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FT22 #2 - Crash and burn again

#1
I just took my second F-22 out for its first flight this afternoon. It was a little windier than I wanted it to be but I remember Josh Bixler saying if you wait around for the perfect conditions you'll never fly so I went for it. The turnigy D2822/14 motor with an 8x4E APC style prop put out plenty of power. Right after I crashed I would swear the wind calmed down, figures. I was able to throttle into the wind so the plane was nearly at a stand still. I would make a little headway but every time I turned and tried to loop around and get back in to the wind I crashed it. The first crash didn't do anything to the plane, the second crash broke the right side of the nose where it meets the wing third crash broke the other side of the nose where it meets the wing and bent the whole nose up. I will attach before and after my repair pictures at the end of this post.

So the reason I crashed was that I seem to get no response from the control surfaces I could see the elavons moving up and down. But the plane only slightly rocked back and fourth. Even when I switched to sport mode with greater throws it did not change the response from the plane. The reason for this I can only best explain as a new that I did not have enough power/speed coming off the motor to put enough influence on the control services to manipulate the plane. I finally grew a pair, throttled up and was able to turn the plane with the wind and I think my problem at that point was I didn't maintain a high enough speed (I backed off the throttle some) to overcome the speed of the wind. The plane again didn't respond to any of my inputs. Although the situation is a little different I think the problem was the same that I did not have enough wind crossing over the control surfaces to manipulate the plane.

It was a sold build I don't think it needed any trimming and hand launched like a dream I spend down wind some but I think in fear of going to far I slowed too much before turning.

Does this sound right? Do I need to not be so easy on the "gas?" It's a shame I don't have anybody to fly with and point out my mistakes. as it turned out I forgot my repair tape so once the nose basically broke off that was the end of it. I'm home to do repairs and probably head out this evening for one more shot. the wind is supposed to die down some maybe I'll have better luck.

-Jes

you can see the before and after, I had already reinforced many of my edges with the skewers but I added some down the nose section to the motor, its' the first place my first F22 broke so I figure it probably needs it, and I also added pieces to the inside. I'd love to paint it but seeing as I pretty much wreck them paint is pretty low priority right now.

photo 2.JPG photo 3.JPG photo 4.JPG photo 1.JPG
 
#2
Keeping the power up will increase control authority, given the control surfaces are in the prop wash. The recommended throws were probably figured for this affect.

Jeff
 

Bolvon72

Senior Member
Mentor
#3
That is the weak spot of the airframe. Good news is it glues back quick and holds strong. I thought about running some carbon fiber strips along the inside at these points but, like the Viggen, I treat it as a break away point to protect the rest of the structure.
 
#4
I also switched from an 8x4 APC style prop to a 8x4.3 slow flow so hopefully the additional thrust will help at the slower speeds. I'm headed back out sunday with the F22, Spitfire (maiden), the FT Delta, and a newly built bloody wonder (maiden) and possibly a versa wing. My other brother is visiting from out of town and bringing a couple extra Transmitters so we have enough to get 3 planes in the air, though it is unlikely any of us are skilled enough to keep 3 planes in the air simultaneously LOL. Hopefully the weather plays nice.

This will also be the first time I'll have actual time to fly usually I try to squeeze in a battery's worth of air time before or after playing with my kids at the park, I usually feel rushed or like i'm being waited on. Sunday is just us 3 bros going to fly(crash) planes. should be a blast!

-Jes
 
#5
Josh bicker is right, if you wait you'll never fly, but then again, you do have to know your limitations. I'd try to keep the wind below 6 mph, that's a completely random guess as I've never flown the plane, but it's a pretty safe number.

It's hard when your just starting out, getting used to trying to control the plane, learning to fly, and the wind doesn't help you.

I'd recommend waiting until your comfortable flying it when it's calm, then progressively trying it in higher winds until you can't handle it any more.

Sorry to hear you crashed, I'm sure you'll fix'er up and get her back in the air.
 
#6
Josh bicker is right, if you wait you'll never fly, but then again, you do have to know your limitations. I'd try to keep the wind below 6 mph, that's a completely random guess as I've never flown the plane, but it's a pretty safe number.

It's hard when your just starting out, getting used to trying to control the plane, learning to fly, and the wind doesn't help you.

I'd recommend waiting until your comfortable flying it when it's calm, then progressively trying it in higher winds until you can't handle it any more.

Sorry to hear you crashed, I'm sure you'll fix'er up and get her back in the air.

the wind has certainly been my evil nemesis. I would consider 6mph optimal conditions about now. It seems there are more windy days than not here. I've been making my best attempts at probably 10-12 sadly. I get the plane off the ground and like I said I had that F22 dialed in from the get go it launched like a dream and required Zero trimming. (pure luck) I am able to fly in to the wind and turn but I have the hardest time turning back in to the wind I think it's just a power issue, my ground speed increases but my air speed is probably decreased. I just need to suck it up and go fast and go home. Tomorrow is the day!! I'll get my disaster on video and post it here for any feed back.

-Jes
 

xuzme720

Dedicated foam bender
Mentor
#7
If possible, flying back and forth across the wind can be better as you can turn into the wind on every reversal, sort of like a slope soaring pattern.
Slope_Pic2_.gif
 
#9
Nice tip! I have flow that pattern with my Speedster in 6 to 8 mph wind an enjoyed my flight!
Good idea! I was actually watching the Versa Sloap soarer video and thought to myself if this guy can fly in 10m-12ph winds and turn in with no power than I should be able to fly like that no problem...

It's nice to see some people with experience suggesting the same thing. Looks like 13-14 +/- winds tomorrow. I'll probably go try anyway cause my brother is in town, but I'm thinking of going wth a bloody wonder instead of the F22. Rumor has it it does better in the wind. all that and I'm ok with crashing my $2 planes all day long (though someday I'd like to not crash for a day or two)

-Jes