Landing without wheels?!

[CavRecon]

I have about 24 minutes of total RC flight experience. Of those, about 20 were spent on a buddy box with an instructor.

With that out of the way, I can ask my dumb question: How in the heck are we supposed to land these FT planes (e.g. Tiny Trainer, Bloody Baron, etc.) that have no landing gear?

While I suppose any cessation of motion while in contact with the ground constitutes a landing, I am still struggling with my FT Mini Scout (with wheels!) to have successful landings that do not break a prop.



This leads me to worry about what is going to happen with the Trainer and Bloody Baron! What's the trick/tip/technique here?

Also...while I'm somewhat on the topic...it seems that the nose-mounting of the batteries that is so common to these designs is really hard on the packs. Until I can improve my skills, should I just plan on destroying a few LiPos? (And probably carry a fire extinguisher!)

 

[Craftydan]

I have about 24 minutes of total RC flight experience. Of those, about 20 were spent on a buddy box with an instructor.

With that out of the way, I can ask my dumb question: How in the heck are we supposed to land these FT planes (e.g. Tiny Trainer, Bloody Baron, etc.) that have no landing gear?

VEEEEERY carefully.

In all seriousness, there are a few things you can do to preserve the prop on a belly landing:

- chop the throttle just before the prop hits the ground -- if the motor is driving the prop into the ground, it's more likely to break it.
- brake it -- (notice the play on words ) turning on the brake in the ESC will stop a wind-milling prop, but still allow it to move when bumped by the ground. arguable whether it helps or not, but many swear by it.
- Flare -- on landing your goal should be to gently touch the tail a split second before the nose. You get low and slow, close to stall, just off the ground and pull back on the elevator a split second before touchdown, immediately stalling into the landing. Done right, your nose won't be able to pitch up much in flare. and the prop isn't the first thing to catch.
- buy *slightly* nicer props -- the cheapest-of-the-cheap break way too easily. the most expensive cost too much when they finally do break. 7" and up, I'd recommend gemfans. Lower, I recommend DAL.
- Propsaver (if your motor can support it -- saves the motor shaft form getting bent too!)
- Tall grass -- it's a pain to wade through, but think of it like an emergency net on an aircraft carrier.

Also...while I'm somewhat on the topic...it seems that the nose-mounting of the batteries that is so common to these designs is really hard on the packs. Until I can improve my skills, should I just plan on destroying a few LiPos? (And probably carry a fire extinguisher!)

Perfect the belly landing and you'll be gentler on everything, pack included.

Also, if you haven't put a good patch of Velcro on your battery and plane, consider this a good reason to do so . . . like a safety belt for your most precious passenger, the battery.

 

[dengar256]

I am just getting back into flying after a 20 year break and I feel your pain. they way I got around it was spend 90% of my flight time practicing approaches. I would start at about 5 - 10 feet off the ground and pick a point in the air to be the "ground". This way I could get a feel for what speed would make a good landing and if I stalled I still had time to power up and get back into the air. I still went through a good number of props but it helped build the skills without impacting the ground each time. I would do the same thing with my planes that have gear and slowly work my way down to a touch and go. Hope this helps.

 

[m00ndancer]

Folding prop with the ESC set to brake works also.

 

[BobK]

Glide in nose it up a little and let it plop down as it slows, like at the end of this video..I missed it a little but you should get the idea. Also if you have even a little bit of room in front of your battery make a cushion out of foam rubber or even foamboard..something to take a hit other than your battery.

 

[CavRecon]

Great stuff! It's amazing how these little nuances don't dawn on me until I get out and try stuff. I probably have seen Bixler land without a prop 100 times...now will start noticing this technique.

I guess the word for it is "experience."

Thanks!

 

[CavRecon]

Oh...and Crafty says "perfect the belly landing" to save the battery. I am still at the stage where the spinner is "landing" first.

 

[JohnRambozo]

Its all about that flare:

I broke a lot of props when I was starting out. Make sure your throttle is fully OFF before you touch the ground. Keep the nose up, bleeding off speed, always into the wind and with up elevator. I actually started eyeing the prop to try to get it to stop spinning so it was facing horizontal but eventually that isn't really an issue. It should spin to a safe position most of the time. If all else fails, dig a wingtip into the ground. I'm only half joking. Its a little rough on the plane but it does save a prop if the whole airframe is spinning when it touches the ground. Not really recommended, though.

You'll need to apply progressively more elevator as it slows down. You're really doing a controlled stall.

 

[Wanderfound]

Put the plane into the wind, as low and slow as you can safely manage. Then gradually reduce throttle, while gently pitching up to maintain level flight. Cut the throttle completely before you touch the ground. Land on grass, not a hard surface.

Do it right and the plane should gently skim to a stop. In a dozen "proper" landngs and a countless number of crashes, I've only broken two props: once when I hit at full throttle, once when I nosedived in hard from 100' up.

OTOH, I've cracked up half a dozen sets of wings. A LiPo-powered hot glue gun ($5 from HobbyKing) is a very worthwhile investment if your flying field is any substantial distance from your workshop.

 

[CavRecon]

All great stuff! Right now, the weather is not cooperating enough to try! Late winter/Early Spring is a bad time to pick up RC flying!

 

[Wanderfound]

Also: landing on wheels is harder than a belly landing, especially if you don't have a nice smooth runway available. Remove the wheels and your Scout will likely land much more easily.

 

[quimney]

I build a little slide in battery tray like the one on the FT mustang but instead of poster board I make it all out of foam board for a little cushion for the battery. I still velcro the battery to the bottom of the power pod, I just slide this in and let friction hold it. It pads the battery and also helps the plane skid on the belly easier so it is less likely to catch and flip up. this may help the prop last a little longer too.

Most of all keep flying... It gets better, honest. I broke a prop on every landing for quite a while. It wasn't until I found a sale and bought a bunch of them did I stop breaking them. go figure

Believe it or not you will get to the point where you can stop the prop horizontally on your way in if you are using a braking esc, it's pretty hard to bust one in that position.

 

[rockyboy]

I have been thinking about putting a landing skid wire on my Micro-FT Flyer to try and reduce prop damage. I have never broken a prop belly landing my Tiny Trainer, but my Micro-FT Flyer is 3 broken props in 3 landings so far. But it's so small and the field I fly at is so rough I don't think the plane will handle wheels big enough to roll on the ground. So what I'm thinking about is hot-gluing in an elbow of control rod wire behind the prop that will stick down just a little further than the prop and make contact with the ground first. It will still be a hand launch plane, but hopefully stop breaking props all the time. If anyone else has tried something similar I'd love to hear about your experience. I'm planning to give this a shot in the next week or so and will let folks know if it works.

 

[smashed2bits]

I always change the placement of my electronics and put the battery inside the powerpod. On my Bloody Wonder i put the receiver and esc on the inside wall of the pod and a strip of velcro behind the firewall, with a pad of foam between the firewall and battery. On planes like the spitfire and FT3D i mount the esc on the bottom of the pod (helps cooling). I think it also helps to have that mass directly in line with the motor. you could also use a small flap of foamboard to attach to or cover the part of the battery that takes the hit.

 

[hkfidget]

It takes practice

Well only one of my eight aircraft has wheels, and I haven't flown it yet, all I can recommend is:

1) Chop the throttle a meter of the ground

2) Flare very slightly so that the tail hits only milliseconds before the rest of the plane

3) As with all things, practice makes perfect to practice line up and fare while in the air so that you can get to a stage where it becomes a natural maneuver to preform, my dad made me do this before he let me land a plane and since I started landing aircraft I haven't crashed or broken a single prop on landing.

 

[Elexo]

I'm not entirely sure about this theory, but in my experience, a well-balanced prop will tend to self-center itself horizontally. But the safest way to go is obviously a prop saver. I use one on my power pod, and I've had some cheap props be straight vertically on a landing and be fine. Good luck!

 

[Crazy Goats]

Gliding in and flaring is definately a good one, CavRecon.

I have been thinking about putting a landing skid wire on my Micro-FT Flyer ...............

Maybe try this? I hope you can figure it out, its a bad drawing.
You would need to shift the battery back to compensate for the extra nose weight.

 

[CavRecon]

I gotta learn how to fly like a big boy some day!