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Pumpkin drop event

FT Waterproof Foam - Suggestions for Testing

HilldaFlyer

Well-known member
#1
I think we are all excited about the FliteTest branded Adam's foam core that will be waterproof. We've seen a few hints of arrival and I hope it is soon.

My plan is to get a few sheets and test it in several ways to see how it holds up against the Ross brand foam core.
  • Strength - my standard 20" span and add weight until it fails as seen here.
  • Effort to peel - qualitative study to compare how difficult the paper peels from the foam.
  • Weight - Measure the weight and compare against Ross and Adams.
  • Warp factor - After getting wet. Wet one and both sides and measure how much the foam warps when dried.
  • Peeling - After getting wet, does it peel or not? Get foam core wet and try to peel while wet and after dried. Wetting will include total submersion for a specified time, spraying like rain and misting for humidity.
  • Painting - I don't like the brown paper... but if it is truly waterproof, we'll need ways to brighten the finish. I'll throw some paint on it and see how it looks... maybe even try some spray paint to see if it penetrates to the foam.

Please post your suggestions... on how you would test this new foam.
I'll add it to the list.
  • Cold adhesion of hot glue. Ross vs Adams vs FT Waterproof. Make a T shape test piece. That will let you test adhesion to bare foam and to the various papers in one shot. Freeze them for x minutes. Take them out one by one and just smack them. Report which interface breaks cleanly from the hot glue (if any do). My only worry is whether or not the waterproofing might need scuffed up for cold flying builds. If they all come apart tearing the paper or foam that's a good thing.
  • Paint adhesion test. Spray paint each one carefully and with the same number of layers. Let them dry for x hours. Place some packing tape onto each surface after they dry. Press it down good. Leave a tab end (fold the tape over onto itself like a hatch tab). Hold them down similarly and rip that tape off. Again, worry is with waterproofing, do we need to scuff it or not.
  • Bend brittle test. Take pieces of regular Dollar tree Adams foam and a piece of the waterproof foam, and bend it until it breaks cleanly and compare. You can also vary the testing by removing some or all of the paper from the foam. Just taking a measurement of AUW of the foam would also give you a good indication of this (more weight = more density= more likely to be brittle).
 
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RAM

Posted a thousand or more times
#2
Two tests come to mind

1. Cold adhesion of hot glue. Ross vs Adams vs FT Waterproof. Make a T shape test piece. That will let you test adhesion to bare foam and to the various papers in one shot. Freeze them for x minutes. Take them out one by one and just smack them. Report which interface breaks cleanly from the hot glue (if any do). My only worry is whether or not the waterproofing might need scuffed up for cold flying builds. If they all come apart tearing the paper or foam that's a good thing.

2. Paint adhesion test. Spray paint each one carefully and with the same number of layers. Let them dry for x hours. Place some packing tape onto each surface after they dry. Press it down good. Leave a tab end (fold the tape over onto itself like a hatch tab). Hold them down similarly and rip that tape off. Again, worry is with waterproofing, do we need to scuff it or not.
 

RAM

Posted a thousand or more times
#3
One more to add.

3. Weight test after spray painting to desired effect. Different from above spray paint test. Spray as many layers as you need to get an acceptable look. It might be the waterproofing absorbs less paint and takes fewer coats. This could balance the initial weight differences.
 
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#4
I think that covers any testing I would interested in seeing, now if it were anything but paper bag (I can think of worse examples) brown I might be interested in purchasing some..when/if it becomes available..which is incredibly long overdue already. You would think if it can be 'waterproofed' it could be colored/dyed a different color.
 

kacknor

Build another!
#9
I had a brief conversation about the waterproof boards with Josh Bixler himself this past November at the Horizon Indoor Electric Festival. He mentioned that Adams had contacted them about it after seeing their videos and the concerns about how water affects the normal foam board. He told me that when you buy the stuff by the semi truck load that gets attention. ;)

He also mentioned that the cost will be more than the normal board, but only by a small percentage.

JD
 

ofiesens2

Professional noob
#11
My way of testing foam? Build a cheap FT Flyer out of it, fly it, and spiral it into the ground from 100 feet. If It's in 4 pieces or less, then it's a good foam.

xD just kidding. Do it from 200 feet.

But in all seriousness, try a brittleness test. Take pieces of regular Dollar tree Adams foam and a piece of the waterproof foam, and bend it until it breaks cleanly and compare. You can also vary the testing by removing some or all of the paper from the foam. Just taking a measurement of AUW of the foam would also give you a good indication of this (more weight = more density= more likely to be brittle).
 

HilldaFlyer

Well-known member
#12
I really hope that when it finally becomes available they produce at least one episode on how it works compared to the Readi-Board. I think my worst fear is that it will have a waxy-like coating that won't take paint well.

I know FT crew has been working with Adams for a time now trying different formulations... Why not just contact Ross distributors? We'll have to see how the brown FT Foam compares. I'm getting ready.
 

HilldaFlyer

Well-known member
#13
I wonder if the Speed Build Kits will switch over or have it offered as an upgrade.
That is a really good question. I really like the idea of more durable foam core for models. I've stopped using Readi-Board just because I don't like the models falling apart after a few landings in dewy grass. This new foam will likely stop that, but paper bag brown doesn't excite me.
 
#14
I'm not really sure if this is valid, but I remember seeing something about DTFB warping or something while in storage, so maybe testing for how well it "keeps" could be nice? I don't really know what I'm talking about though, so I don't really know if this is any good for a test or not.
 

kacknor

Build another!
#15
That is a really good question. I really like the idea of more durable foam core for models. I've stopped using Readi-Board just because I don't like the models falling apart after a few landings in dewy grass. This new foam will likely stop that, but paper bag brown doesn't excite me.
Brown paper is like white paper. Good enough for maidens, banging around or painting. Would hate to have to use a primer coat for yellow or orange. OTOH, a few bits of colored tape and taking it to the park to fly is good too. Wet grass is a killer no more!

JD
 

HilldaFlyer

Well-known member
#16
I'm not really sure if this is valid, but I remember seeing something about DTFB warping or something while in storage, so maybe testing for how well it "keeps" could be nice? I don't really know what I'm talking about though, so I don't really know if this is any good for a test or not.
This will become apparent when one side gets wet and not the other. If the paper is truly "waterproof" then it will not warp. There are ways around the warping too. When I get a warped sheet, a mist of water and dry it flay with some pressure straightens is out. However, it doesn't prevent warping after building.
 
#17
What about normal hot gluing? The disclaimer in the minwax episode said that the hot glue doesn't stick so well? Any issues with glueing these foamboard?
 

SP0NZ

FT CAD Gremlin
Staff member
Moderator
Mentor
#18
What about normal hot gluing? The disclaimer in the minwax episode said that the hot glue doesn't stick so well? Any issues with glueing these foamboard?
The glue adhesion is actually better. I saw Josh glue a servo flat to it and it held on better than white DTFB. I've done a little bit of gluing up parts with it so far and it seems to be working fine without any issues. A/B Folds seem as strong or stronger that DTFB. That's a pretty subjective "soft" test though.
 
#19
Perfect!

The glue adhesion is actually better. I saw Josh glue a servo flat to it and it held on better than white DTFB. I've done a little bit of gluing up parts with it so far and it seems to be working fine without any issues. A/B Folds seem as strong or stronger that DTFB. That's a pretty subjective "soft" test though.
Oh excellent! Thanks