FF2017 Int. Racers: Caudron C.460

[rockyboy]

Looking quiet excellent Carl! I like the idea of tyvek house tape instead of the clear packing tape for more structural elements. From what I remember, that tyvek house wrap stuff sticks really really well to stuff.

I hope the extra weight of that monster motor you're installing will offset having the servos so far back on the tail. I think you saw the size of the bolts I'm using as ballast to try and bring the CG under control :black_eyed: At the very least it should give her some extra wind penetration support!

I think you'll still have plenty of aileron authority with those - I kept having to drop the throws on my larger ailerons. And as we've seen with my multiple stalls on final landing approach turn, at slow speeds we should stay away from the ailerons and let the rudder point her around.

I suppose there might be a case to be made for a tiny throw on a larger aileron causing less drag than a larger throw on a smaller aileron. Maybe one of the people with a rocket science degree around here can chime in.

 

[wilmracer]

I suppose there might be a case to be made for a tiny throw on a larger aileron causing less drag than a larger throw on a smaller aileron. Maybe one of the people with a rocket science degree around here can chime in.

Yeah. It seems like a trade off. I'm open to hear what others think too, but in the end we're doing scale-ish golden era planes for this race. the "real" rc electric pylon racers don't really look scale and definitely don't fly scale.

I'll know better this weekend about the balancing act. The motor, ESC, and 4s4000 come to about 22.7oz. I still haven't added the firewall or motor mount as well, plus the spinner and prop. I guess we'll see

 

[rockyboy]

I'll have to post a picture of what I tried to get the v4 prototype to balance out. I epoxied lead shot into the spinner, and then drilled out a little bit on one side to get the spinner to balance out. It will certainly mean throttling up a bit slower, but hopefully this won't turn out to be a horrible idea

 

[wilmracer]

I'll have to post a picture of what I tried to get the v4 prototype to balance out. I epoxied lead shot into the spinner, and then drilled out a little bit on one side to get the spinner to balance out. It will certainly mean throttling up a bit slower, but hopefully this won't turn out to be a horrible idea

I'll be interested to hear your results. I am aware of some HEAVY nuts that some gasser guys use on their props in a similar effort to build up nose weight as far forward as possible. I'd be worried about the extra rotational mass (possibly more torque to compensate against, more watts used just to spin the prop). Its worth a shot though

I've got a few packs of self-stick lead weights that I tend to use for stuff like this. If needed they will go as far forward inside the cowling/nose as possible.

 

[wilmracer]

Getting close with this one now. I got the turtle deck and forward hatch lined and the motor/ESC installed. ESC is strapped to a small light-ply plate just aft of the air opening. I'll toss a few of NACA vents on in strategic locations for exit airflow. Also working out the hatch latching. Magnets will probably be fine but she will be fast so I'd prefer something else.

I've done some preliminary balance tests and I think I'll be in good shape with either a 3000 or 4000 mAh 4s pack. I'll have to see how much adding the low-temp covering shifts the empty CG before I finalize battery placement but I'm pretty sure it will be good.

 

[rockyboy]

Looking good! For venting I count on the gap between the back of the 'chin' and the leading edge of the wing - it's pretty large and supports an airflow path almost directly in the firewall hole, over the esc, and out under the wing. Did you not end up with a gap there, or just looking for additional venting? Also, I've been thinking about adding a vent on the bottom of the fuselage under the horizontal stabilizer to prevent pressure build up encouraging the canopy to pop the magnets.

And is that a depron sheet undergoing acupuncture for the turtle deck covering? It looks thinner than skinned DTFB.

I finished up my bungee launcher last night and will start adding hook plates to the two Caudrons and the FT Arrow for testing the launch system before I put the blue birds on it. It looks like I might have the house to myself for the weekend which means.... maiden time!! :applause:

 

[wilmracer]

Looking good! For venting I count on the gap between the back of the 'chin' and the leading edge of the wing - it's pretty large and supports an airflow path almost directly in the firewall hole, over the esc, and out under the wing. Did you not end up with a gap there, or just looking for additional venting? Also, I've been thinking about adding a vent on the bottom of the fuselage under the horizontal stabilizer to prevent pressure build up encouraging the canopy to pop the magnets.

And is that a depron sheet undergoing acupuncture for the turtle deck covering? It looks thinner than skinned DTFB.

I finished up my bungee launcher last night and will start adding hook plates to the two Caudrons and the FT Arrow for testing the launch system before I put the blue birds on it. It looks like I might have the house to myself for the weekend which means.... maiden time!! :applause:

I haven't installed the lower or upper forward fuse yet. Forgot that there was a gap there. That will probably work great, but I may still add one further aft to help get some airflow over the battery.

That depron sheet is 2mm. I have 1mm stuff around as well but it is REALLY flimsy stuff.

You'll love the bungee launcher. I haven't taken mine out to Poplar before but I used to use it all the time at a "rouge" field I used to fly from. I used about 5-6lbs of pull for every lb of airplane and generally installed the hook between 25-33% of the distance from the nose to the CG. That seems like a good balance for getting them up to speed quick without going into a steep climb of the rails. I also added about 50' of heavy line to the end of the bungee and had my O ring at the other end of that line. IF the bungee came off of the tie out it won't come all the way back and smack the plane (or the pilot). It makes the whole setup a bit cumbersome but it would really throw them up there nicely.

I'm out of town this weekend so I'm targeting the 24th for maidening mine. Good luck this weekend!

 

[rockyboy]

Adding a plate for the bungee launcher to attach. The little aluminum tube sitting on the wing will be glued into the hole in the plate once the WGG is done foaming. Don't want to close up the hole in the tube that the cotter pin will be slid into.



Will it be ugly? Yes. Should it have been installed before closing up the fuselage? Absolutely. Will it still work? I don't know - we'll see

 

[wilmracer]

I suspect that hook will work just fine. I've always made mine a bit different, but my method might be a bit overkill. I also use a plate with a hole in it, but I use a longer section of wire with the launch hook at one end and a 90* bend into the ply plate at the other. This way there is less twisting force applied to the hole in the plywood and the force is more evenly distributed across the plate. I've never had one setup this way fail.

Sorry for the crappy images. Believe it or not these are from back in 2010 when I converted that tiger scheme F-18 to a pusher setup I've found in more recent models that the plate and wire can be smaller than I used on this one, but like I said... they hold up fine even to belly landing.

 

[rockyboy]

Thanks! I'm definitely in the overkill range then on my Caudron hooks, but since they needed dead weight in the nose to balance out anyway I'm not too worried about it.

I heard on the Angle of Attack podcast that they were having good success using Command wall hooks - the ones with the separate hook and base parts. I'm going to try that on a couple wings - that way when I want to hand launch the hook can stay in the field box, and I don't have to carve up the foam.

 

[wilmracer]

Thanks! I'm definitely in the overkill range then on my Caudron hooks, but since they needed dead weight in the nose to balance out anyway I'm not too worried about it.

I heard on the Angle of Attack podcast that they were having good success using Command wall hooks - the ones with the separate hook and base parts. I'm going to try that on a couple wings - that way when I want to hand launch the hook can stay in the field box, and I don't have to carve up the foam.

Yeah... Those hooks should hold up too. In the long run I think the landings are harder on the hooks than the launches.

 

[DamoRC]

Looking forward to seeing some vids of bungie launched Caudrons!

@wilmracer - is that a Tacon Bigfoot 10 motor? What kind of prop are you thinking of?

DamoRC

 

[wilmracer]

Looking forward to seeing some vids of bungie launched Caudrons!

@wilmracer - is that a Tacon Bigfoot 10 motor? What kind of prop are you thinking of?

DamoRC

Well, nerdnic runs a 10x10 with 4s and pushes 120 with his designs, so that's what I'm gonna do I've already installed the 80 Amp ESC and plan to run a 4s 3000 or 4000 mAh pack with XT90 connectors for the race. I'll do some tests before FF to see how thirsty she is and make sure I have enough mAh to fly hard the whole race (assume she stays airborne for the whole race :black_eyed

 

[DamoRC]

Nice!

 

[wilmracer]

Getting close now. I've got a lot of the covering work done. Just need to sand/shape the front and then lay down the black up there. After maiden I'll add some 1/16th red pin striping to the black/yellow edges (like the Gee Bee's had) and add a few additional details. I have not had a chance to 3D model the canopy so I opted to go the quick and dirty route. The one here here will be cut out to make the canopy frame and a plastic insert will give me the clear windows. I did toss together a quick model for the radiator and I'll get it printed tomorrow.

Other planned details (numbering, logos, Radiator, and other finishing touches) will be added after she's flown.

There are a lot of wrinkles in the Yellow covering, but I'm OK with it. I could have worked slower but we're in a crunch now. This technique works well but even if it doesn't start out with wrinkles it will have them after a few flights. I'd call this a 50/50 model. From 50 feet and at 50mph she'll look great. Actually this could be more of a 100/100 model

 

[rockyboy]

She looks awesome from here!

 

[DamoRC]

Beautiful!

DamoRC

 

[wilmracer]

I'm basically done with construction. Need to wrap up programming and finalize the CG. I think I should be just about spot on with a 4s 3000 or 4000 depending on placement. Empty weight is 38oz.

My inkjet printer is shot so I haven't been able to run off the other decals I want. I'll figure something out after she's flown

 

[JimCR120]

Carl, that's a mean looking plane. Seriously, it almost looks like warpaint. I like the grill on the side.

Less than 3 weeks. Anyone else getting stir crazy over the anticipation of the event?

 

[PsyBorg]

uh huh... and its yer fault.