FTFC20 Howard DGA-6 (Racing) designed by Mayan

CarolineTyler

Legendary member
Finished editing the video from the maiden of the DGA-6 V2 and it's long but I'd appreciate if you watch it through and tell me what you think of the plane's handling, I completed the rest of the checks that I didn't manage to last time :).


I still need to write the post with all the build pictures that I promised just really debating if not to wait for V3 and do it let just say with a plan :). What you'll think?
Great stuff Mayan, I just love seeing how much your flying skills have come on.
The plane looked good in the air.
I made a suggestion on the video :)
 

mayan

Legendary member
Great stuff Mayan, I just love seeing how much your flying skills have come on.
The plane looked good in the air.
I made a suggestion on the video :)
The under camber wing helped a lot :) thank you! I less like the look of it but a good flying plane doesn’t have to be pretty it needs to fly. Have any ideas how to give more roll abilities?
 

CarolineTyler

Legendary member
The under camber wing helped a lot :) thank you! I less like the look of it but a good flying plane doesn’t have to be pretty it needs to fly. Have any ideas how to give more roll abilities?
Roll is going to be a bit lacklustre due to the high wing, make the ailerons a bit deeper and maybe a little bit longer.
The current surfaces are not in the airflow from the propeller so will be less effective at lower speeds, unlike your elevator. I was surprised that the rudder was not stronger.
 

mayan

Legendary member
Roll is going to be a bit lacklustre due to the high wing, make the ailerons a bit deeper and maybe a little bit longer.
The current surfaces are not in the airflow from the propeller so will be less effective at lower speeds, unlike your elevator. I was surprised that the rudder was not stronger.
Thanks for the tip. I too was surprised but think it’s because it’s small. I would prop up to a 12in but not sure any of the FT power packs can handle that prop. The reason why I think it needs a 12in prop is because I saw a model only that was about the size of mine and it used a 12in prop.
 

CarolineTyler

Legendary member
Thanks for the tip. I too was surprised but think it’s because it’s small. I would prop up to a 12in but not sure any of the FT power packs can handle that prop. The reason why I think it needs a 12in prop is because I saw a model only that was about the size of mine and it used a 12in prop.
General rule is bigger prop, lower kv. Always check the motor specs. That's why I would not buy a Flitetest motor, they don't publish good specs so knowing what prop it will comfortably spin is difficult to know.
 

Vimana89

Legendary member
Roll is going to be a bit lacklustre due to the high wing, make the ailerons a bit deeper and maybe a little bit longer.
The current surfaces are not in the airflow from the propeller so will be less effective at lower speeds, unlike your elevator. I was surprised that the rudder was not stronger.
Good call. Exactly what I saw and mentioned with version one. Wasn't completely sure how accurate I was but yeah that's definitely a part of it. @mayan , your design is inherently very stable, and you have no prop wash on your ailerons. They should definitely be a bit bigger both in length and thickness. You did mention increasing their size in the video, so you've already came to the same conclusion too. Other than that, Like you said yourself, you might want a motor and prop combo with a bit more power. This was intended to be racing plane, so the handling will improve with a little more thrust and speed capability. More speed will increase the airflow over your ailerons, and you will find that your plane will be less prone to stalls and turn easier and smoother, not to mention sharper, at higher speeds. Basically, you are on the right track with your assessments in the video and your solutions are good. Make the ailerons bigger, use a stronger powerplant, and there should be a big difference.
 

mayan

Legendary member
Good call. Exactly what I saw and mentioned with version one. Wasn't completely sure how accurate I was but yeah that's definitely a part of it. @mayan , your design is inherently very stable, and you have no prop wash on your ailerons. They should definitely be a bit bigger both in length and thickness. You did mention increasing their size in the video, so you've already came to the same conclusion too. Other than that, Like you said yourself, you might want a motor and prop combo with a bit more power. This was intended to be racing plane, so the handling will improve with a little more thrust and speed capability. More speed will increase the airflow over your ailerons, and you will find that your plane will be less prone to stalls and turn easier and smoother, not to mention sharper, at higher speeds. Basically, you are on the right track with your assessments in the video and your solutions are good. Make the ailerons bigger, use a stronger powerplant, and there should be a big difference.
Thanks for the encouragement buddy :).
 

Vimana89

Legendary member
Thanks for the encouragement buddy :).
I'm stunned at how beautiful that plane is every time you put it in the air. I could already tell your skills were very solid from your other builds and mods to FT builds, you have much more experience in air foils and straight wing designs than I do, but even so, this one was a majorly ambitious choice that has pushed your skills to the max. The design of how to make it in FB was all you, nothing was thought out for you, and everything was fully custom and scratch. You blended folds and molds beautifully. This plane's lines are not easy to replicate on any appreciably scale looking level. The build and design quality is evident just but looking at it.

It flies, and is controllable. That it still has some slight deficiencies that need polishing up is totally to be expected, but I think you've got a good game plan on how to do it now. Can't wait to see you bring out the full potential of this build!
 

buzzbomb

I know nothing!
Finished editing the video from the maiden of the DGA-6 V2 and it's long but I'd appreciate if you watch it through and tell me what you think of the plane's handling, I completed the rest of the checks that I didn't manage to last time :).


I still need to write the post with all the build pictures that I promised just really debating if not to wait for V3 and do it let just say with a plan :). What you'll think?
"So long as I can fly this baby bird, I'm going to fly this baby bird all day long." You know we love you man! :)

You've already gotten better advice on your build than I could provide. So I'm going to provide some nonsense!

Did you notice the cloud in the background was working a controller just like you were?

cloud1.jpg

I don't know what happened, but his mind got blown! :p

cloud2.jpg

In my opinion, since this build is for a reason, and you are already envisioning a V3, I would do your build pics with the version that you think is going to be final. Just my two cents. And a great video! Thank you. :)

Oh, and get some darn sleep!
 

Vimana89

Legendary member
I like to see all your build pics, even the prototypes, but yeah, you should maybe make a distinction like make an official build guide using the pics of the final version. Cloud man's mind got blown when he realized what kind of potential Mayan's plane will have with a couple small tweaks:LOL:!
 
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jfaleo1

Junior Member
Well first it looks great to me, you should be proud.
The launch issue looks like torque. So a little more horizontal toss with a bit less throttle, or put on the gear and problem solved by ROG takeoff.
Last you speak fine and you’re flying fine too.
Well done
 

mayan

Legendary member
I'm stunned at how beautiful that plane is every time you put it in the air. I could already tell your skills were very solid from your other builds and mods to FT builds, you have much more experience in air foils and straight wing designs than I do, but even so, this one was a majorly ambitious choice that has pushed your skills to the max. The design of how to make it in FB was all you, nothing was thought out for you, and everything was fully custom and scratch. You blended folds and molds beautifully. This plane's lines are not easy to replicate on any appreciably scale looking level. The build and design quality is evident just but looking at it.

It flies, and is controllable. That it still has some slight deficiencies that need polishing up is totally to be expected, but I think you've got a good game plan on how to do it now. Can't wait to see you bring out the full potential of this build!
Thanks for the kind words.

"So long as I can fly this baby bird, I'm going to fly this baby bird all day long." You know we love you man! :)

You've already gotten better advice on your build than I could provide. So I'm going to provide some nonsense!

Did you notice the cloud in the background was working a controller just like you were?

View attachment 144473

I don't know what happened, but his mind got blown! :p

View attachment 144474

In my opinion, since this build is for a reason, and you are already envisioning a V3, I would do your build pics with the version that you think is going to be final. Just my two cents. And a great video! Thank you. :)

Oh, and get some darn sleep!
LOL thanks for the head cleaner :). Yeah V3 will hopefully be a final version but its all a matter of testing and finding out. I think that one needs at least 2-3 times out with a plane to get a feel for it, so all goes well tomorrow I'll be taking it out again this time with landing gear. I think I might leave the build pictures for V3 once I am sure things line up like I want and I also want to make sure I know what order is best to build the plane in, because some things will make it harder to fit others later.

I like to see all your build pics, even the prototypes, but yeah, you should maybe make a distinction like make an official build guide using the pics of the final version. Cloud man's mind got blown when he realized what kid of potential Mayan's plane will have with a couple small tweaks:LOL:!
LOL. You know what reading your post I actually will post the progress pictures too maybe just not make that much of a detailed post out of it.
 

mayan

Legendary member
Well first it looks great to me, you should be proud.
The launch issue looks like torque. So a little more horizontal toss with a bit less throttle, or put on the gear and problem solved by ROG takeoff.
Last you speak fine and you’re flying fine too.
Well done
Thanks felt not connected to my thoughts that day :). Will add the landing gear for my next outing.

Yep. You're getting too serious. Don't forget, it's all supposed to be fun! :love:
But, but, but this plane is of serious matter :p.
 

mayan

Legendary member
Flew V2 again today, and understood why the control surfaces didn't seem to have enough authority. I had them dialed in with 70% deflection rates, changing that made the plane handle way better. I didn't redo the tests I did the other time and also didn't try out the master series styled wing because I just enjoy flying the plane that I don't want to risk a break at this point, at some point I will and then try that wing set. I also had a motor issue so need to check what's the issue and solve it ASAP. If all goes well tomorrow I'll take it out again I really want more flight time on it to figure out what I like what not and then figure out how to make it fly exactly like I want it too. Video of today's outing will be posted later once I get around to edit the footage :).
 

mayan

Legendary member
Sorry it has been a while since I got to post something here but I have been busy with some flying and building of other models too. I have a lot to share in general and also some new stuff here but first; @Vimana89 requested that I post all the pictures of the build process even those of the prototypes. So following his request here is a post dedicated to the build process of V2 with pictures of what I have. I'll also try to write a short explaination of what I did but not why I did things a certain way. If anyone wants to know why I did somethig a certain way over others just ask, might even help me get more ideas for better building.

OK let's start.

First thing I tend to build on any model is the wings and so I did with this one as well. I started off with the master series type wing, first laying out all the pieces, then I cleared the cavities and removed the paper from where it was needed. I folded the spars (built two wasn't sure which I'll use), one used a A based fold box spar, the other was using a C fold spar; I eventually used the box based spar. I molded the the top side of the wings like in the masters series to get the FB to curve in a way that will later allow to create an airfoil when press againist the spar. Next I took the bottom havles of the wing and duck taped them together after which I applied glue to glue them together like in a lot of FT models. I glued the spar into place based on the markings that I had, and was ready to glue on the top cover of the wing. I glued one side at a time following this order, first glue the leading edge till about 5cm from the wing tip, then glue the wing tip, then the trailing edge. to make things line up correctly on the ailerons what I do is push the aileron down and using that to line up before applying glue I then applu glue with the wing being close to the edge of the table so that the aileron can keep being push down and help in keeping things lined up. Did the same on both wing sides and then put a line of hot glue on the top wing joint and smeared it in using a scrap piece of foam, once dry I covered with duck tape like in other models for extra strength. I am not happy with the the angle on the linkages to the control surfaces here need to work on them.

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Next thing I did was build the second wing set for the V2 it is different from the master series wing because it has and undercamber on the trailing edge of the wing as well as the wing tips. First thing to do was again to lay out the parts and prepare them once that was done I could start building. This wing set is not built in four peices but rather two, and has a fold over wing sytle like in a lot of FT designs including the one I RIPED it from the Spitfire. Firs thing I did here was mold the top part of the wing into shape using the master series tecnique exactly like in the other wing that I had created. I did each side seprately and then proceeded to duck tape them together, on the next version I'll try taping and gluing them together before modelinh them into shape. After I connected the two halves this time including the top cover fold over part I added the spar gluing it on the guide marks (the spar that I didn't use on the other set of wings). Like in the FT Spitfire I add a piece of foam to thw trailing edge to make a better airfoil. It was now time to fold over the wing and glue it in shape I applied glue on the leading edge the spar and folded over holding it in place like in the TT for a good 1.5 mins. Once it was dry I applied a small bead of glue on the trailing edge and held that in place until it dried about another 1.5 mins. That's it the other set of wings was done.

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After building both wings I started building the fuselage. This part might seem complicated but I promise you most of it is quite simple. Only a tiny bit of it is actually hard and that part is the front nose section and the canopy window. Again prepared the pieces and started building. First I built main part of the fuselage, folding up the side in a B fold manner, that gives up a sort of boat looking piece. Part of this boat like looking piece is actually the bed on which the wings sit and is indented down by 1 cm the height of the wing core. So next thing to do is connect the back top cover for the rear part of the fuselage (the tail boom), but before you can glue that in place you need to connect the the first back wing supporter on the bottom side of the cover the side that would go into the two side cheeks of the piece we've just created; once that is done glue into place.

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Next we create the wing bed, it has two wing supporters one for the front and one for the back; this makes a total of two wing supporters on the back. Though we don't glue the front wing supporter to this piece yet, because that will make it hard to apply preasure to the wing bed when gluing it to the fuselage piece that we already have ready. Once we glued the back supporter to the wing bed piece and glued that to the fuselage we can glue the front wing supporter piece into place. Now it's time to add a down preasure wing supporter and for this we have a weird triangle piece, it used to be a small U like shaped piece but I changed it adding the triangle part to also help support the bend and twist of the front nose section.

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Once that was glued into place I fliped the fuselage over and started opening up the former slots from any foam that might have been left inside, including those of the vertical/horizontal stablizers. Next I glued together the rudder and elevator pieces that have a tab/slot configration allowing for simple alignment. Once the glue dried I pushed the piece I just created into the slots on the fuselage until then end checked for 90 degree alignment and glued into place with a smal bead of glue on the top and bottom just to secure it in place, as the tension is pretty strong any how already.

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Now it was time to work on the nose section of the fuselage + the canopy window, which is by far the most complicated part of the build. The first thing I did was prepare the front fuselage former which is also the base on which the power pod later rests upon. In V1 this was one single layer of foam but for V2 I doubled it up so that it can take more of a beating. This former connects to the fuselage lining up on tabs and since the former was doubled, the tabs were longer too so I re-enforced them with a short 3 cm piece of a popsticle stick. I then removed the paper from the sides of the fuselage front and started massaging them with my thumbs to easy them up and allow them to mold and twist into place. Once they felt soft I glued the former and then added another drop of glue to the former and glued the side down to the former too.

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From here on I pretty much stopped taking pictures properly so unfortunatly I'll stop here and continue with the build description when I build the next version and make sure to take even more pictures or maybe just maybe I'll do a build video.

I have more to update about this project but will save that for a different post later today after I finish editing some flight videos of this model.
 

bracesport

Legendary member
@mayan - I just caught up on the V2 flight with the undercambered wing - certainly flew a lot nicer than the V1 - I agree with Caroline about the aileron size, they do look quite 'dinky in the build - I have never thought of this design as a speedster - you have really pulled out the stops on this though! :D

maybe for your master style wing, you could increase the chord depth a tad (more surface area to reduce the wing loading).
 

mayan

Legendary member
Alright folks so V2 has been flying for a while now and I love it! So far the weight of the bird using the under-cambered wing design is 455g, excluding the battery. So far V2 of this model has been tested with two different power setups. Setup 1 is using a B pack motor, 10x5 prop and a 20A ESC makes a nice slow flyer, needs more run way to take off/land and can't do any special manuvers but flies nice and steady. Setup 2 is using a C pack motor, 9x4.7 prop, and a 20A ESC this setup turns the bird into a speedier aircraft, allowing short take off/landings and has better handling in the sky to do manuvers. Both setups are fun and both can be flown in wind ranging between 0-18km/h which is what I was able to test fly the plane in. So far I have been able to balance the plane perfectly with 3S batteries ranging from 1000mah - 2200mah, but I believe that this plane can handle big batteries. Maybe on of my next test will be to parallel two 2200mah batteries see what flight time I can make out of it. Do to the large space inside allowing for big batteries to go in I think it can be used for awesome long distance FPV.

Any how here is a short video I made of the last time I took it out, enjoy.

I think I might release so beta plans soon so others can attempt to build it and comment the build process prior the end date of the challenge that way I can address any problems others might encounter before the challenge is over :).