Hughes H-1 w/ Racing Wings

[JohnRambozo]

I could use a bit of advice with the wings. I made a shortened FT spar but the ends of the wing don't close naturally. Is it better to taper the spar toward the end or tighten the bend of the airfoil?

**Updated first post with plans including forms. Wings left out until spar situation resolved.

Thanks in advance.

 

[jayz 84]

Now did you set it on a flat surface. With the bottom on a flat surface fold the airfoil over and just let the trail edge of the wing touch the surface your lying the wing on. Check and see if you have a gap between the two if so you need that spacer just like the spit has. You dont wanna tapper that spar and end up with your trailing edge lower then your bottom wing surface. Cause then youll be getting a flap effect. Not saying you havent done this yet just going by what i see..

 

[JohnRambozo]

Now did you set it on a flat surface. With the bottom on a flat surface fold the airfoil over and just let the trail edge of the wing touch the surface your lying the wing on. Check and see if you have a gap between the two if so you need that spacer just like the spit has. You dont wanna tapper that spar and end up with your trailing edge lower then your bottom wing surface. Cause then youll be getting a flap effect. Not saying you havent done this yet just going by what i see..

I did try that first. I just took a picture like that so you could see the spar is touching the top and bottom of the wing forcing that big gap. I can force it down to make it touch. I'm just wondering if I should. I think the spacer like the spitfire is going to be the best compromise. It forces the aileron up a bit if I press it flat against the table and takes quite a bit of pressure to do so. I'll go with the spacer. Thanks, jayz.

I was just worried about too much tension warping one wing or the other inconsistently.

 

[jayz 84]

Ya it sounds like the spacer is the best bet. You dont want the aileron pushing up like that when its on a flat surface. Thats showing you the trailing edge is falling below the bottom wing surface. You just want that trailing egde just touching then fill your gap. If you end up forcing to much to bond the two together then youll end up worrying about separation on hot days or over time

 

[nerdnic]

The issue is the bottom part of the wing is too narrow. You'll need to either taper the spar or add a spacer like FT does.

Edit: oops looks like you already decided to add the spacer.

 

[JohnRambozo]

The issue is the bottom part of the wing is too narrow. You'll need to either taper the spar or add a spacer like FT does.

Edit: oops looks like you already decided to add the spacer.

Thanks nerdnic and jayz. I figured one or the other would need to be done. Any thoughts on which one produces a better result?

 

[nerdnic]

I like the taper. Wings generally get gradually thinner as you approach the tips. I think the spacer produces more drag and a potentially slower flying bird. So each can be good depending on what you're going for.

 

[JohnRambozo]

I like the taper. Wings generally get gradually thinner as you approach the tips. I think the spacer produces more drag and a potentially slower flying bird. So each can be good depending on what you're going for.

Thanks again. That's what I was just thinking, too. The thinner tip would also tend toward more responsive control surfaces. This one is meant for speed, so taper it is.

 

[JohnRambozo]

Updated first post with build / progress pics. I'll add descriptions soon.

 

[jayz 84]

Its looking really good johnrambozo. Kinda like the flat bottom idea wish i woulda tried that on my build. I got stuck on my aft former just before my horizontal stablizer the sub fuse is larger then my former might have to alter it. But you are coming along nicely great job

 

[Robin]

Good work!

 

[JohnRambozo]

Its looking really good johnrambozo. Kinda like the flat bottom idea wish i woulda tried that on my build. I got stuck on my aft former just before my horizontal stablizer the sub fuse is larger then my former might have to alter it. But you are coming along nicely great job

Good work!

Thanks jayz and Robin.

jayz, are you updating a build log where I can see your work in progress? I'm going the 'full disclosure' route with mine so everyone can see the obstacles, my mistakes and how I move past them, for better or worse. My first fuse was a total distaster, but I had to go through the process of designing it, cutting it then gluing it together to find out where the inadequacies were.

I had to simplify the nose and make an easy way to mount the wings. Those were my goals in the redesign but other things came out of it - A better tail section and a better way to manage the tail connections to the fuse, including the way the V. Stab mounts to the rear of the last former. I'm really loving the process. Thanks again for the encouragement.

If you have time to share your build, I'd enjoy seeing it.

 

[jayz 84]

I havent gone far with pic by pic of each peace on my build. Just two so far one with the sub fuse and the other with the horizontal and vertical stab glued in place. I kinda get lost in my builds and forget pictures ill start a thred on it i guess later today

 

[JohnRambozo]

I havent gone far with pic by pic of each peace on my build. Just two so far one with the sub fuse and the other with the horizontal and vertical stab glued in place. I kinda get lost in my builds and forget pictures ill start a thred on it i guess later today

Its up to you. If you're more focused on designing/building and don't like to stop for documentation, that's certainly your choice.

 

[jayz 84]

Ill take another look at my build and scratch my head and see if i want to change my sub fuselage to make it properly fit the former or just alter the tail taking out the aft former. Then ill start a thred and go from there some input never hurts. Its all about learning new techniques

 

[Robin]

I´m really looking forward on how you´ll cover the fuse. Until now I really appreciate your building technique and hope to learn from your work.

As of now I never constructed a plane from a three point view. If you could go in detail on how to design the single sheets for the "skin" (I assume you don´t cover it in whole, but cylinder per cylinder) it´ll help me a lot for further designs of my own!

 

[jayz 84]

Robin really i dont see what you need to learn after building that beautiful Gee Bee. But you never know everyone has different ideas to learn from. And with these planes theres just no way to build it with a single sheet for the skin. You could but its still gonna have cut lines in it for shaping

 

[Robin]

Thanks jayz 84, but as I said, I never built a plane from a three point view. What I did was using a papercraft plan, scaling it up and bending depron instead of paper. You only need patience, but you don´t have to "invent" the design.

Designing (a scale build) from scratch is - for me - something I´ve never done before. So I keep on watching & learning ;-)

 

[jayz 84]

Well you did a great job robbin. Im building my rare bear from a set of three view plans. I have yet to find rare bear plans so i had to look for plans on a f8f bearcat to modify. Which i found a great set of balsa plans to work off of to modify into a swappable. That pretty much how were doing it. I believe johnrambozo is doing his in posterboard for his skin which looks good but i cant deside if i wanna go that way or foam board with paper off the inside. To make it really strong to handle the 100mph speeds and heavy belly landings. Have to do testing i guess first.

 

[Robin]

I believe johnrambozo is doing his in posterboard for his skin which looks good but i cant deside if i wanna go that way or foam board with paper off the inside. To make it really strong to handle the 100mph speeds and heavy belly landings. Have to do testing i guess first.

Don´t want to get to OT in john´s thread, but on hardening foam I really recommend laminating it with polyurethane paint and tissue (washi paper works best, but butcher paper will do also). For posterboard it would harden the paper as well. Give it a try, you won´t regret it. Have a look at your next home depot for paint for hardening wood floors or stairs, water based. As a nice side-effect you´ll get a very smooth surface after sanding.