press the fast forward button multiple times to speed it up. Click one when done.
- If you have a Ramps board, you can run the gcode straight from Estlcam. Just open the .nc file and hit the start button. Don't forget to fire up the needle first. And zero out your table too.
That's about as short as I can make it. But covered most of it. Learning the details yourself is best.
You also need to adjust some settings. Here is what I use.
Is there a way to get sketchucam to generate g code that the marlin/mpcnc will use?
I've read what DKJ had to say in this response. https://www.vicious1.com/forum/topic/no-one-uses-sketchup . I made those changes and still no joy.
Trying to avoid exporting a DXF and using Estlcam.
I've read what DKJ had to say in this response. https://www.vicious1.com/forum/topic/no-one-uses-sketchup . I made those changes and still no joy.
Trying to avoid exporting a DXF and using Estlcam.
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