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I need help choosing between buying one of two planes

#1
Hello!

I started in this hobby a month or so ago. I initially bought the F949 Cessna 182 by WLToys, and I'e had a lot of fun with it. I think it is time to get a new, bigger aircraft. The problem is, though, that I don't know if I should choose the Apprentice S15e, or the Super Cub SAFE RTF. Both of them have SAFE, but the Apprentice is a little more expensive. '
Which one should I choose? Which one is the best for a relatively new pilot?
Both of them include a Spektrum DX4e.

Thanks,
Nikofant
 

HawkMan

Senior Member
#2
The Sport Cub SAFE is just 600mm, so I would reccomend the Apprentice if you want something to fly outside in heavier weather.
Be warned though, that even if it's bigger, these light foam birds can be a handfull in the wind and aren't "fun" to fly when it's a bit windy, not even heavy wind, 2-4ms is enough to take the fun away, more than that and it becomes a real challenge.

if you want to fly in ~4ms winds and slightly higher, you might consider a motor glider of the warm/hotline variety. these despite being light handle wind exceptionally well.
 
#3
The Sport Cub SAFE is just 600mm, so I would reccomend the Apprentice if you want something to fly outside in heavier weather.
Be warned though, that even if it's bigger, these light foam birds can be a handfull in the wind and aren't "fun" to fly when it's a bit windy, not even heavy wind, 2-4ms is enough to take the fun away, more than that and it becomes a real challenge.

if you want to fly in ~4ms winds and slightly higher, you might consider a motor glider of the warm/hotline variety. these despite being light handle wind exceptionally well.
Hi, HawkMan! Thanks for the answer.

I'll be sure to take that into consideration. It's just that my preferred online store only has 5 planes and a simulator.
Apprentice S 15e, Cessna 182 (my current, which weighs 58 grams. Its wingspan is 505 mm), the Super Cub, the Duet RTF, and the Firebird Delta Ray. Then there's the Phoenix sim.

I'm leaning more towards the Apprentice S 15e, and I may look in other online stores as well. (They need to be able to ship to Denmark, like HobbyKing.)

Thanks,
Nikofant
 

HawkMan

Senior Member
#6
Hi, HawkMan! Thanks for the answer.

I'll be sure to take that into consideration. It's just that my preferred online store only has 5 planes and a simulator.
Apprentice S 15e, Cessna 182 (my current, which weighs 58 grams. Its wingspan is 505 mm), the Super Cub, the Duet RTF, and the Firebird Delta Ray. Then there's the Phoenix sim.

I'm leaning more towards the Apprentice S 15e, and I may look in other online stores as well. (They need to be able to ship to Denmark, like HobbyKing.)

Thanks,
Nikofant
What sort of flying do you prefer though ? motors sailors should work great down there in Denmark, with all that flatness and all :p and you probably get a lot better shipping prices from HK europe than I do up here in Norway, and no need to worry about the damn VAT as you're in EU.
 
#7
What sort of flying do you prefer though ? motors sailors should work great down there in Denmark, with all that flatness and all :p and you probably get a lot better shipping prices from HK europe than I do up here in Norway, and no need to worry about the damn VAT as you're in EU.
Hi HawkMan.

I'm still a beginner, I've only flown one plane. :)
I'm actually a bit resillient about ordering anything from HobbyKing, since almost every review I've read has been 1/5.
Denmark is very flat, yes.
I'm thinking about getting the Apprentice, since it has the most availability regarding spare parts and support.
Also, I have an old 3D foamie which I just need the electronics for, and that will be my 3rd plane, I guess.

Thanks everyone for the answer!
Nikofant
 

HawkMan

Senior Member
#8
Hi HawkMan.

I'm still a beginner, I've only flown one plane. :)
I'm actually a bit resillient about ordering anything from HobbyKing, since almost every review I've read has been 1/5.
Denmark is very flat, yes.
I'm thinking about getting the Apprentice, since it has the most availability regarding spare parts and support.
Also, I have an old 3D foamie which I just need the electronics for, and that will be my 3rd plane, I guess.

Thanks everyone for the answer!
Nikofant
I wouldn't be to worried about HobbyKing. A lot of people are negative because they feel they're killing their local business, on the other hand, they're bringing thousand and thousand of new people to it.

As for quality, it depends. and is why where here. people here can tell you what on there are good buys and what are not. and what you may need to reinforce or pay attention to on both their and other models. like on my phoenix glider, you need to put fuel tub or shrink wrapping around the clamps for the servo arms or they "could" lose during flight.

The apprentice should be a good choice. the AS3X should also help keep it somewhat stable in more wind. But be warned, if you're already experienced in flying like you are. the SAFE system might be really annoying to you. And if you are learning it'll hinder your development somewhat.


You could for example take a Bixler 2 or Bix3 from Hobbyking, It's known to be of god quality and there's plenty of experience pilots on them to help you out, it's stable and it's a design that handles wind very well. and there's easy access to spare parts from the EU warehouse as well.
 
#9
I wouldn't be to worried about HobbyKing. A lot of people are negative because they feel they're killing their local business, on the other hand, they're bringing thousand and thousand of new people to it.

As for quality, it depends. and is why where here. people here can tell you what on there are good buys and what are not. and what you may need to reinforce or pay attention to on both their and other models. like on my phoenix glider, you need to put fuel tub or shrink wrapping around the clamps for the servo arms or they "could" lose during flight.

The apprentice should be a good choice. the AS3X should also help keep it somewhat stable in more wind. But be warned, if you're already experienced in flying like you are. the SAFE system might be really annoying to you. And if you are learning it'll hinder your development somewhat.


You could for example take a Bixler 2 or Bix3 from Hobbyking, It's known to be of god quality and there's plenty of experience pilots on them to help you out, it's stable and it's a design that handles wind very well. and there's easy access to spare parts from the EU warehouse as well.
Thanks for the answer, HawkMan!

I'll be sure to take that into consideration. If I do buy the Apprentice, I'll be aware of what modes I am in.
As for the Bixler, I'm thinking about that one, too. I've been looking a lot at FPV, and the Bix3 seems better at doing that (placement wise).

Anymore information is appreciated.

Thanks,
Nikofant
 
#10
My first plane of choice was the Flyzone Beaver but after some reading and Youtubing I thought the SAFE system would be a help to me. I too made the same decision you are making, between the Cub and the Apprentice. Now I thought the Cub didn't have ailerons? Unless you thinking of the Sport Cub, but that's an even smaller plane 24" I think. Also the Apprentice has the DX5 Tx with it. I chose the Apprentice, I wanted the bigger bird and 4ch. I've been very happy with my Apprentice it is my first plane and I'm a self taught pilot. It is currently in a state of disrepair due to a servo failure, but I'm getting ready to re-power with a bigger motor. I'll also eventually add flaps and convert to tail wheel. I really want a Carbon Z Cub next. ��
 

pressalltheknobs

Posted a thousand or more times
#11
If you go for the apprentice and can afford it I would get the BNF version and buy a Spektrum 6i Transmitter. I think you will find it much more useful going forward. The radios that come with RTF planes lack features that you will want sooner rather than later. At least do the comparison and see what you don't get and what that means before you part with the cash. I realize you only get $30 off and the 6i is $130 so its $100 more (or whether the EU conversion is) but the 5e is a pretty bare bones TX.

You might even look at the 6 just to see.

Just a thought.
 
#12
Do you have a club or a mentor? Those computerized autoleveling 'oh crap' planes are great if you are trying to teach yourself how to fly, but really, you want to get away from that as soon as you can, so if you have someone to help you the first few flights, Id really go for a plane without all these tech gizmo's. Just something cheap and easy. And if you do crash, just fix it, those foamies can be repaired almost no matter what you do, and that is also part of the hobby.

Hobbyking is perfectly fine. Im also in the EU and have placed many dozens of orders with them, and I have yet to have a real problem with them, be it with shipping or the product. Its not all top quality stuff, but price/quality they are absolutely unbeatable.

A bixler is a decent choice; its versatile and easy to fly, although I personally dont really like the "self leveling" it does. Not through a flight controller, just aerodynamics. But for a beginner thats probably an asset and it also helps if one day you want to FPV it.
 
#13
If you go for the apprentice and can afford it I would get the BNF version and buy a Spektrum 6i Transmitter. I think you will find it much more useful going forward. The radios that come with RTF planes lack features that you will want sooner rather than later. At least do the comparison and see what you don't get and what that means before you part with the cash. I realize you only get $30 off and the 6i is $130 so its $100 more (or whether the EU conversion is) but the 5e is a pretty bare bones TX.

You might even look at the 6 just to see.

Just a thought.
Hey!

Good thought. I actually left this thread a couple of days, only to come back and see more replies! Thank you!
As for the BNF version, I'm afraid my online store does not have that version.
In the time I wasn't checking this thread, I put together a shopping cart on HobbyKing, consisting of this: the Bix3, where I need a transmitter and reciever, a Turnigy nano-tech 2200mAh battery and a genuine IMAX B6 charger.
As for the transmitter and reciever, I'm buying a Spektrum DX6i with an AR610 from another place.
At least that is my plan. Any suggestions for changes would be greatly appreciated.
 
#14
Do you have a club or a mentor? Those computerized autoleveling 'oh crap' planes are great if you are trying to teach yourself how to fly, but really, you want to get away from that as soon as you can, so if you have someone to help you the first few flights, Id really go for a plane without all these tech gizmo's. Just something cheap and easy. And if you do crash, just fix it, those foamies can be repaired almost no matter what you do, and that is also part of the hobby.

Hobbyking is perfectly fine. Im also in the EU and have placed many dozens of orders with them, and I have yet to have a real problem with them, be it with shipping or the product. Its not all top quality stuff, but price/quality they are absolutely unbeatable.

A bixler is a decent choice; its versatile and easy to fly, although I personally dont really like the "self leveling" it does. Not through a flight controller, just aerodynamics. But for a beginner thats probably an asset and it also helps if one day you want to FPV it.
Hi! There is a club relatively near me, so I can get help out there. Thanks for that, I never really thougt about it.

Thanks for telling me your experience from HK, I'm now more reassured to buy from there. I've also heard the gals from the club talk about HK.

And I have written a reply to pressalltheknobs, where I tell what I have in mind in buying.

Thanks,
Nikofant
 

HawkMan

Senior Member
#15
Seems good to me, for the money of the DX6i I would probably have gone another way, but the DX6 is easy to use and can be used on all BNF's without extra modules so...
 

pressalltheknobs

Posted a thousand or more times
#16
Hey!

Good thought. I actually left this thread a couple of days, only to come back and see more replies! Thank you!
As for the BNF version, I'm afraid my online store does not have that version.
In the time I wasn't checking this thread, I put together a shopping cart on HobbyKing, consisting of this: the Bix3, where I need a transmitter and reciever, a Turnigy nano-tech 2200mAh battery and a genuine IMAX B6 charger.
As for the transmitter and reciever, I'm buying a Spektrum DX6i with an AR610 from another place.
At least that is my plan. Any suggestions for changes would be greatly appreciated.
If you don't have them I suggest getting these...
https://store.flitetest.com/battery-voltage-alarm-1-8s/
https://store.flitetest.com/lipo-storage-bags/
https://store.flitetest.com/servo-tester/

Just using the Flite Test Store as an example you can get them elsewhere.

The lipo bag is essential. Watch this. If you have never used a 4 button computer charger before make sure you understand it properly before you use it. The leading cause of lipo fires is charging mistakes.

I would get 2 batteries. Make sure it is 20C or better but look at the weight. You don't need more than 20C for that plane so there is no point in paying more for more Cs and getting a heavier battery but it's probably not worth buying a battery with less than 20C. You might want to get an 1800mAh and a 2200mAh so you can see how it flies with different weights.

If you are not getting a DSMX BNF plane then you are not tied to Spektrum for your TX. However the 6i is a good choice and there are good reasons for choosing it. If you like Spektrum then you might want to consider the DX6. It's more money than the 6i but it has a much improved feature set. Since you are saving some money getting the Bixler I think it's worth a look. I don't have these txs so I'm just pointing it out. FYI: I chose a Taranis which I recommend but it may not suite you and is a more complex discussion.
 
#17
If you don't have them I suggest getting these...
https://store.flitetest.com/battery-voltage-alarm-1-8s/
https://store.flitetest.com/lipo-storage-bags/
https://store.flitetest.com/servo-tester/

Just using the Flite Test Store as an example you can get them elsewhere.

The lipo bag is essential. Watch this. If you have never used a 4 button computer charger before make sure you understand it properly before you use it. The leading cause of lipo fires is charging mistakes.

I would get 2 batteries. Make sure it is 20C or better but look at the weight. You don't need more than 20C for that plane so there is no point in paying more for more Cs and getting a heavier battery but it's probably not worth buying a battery with less than 20C. You might want to get an 1800mAh and a 2200mAh so you can see how it flies with different weights.

If you are not getting a DSMX BNF plane then you are not tied to Spektrum for your TX. However the 6i is a good choice and there are good reasons for choosing it. If you like Spektrum then you might want to consider the DX6. It's more money than the 6i but it has a much improved feature set. Since you are saving some money getting the Bixler I think it's worth a look. I don't have these txs so I'm just pointing it out. FYI: I chose a Taranis which I recommend but it may not suite you and is a more complex discussion.
Hey, thanks.

Just saying, but DSM2 is illegal in Denmark.

Thanks for the answer.
Nikofant
 

pressalltheknobs

Posted a thousand or more times
#18
Hey, thanks.

Just saying, but DSM2 is illegal in Denmark.

Thanks for the answer.
Nikofant
I don't think anyone recommended any DSM2 gear. The DX6i and the DX6 are definitely DSMX transmitters. Spektrum don't make DSM2 gear any more. DSMX will talk to a DSM2 RX and fall back to that protocol if you use one. Best not to and it seems you are not allowed to so no problem.

If you were confused because it says Mode 2 that refers the way the sticks are arranged and has nothing to do with the RF protocol. It means that the Throttle and Rudder are on the left and the Elevator and Ailerons are on the right. It is the usual arrangement in the US. A lot of radios are fairly easy to reconfigure to a different mode. Generally you have to open the case to switch the mechanical aspects since throttle is not self centering for air use where all the other axes are.
 
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HawkMan

Senior Member
#19
Hey, thanks.

Just saying, but DSM2 is illegal in Denmark.

Thanks for the answer.
Nikofant
Illegal ? do you perhaps mean that the national model/air sport association don't allow DMS2 on their flying fields?


and yeah, pretty much anything you buy today is DSMX as well as DSM2 backwards compatible. DSM2 has some issues if it loses bind/connection while in the air as it doesn't do frequency hopping. but even Orange DSM modules do DSMX. I got my Sukhoi bound to my orangeTX module with DSMX on a Taranis. The Taranis isn't much more but is a much more powerful radio, but it's also going to be more difficult to program if you want to use advanced features, even adding expo and throw limits is more complicated than on a Spektrum, once you get used to it, it's not an issue but unless you've done a programming and think like a programmer, it's not something you intuitively start doing.
 

pressalltheknobs

Posted a thousand or more times
#20
oh and the Bix 3 says it uses 3S batteries which means it is an 11.1 volt 3 cell.

I'm sure you saw that but you didn't mention it in your list and it is important.
 
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