Hughes P21-J MKIII Devastator - Swappable

[dutch student]

well... about funky flying:
the original airfoil is very thin
in my resized version it should be thinner than the 6mm depron available.
your wings seem very thick, compared to the scale of the plane

then, a biplane always interacts between both wings. the closer the wings are together, the more they interact. negativly.
because youre wing is quite thick, i believe you should take te upper wing more up.. or make the wing thinner.
less interaction. way less drag.

next thing, it looks like your upper and lower control surfaces arent moving equally
this also could create weird behavior

as for incidences, my wings are at 0 degrees. so is my canard.
my canard should be at 3 degrees, so it can stall before the main wing does
in my case, the plane stays stable, until it isnt ;-)
comes almost straight down.
but, the engine pulls 1 kg and more, plane is 550 grams AUW, so no problemo.

pics... i have got 1, not online ;-)
this thing hasn't seen the camera a lot..
to afraid to jinx the thing with a lot of photo's..
i will look. but it looks like youre first version, minus the landing gear

 

[localfiend]

well... about funky flying:
the original airfoil is very thin
in my resized version it should be thinner than the 6mm depron available.
your wings seem very thick, compared to the scale of the plane

then, a biplane always interacts between both wings. the closer the wings are together, the more they interact. negativly.
because youre wing is quite thick, i believe you should take te upper wing more up.. or make the wing thinner.
less interaction. way less drag.

next thing, it looks like your upper and lower control surfaces arent moving equally
this also could create weird behavior

as for incidences, my wings are at 0 degrees. so is my canard.
my canard should be at 3 degrees, so it can stall before the main wing does
in my case, the plane stays stable, until it isnt ;-)
comes almost straight down.
but, the engine pulls 1 kg and more, plane is 550 grams AUW, so no problemo.

pics... i have got 1, not online ;-)
this thing hasn't seen the camera a lot..
to afraid to jinx the thing with a lot of photo's..
i will look. but it looks like youre first version, minus the landing gear

Wings are much thinner in comparison to the overall plane in my larger version. I'm trying to keep most stuff to scale, so the distance between wings is scale as well, as that's an important part of the look. I've also worked out the uneven control surface movements. Guess I'll just have to see what happens.

Wings are at 0 incidence, and I have 0 degrees on the canard as well. If that's an issue I may add a few degrees to the canard.

Photo's don't jinx a plane, they just steal it's soul, which saves a few grams. Win Win!

 

[dutch student]

first photo here, lets see if it works ;-)
no paint. wing has 25 gram glas fiber, the black is carbon. stuff laying around here, so why don't use it..
both sides of the wing have this. crazy strong..

about the surfaces and scale, i used this schematics
https://www.google.nl/search?q=crim...UIBygB&biw=1280&bih=800#imgrc=nCG7TiQClueUiM:

other one is here to find
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/scr...hes-p21-j-mkiii-devastator-crimson-skies.html

not really clear on the matter of control surface in the lower wing..
but:
https://www.google.nl/search?q=crim...UIBygB&biw=1280&bih=800#imgrc=wxrHxNaaq1V4EM:

i believe it has 2 big surfaces in the upper wing, inward. officially this would be working with the canard on the elevator
and 2 aileron surfaces in the lower wing, only for roll.
and the canard offcourse

on this moment i only use the big surface in the upper wing, for aileron and elevator. only when the cg is placed i bit forward, the wing control almost stop working. no authority
placed cg a bit backwarts, and suddenly it started to work ;-)


the degrees on the canard isnt for better flying, its for safe stalling..
when the main wing stalls, and the canard isnt, the plane falls out of the skies backwarts. very dangerously, hard to fly out.
by making the canard stall first, it makes sure the nose of the plane goes down, so making speed after the stall.
good thing
in my case, the plane is hard to stall.. but when it does, it's a bit funky. main wings and canard stall at the same moment, it seems..
no problem at this point. enough power availeble.

 

[localfiend]

Cool man, looks good. Is the carbon just sheets that have been laminated on? Not a technique I've seen before.

about the surfaces and scale, i used this schematics
https://www.google.nl/search?q=crim...UIBygB&biw=1280&bih=800#imgrc=nCG7TiQClueUiM:

other one is here to find
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/scr...hes-p21-j-mkiii-devastator-crimson-skies.html

not really clear on the matter of control surface in the lower wing..
but:
https://www.google.nl/search?q=crim...UIBygB&biw=1280&bih=800#imgrc=wxrHxNaaq1V4EM:

In the original game it looks like all 4 control surfaces on the wings act as ailerons. But, that doesn't mean much in the real world.

i believe it has 2 big surfaces in the upper wing, inward. officially this would be working with the canard on the elevator
and 2 aileron surfaces in the lower wing, only for roll.
and the canard offcourse

That would be interesting. Lower wing for roll with upper wing assisting the Canard.

the degrees on the canard isnt for better flying, its for safe stalling..
when the main wing stalls, and the canard isnt, the plane falls out of the skies backwarts. very dangerously, hard to fly out.
by making the canard stall first, it makes sure the nose of the plane goes down, so making speed after the stall.
good thing
in my case, the plane is hard to stall.. but when it does, it's a bit funky. main wings and canard stall at the same moment, it seems..
no problem at this point. enough power availeble.

Yeah, that's what I was getting at. Didn't seem to be an issue when landing on the prototype, with canard incidence at zero, but it's still something to think about. I'd imagine that incidence might have a lot more effect on larger planes, where the canard might actually be able to provide some lift. At this size, I'd imagine the canard doesn't do much and as such stalls first anyway.

 

[localfiend]

 

[dutch student]

well... incidence..
when everytthing is zero, you still need an angle of attack. so the plane will be leaning a tad backwarts.
else youre main wing isnt providing lift

so youre canard also will have the same angle of attack.
and also provide some lift.

it works.. check youre cg..
mine is located exactly at the front of the lower wing.
a flying wing wil have the cg at 1/3 of the chord. this plane likes the cg at the front of its wing.
only possible if the canard is doing something.

same situation in a normal plane. in those things the tail also provides some lift.
normally it isnt calculated. but it does..
canard is the same.


today we have had some good weather here.
flown the thing. beatifull!
only the last landing it snapt the canard off.
added some wire, lifting the nose 3 cm of the ground. hopefully it doesnt hit the ground with the same enthousiasme
keeping the canards on the plane ;-)

 

[doc_mat]

Keeping an eye on this! Can't wait to see a Peacemaker! lol

 

[JasonEricAnderson]

I love this design. I've also been (slowly) designing graphic wraps for some designs and I'd wondered how they would work out. It looks like they are no problem at all. Great work.

 

[localfiend]

Keeping an eye on this! Can't wait to see a Peacemaker! lol

Heh, a Peacemaker would probably be an easy one to make fly. Might consider it further on down the line. Should be finishing up the current Devastator prototype within a couple days. If I have time, maybe tonight.

I love this design. I've also been (slowly) designing graphic wraps for some designs and I'd wondered how they would work out. It looks like they are no problem at all. Great work.

Yeah, skinning stuff works great. Take a look at this thread:

http://forum.flitetest.com/showthread.php?21550-Decal-Plans-Everybody-Join-In

Works even better if an actual artist does the drawings rather than my more feeble attempts:

http://forum.flitetest.com/showthread.php?23721-FT-Mini-Mustang-Paper-Replacement-Kit

 

[Geezah]

Looking good! I love the game and hate the fact that MS hasn't brought out a high res version and story for modern computers.
I hope this one works as well as your PBY.

 

[localfiend]

Looking good! I love the game and hate the fact that MS hasn't brought out a high res version and story for modern computers.
I hope this one works as well as your PBY.

Me too. I think they ran into licensing issues. Don't know who owns what now. Should hopefully know how the new prototype works this weekend.

 

[localfiend]

I've been really slacking on this. Stepped on my prototype, which needed fixing, then got distracted by other planes per SOP.

However, It's all ready for flight testing now.

Canard now has much larger control surfaces and a semi symmetrical airfoil, mostly for strength. Ailerons on the lower wing have been moved out to their proper location.

Getting ready to go fly, and I have several odd mixes to try out. I've programmed the upper wing to behave differently that the lower on some settings.

If test flights are successful I'll attach the cowl and canopy then get plans ready for a beta release.

 

[localfiend]

Maiden went extremely well aside from having short landing gear. All the flight characteristic issues are gone. It's nice and stable, can fly slow, inverted, loops, rolls whatever. Gonna cut in rudders next to see what happens.

 

[bstanley72]

So, just stumbled in here. Any update? This would look wicked cool flying at my club field (hint) (hint)

 

[localfiend]

So, just stumbled in here. Any update? This would look wicked cool flying at my club field (hint) (hint)

I'm off to FliteFest this week, and have what I hope is a workable skinned version to build while I'm there. I'll post up plans when I get back assuming all goes well.

 

[champton]

This plane is awesome.

Looking forward to the plans once you have the rudder done and the plans created!!!

CH

 

[NTTD]

Just ran across this thread, that plane tracks BEAUTIFULLY! Wow, just wow.

I just love that this came from fiction to flight. Keep up the good work!

 

[PsyBorg]

After seeing this you really need to do a Klingon Bird of Prey. This concept and design would transfer nicely I think. Over all another killer Localfiend design. Still love to hear you giggle when you do things in your videos. I crack up all the time as you sound just like an online gamer friend of mine I have played with for years.

 

[Michael9865]

Looking back at the last picture of the first post, I thought man someone with more skill than I should build one of these and put the counter rotating setup that Willsonman designed for his Bugatti on the back of it. That would be EPIC!

 

[PsyBorg]

That would be insane!!! I would hazard a guess as soon as the throttle was punched that dual motor setup would push its way thru the fuselage and out the nose and not even have the rest of the plane leave the spot where it was done. I sooo can't wait to see that thing take off.