Lesson learned in frustration

JTarmstr

Elite member
My impression is that they haven't yet finalized the rules and that we're more or less still operating on the old ones until such time as the tests and the new guidelines get pushed out.

The gist I got from FAA.gov was that you had to be registered and follow the (formerly section 336) guidelines. But I am prone to second guessing and am always worrying I missed something important.
 

JennyC6

Elite member
The gist I got from FAA.gov was that you had to be registered and follow the (formerly section 336) guidelines. But I am prone to second guessing and am always worrying I missed something important.
Mm, and I'm pretty much indifferent to what the FAA says in the first place so I'm not sure what they're doing at the moment. Guess we'll see in due course!
 

PsyBorg

Wake up! Time to fly!
The latest news is they snuck new legislation on the back of something else.

Soon ALL rc aircraft will have to have an 11 gram 200+ dollar transponder on it.

Check out...

 

JennyC6

Elite member
Doesn't surprise me in the least. Gubmint's been abusing riders to force ridiculous -beep- through for decades.
 

basslord1124

Master member
So our RC club had their annual fly-in this past weekend, and due to work and family things, the only day I could've gone was Sunday (the event was Fri-Sun)...and even then I was too tired to do much of anything. It was kind of a bad week last week anyways.

So, this makes my 2nd year in a row that I didn't go. Last year I didn't go b/c of our new baby daugher. I kinda wanted to go this year but things just didn't pan out. From the pictures I saw on Facebook it looks like it was a fun event and everybody had a good time despite the rainy weather too.

Well this got me thinking about the last time I went to the fly-in. At that time I was there almost the whole time...I still had to work, so I was out one of the days. Well I went inside the club house at one point to get some food for my wife and I and had a conversation with one of the club members' wives (who was preparing the food) that went like this:

Me: "yeah, I think, I'll get my planes out here in a few and start flying".
Club member wife: "Well you gotta pay $20 (or however much it was) to fly first"
Me: "Well I'm a member here (in the event maybe she didn't recognize me)"
Club member wife: "Doesn't matter, everyone's gotta pay to fly"
Me: "Oh"

I was not informed by any club member that we had to pay to fly even if we were a member. I don't think it was so much the money, BUT moreso the fact I wasn't told. Plus, it just didn't make sense to me that current clubs members who pay their dues ALSO have to pay to fly at the event they're even hosting. Maybe that's how it is, I don't know. Like I said, I just wish an official club member told me this.

I didn't verify this with a club member afterwards. I was kind of in shock. I think I ended up flying once without paying and then packed it up.

Is this a common thing for clubs who host fly-in events like this?
 

rockyboy

Skill Collector
Mentor
So our RC club had their annual fly-in this past weekend, and due to work and family things, the only day I could've gone was Sunday (the event was Fri-Sun)...and even then I was too tired to do much of anything. It was kind of a bad week last week anyways.

So, this makes my 2nd year in a row that I didn't go. Last year I didn't go b/c of our new baby daugher. I kinda wanted to go this year but things just didn't pan out. From the pictures I saw on Facebook it looks like it was a fun event and everybody had a good time despite the rainy weather too.

Well this got me thinking about the last time I went to the fly-in. At that time I was there almost the whole time...I still had to work, so I was out one of the days. Well I went inside the club house at one point to get some food for my wife and I and had a conversation with one of the club members' wives (who was preparing the food) that went like this:

Me: "yeah, I think, I'll get my planes out here in a few and start flying".
Club member wife: "Well you gotta pay $20 (or however much it was) to fly first"
Me: "Well I'm a member here (in the event maybe she didn't recognize me)"
Club member wife: "Doesn't matter, everyone's gotta pay to fly"
Me: "Oh"

I was not informed by any club member that we had to pay to fly even if we were a member. I don't think it was so much the money, BUT moreso the fact I wasn't told. Plus, it just didn't make sense to me that current clubs members who pay their dues ALSO have to pay to fly at the event they're even hosting. Maybe that's how it is, I don't know. Like I said, I just wish an official club member told me this.

I didn't verify this with a club member afterwards. I was kind of in shock. I think I ended up flying once without paying and then packed it up.

Is this a common thing for clubs who host fly-in events like this?

All my club's fly-in events are free to attend for everyone - except our monthly multi-GP multi-rotor races (more on that in a minute). We plan for event prizes, drinks, and food in the annual budget for the club that's funded by member dues, and we'd much rather have people come have fun, and entice non-members to join the club, than try to keep track of who paid what to whom at an event.

Our monthly multi-rotor races do have a small fee for members and non-members that's used to buy more and better gates and race timers and prizes - this group tends to be heavily weighted to non-club members and while we do want to support the community and the races, the equipment upgrades aren't cheap and we haven't seen many of these pilots transition to club members over the last several years, so by charging a race fee it's able to cover it's own operating and equipment expenses without dipping into the other parts of the budget.
 

basslord1124

Master member
All my club's fly-in events are free to attend for everyone - except our monthly multi-GP multi-rotor races (more on that in a minute). We plan for event prizes, drinks, and food in the annual budget for the club that's funded by member dues, and we'd much rather have people come have fun, and entice non-members to join the club, than try to keep track of who paid what to whom at an event.

Our monthly multi-rotor races do have a small fee for members and non-members that's used to buy more and better gates and race timers and prizes - this group tends to be heavily weighted to non-club members and while we do want to support the community and the races, the equipment upgrades aren't cheap and we haven't seen many of these pilots transition to club members over the last several years, so by charging a race fee it's able to cover it's own operating and equipment expenses without dipping into the other parts of the budget.

Thanks for the reply @rockyboy . I think they keep enough in the budget to accommodate for events as far as supplies and stuff and I can understand if something has additional costs (your multi-rotor races) to charge for those. I want to think they do charge for outside members to fly at the fly-in and I know they are planning on charging outside folks to race on our RC dirt track (once it gets completed). Perhaps they always charge for anyone to fly at the fly-in and I just didn't know. I think that was my first year actually attempting to fly at the fly-in.
 

CMS_1961

CMS_1961
Unfortunately, in my past experience, these clubs usually end up costing money (dues) that basically go to some type of use fee or club stuff that not everyone wants to be a part of. I especially don't like to pay to fly if I already pay club dues or have AMA--crazy!!! I like clubs to an extent but having been a member of some in the past it does not always end well for anyone. I remember we were just a group of 10 or 15 people flying (no club) in a safe place away from everything in the middle of a southern California desert having a blast with the guys and their kids and friends etc on Saturdays and Sundays all totally informal. We were teaching people to fly, new people would come by and want to look or learn and never had a safety issue or injury of any kind. Then one of the older guys in the group decided, "hey we should make a club!!". Most of the reaction was negative cause we thought it was not necessary--what was the benefit.? Why?

Somehow a club got formed and then the guy that started it went to get permission to fly on this open area of desert for some reason?? As soon as he let the owner know we were flying RC planes there--we were demanded to stay off the piece of nice flat barren desert and never return due to some possible liability--hell we never knew the spot was even "owned" cause it was in the middle of nowhere!! No one ever got hurt there and we left the area cleaner then when we came on weekends. Now we had to find another place to fly--everyone got disgusted and very few of us our even friends now. It was because many people had other areas they wanted to fly and then went about convincing other members of why one spot was more advantageous over another, so we all went to our own best flying locations.

So the morale of all this club stuff as I learned is be careful what you ask for and know what the benefits and drawbacks are going to be of this "club stuff"--not to mention this new FAA rule stuff coming. I realize not everyone has an open area to fly and sometimes to secure or use an area it is necessary to pool resources (cash) to get a spot, but if you are in the middle of nowhere and no airports, highways, people, houses etc, I would just fly and consider myself blessed with that area (and your flying buddies if you have them with you too)--no need for signs or clubs--you might be just asking for the FAA to come by and see what you are doing--possibly? Then more rules, regulations etc.....
 

sprzout

Knower of useless information
Mentor
This is a bit off topic but do you have to join a club/AMA if you register with the FAA? I haven't been flying since the new rules came out and I have had a tough time figuring out the exact rules. My impression before was that with park flyers you just had to obey the AMA's guidelines and common sense, but that has changed? I dont want to be breaking the law but I also dont want to spend a bunch of money on memberships and registration if I dont have to.

AT THIS TIME (and I'm emphasizing that it could change at any time), you do NOT need to join the AMA. However, it is understood that if you are flying an unmanned aerial vehicle (UAV) and you are NOT part of a community based organization such as the AMA, you need to be Part 107 certified. And that IS different from joining a club; most clubs will require AMA membership for various reasons (they can apply for funding from the AMA, for example, but the biggest one is that you have insurance for each pilot who is an AMA member).

Now, there's ALSO the FAA requirements of drone registration, which are separate from the Part 107 and Part 336 requirements. The drone registration requires you to pay $5 for your registration number. Now, this is even trickier, because on the FAA's drone registration site, it says that you have to pay $5 per aircraft. HOWEVER, that ONLY applies if you are flying under the Part 107 certification, and NOT flying under the Community Based Organization rules (part 336). If you are under the part 336, it is $5, and it covers all of your planes. Confusing? Yes. Welcome to government. LOL

So, to recap - as of right now, you do NOT need to join the AMA. However, if you do not, you should be Part 107 certified. Now, Part 107 certification is pretty involved; it involves a lot of ground school information and testing that MUST be done with a certified instructor (I looked into it because of commercial applications that I'd been interested in). You are MORE than welcome to go that route, but let me state that it is a LOT easier to join the AMA than it is to become a Part 107 certified pilot. In addition, if you go do things like Flite Fest, or want to go to Joe Nall and fly, or visit a club field somewhere, you'll most likely need AMA membership because they will require the membership for flying. For that alone, it's worth it in my book to have it.
 
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Captain Video

Well-known member
I have been looking into the whole AMA membership thing and I have come to this conclusion. As a hobby this is a difficult time. Things change almost on an hourly basis. I have been flying with my sons for five years. They are almost 21 and attending the Ohio State University. I have acquired my AMA membership for the same reasons stated above. My sons are starving college students and at this time even $75 per year is an unnecessary expense for them. I plan to get the Park Pilot Program memberships ($38) in time for Flite Fest Ohio. We have an AMA field near our house in Westerville, Ohio and they will need them should we want to fly there (infrequently). I really hope the government does not micromanage such a fun activity into non existence.
 

sprzout

Knower of useless information
Mentor
I have been looking into the whole AMA membership thing and I have come to this conclusion. As a hobby this is a difficult time. Things change almost on an hourly basis. I have been flying with my sons for five years. They are almost 21 and attending the Ohio State University. I have acquired my AMA membership for the same reasons stated above. My sons are starving college students and at this time even $75 per year is an unnecessary expense for them. I plan to get the Park Pilot Program memberships ($38) in time for Flite Fest Ohio. We have an AMA field near our house in Westerville, Ohio and they will need them should we want to fly there (infrequently). I really hope the government does not micromanage such a fun activity into non existence.

Trust me, that's what so many in the hobby are worried about - and not just the end hobbyists, but the manufacturers, as well. Think about it - you tell everyone that they have to have a $200 transponder on each of their models, something that could be more than double the cost of the model itself? There are going to be a lot of people stepping away from the hobby, and the companies are going to go belly up.

I know the transponders are being aimed at those who are flying commercial, photography style drones (such as the DJI Phantom, for example), and especially aimed at the Amazon drones that they want to implement for delivery. The idea behind it is well intentioned, but we all know that the path to Hell is paved with good intentions...We'll have to see how this shakes out, honestly...
 

fliers1

Member
I really hate to complain about clubs and RC fields, because they're pretty much a vital necessity here in Southern California, where the stigma of RC aircraft of any kind is, "You're using it to spy on me!". Without the clubs and the designated fields allowing us to fly, it's hard to enjoy this hobby.

That said, I experienced a frustrating lesson in resistance to change from the "old guys" in a club the other night.

I attended a new club meeting where there was talk of new members joining up, and the club was going to offer to pay the AMA membership for the first year and offer a discounted rate for that first year, to get people in.

Why?

Because the average age of the club members, just looking around the room, was 65+. There are no kids getting involved with it, at least with that club.

So they took a vote for allowing this "new member pilot program" to go forward (the proposal was $150, which was AMA membership for a year, at $75, and club membership, which is discounted down from $200 to $75), and majority was for the new member program. But there was a surprising number of people who were against it, and when asked why, the responses ranged from, "We come out to get away from our kids," to the one that frustrated me the most, "If they can afford the plane and the transmitter and everything that goes with it, they can afford the membership."

I think that attitude is a BIG reason why we have so many pilots who are thumbing their noses at AMA rules and not wanting to join up in clubs. Parents invest in $700-$800 in a plane, transmitter, batteries, etc. to get their kid flying for the first time. For a lot of people, that's a fair chunk of change. Then you're told that you need to fork over another $75 to the AMA to be able to fly without a part 107 license, plus club membership fees to fly at a specific field. Wouldn't you want to know that ahead of time, say, as you're purchasing the quadcopter/Cessna/sailplane/warbird that you're wanting to help your kid learn to fly?

Plus, if a club is willing to help you get set up, explain the AMA membership benefits (and requirements to fly at their field), AND give you a discount for membership, along with the club perks (4th of July and Labor Day BBQs at the field, a section for fixed wing pilots and a separate field area for heli pilots, as well as a separate drone racing area, camping nights with night fly events, free flight training from club instructors, etc.), wouldn't that go a long way in making you feel more welcome than saying, "Well, you had money to buy a plane...Fork over more now to join us, because if you can afford the plane, you can afford to join the club."

I guess maybe I'm frustrated, and maybe it's just the "old guard" way of thinking, and maybe they need to take a back seat so that new members can feel welcome - a lot of maybes.

Anyone else experience this? And what have you done to change the minds of...well..."the old way" of thinking?

For decades I had a standing offer to let anyone fly my LT-40. This is a free offer to have anyone who I meet, on and off the field take at least 20-30 minutes straight flying time. I explain that if the plane goes in, it's entirely my fault as I'm the instructor. I haven't lost one yet.
I've explained this many times to other clubs, AMA, MAAC, and many industry members. Any one? Any one? Not a positive reply, if I get a reply at all. Now, what problem would anyone have with my offering a means to attracting more RC flyers to the hobby? Doesn't make any sense at all. I go on the forums and explain how I do things and that I can teach others how to do this. Did I mention that I don't use a buddy-box? I have had several testimonials printed in Model Aviation magazine and a couple of You Tube videos and still no one banging on my door asking for more information or how possible would it be to train them how to use this growth proven method.

Now with the FAA intrusion, the fixed wing portion of the hobby is in serious trouble. We may have a 3 year window to try to turn things around, but considering I still haven't had anyone taking my efforts seriously, it don't look good. I will try once more this coming flying season. I have many ideas on how to grow this hobby and if anyone is interested, I will be happy to fill them on. I contacted Hobbico many times explaining how I can help increase sales, but Hobbico didn't listen and they thought they were too big to fail. Oh well. Ironically, I only have several trainers left, so I have the least to lose and the industry and many modelers have much more to lose the me.

If someone tells me they can't afford the hobby, no problem, I will teach them to fly and earn their solo wings (figure of speech) so when or if they can afford it, the will already know how to fly. I've donated a dozen airplanes to people who were financially strapped. Many of those planes were given to me. It seems that wives who husbands passed away couldn't find anyone to buy what they had, so they found me, and asked if I wanted a dozen airplanes and all the equipment that went with them. I told them that I already had a cellar full of airplanes that were given to me. Their choice was to hold on to whatever they had or throw them in the trash. So I ended up taking what they had off their hands. I tried to help local hobby shop sell RC airplanes buy having the shop owners send people to me to give their customers flight instruction or just a few minute taste of flying my trainer. It worked out pretty good for one local hobby shop, but the owner quit handing out my cards when several club members told him that they would do all the training. Now the hobby shop mostly sells RC land vehicles and quad copters, very few airplanes and only foamies. Now several local clubs lost their field, funny thing, within 10 of where I live, there are two fields that are all but deserted.

No AMA, club dues, airplane purchase, not a dime spent. Just come on out to my field and fly for at least an hour. That's about all I can do to help keep our hobby afloat. Unfortunately, it might much too little, much too late.
 
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JennyC6

Elite member
For decades I had a standing offer to let anyone fly my LT-40. This is a free offer to have anyone who I meet, on and off the field take at least 20-30 minutes straight flying time. I explain that if the plane goes in, it's entirely my fault as I'm the instructor. I haven't lost one yet.
I've explained this many times to other clubs, AMA, MAAC, and many industry members. Any one? Any one? Not a positive reply, if I get a reply at all. Now, what problem would anyone have with my offering a means to attracting more RC flyers to the hobby? Doesn't make any sense at all. I go on the forums and explain how I do things and that I can teach others how to do this. Did I mention that I don't use a buddy-box? I have had several testimonials printed in Model Aviation magazine and a couple of You Tube videos and still no one banging on my door asking for more information or how possible would it be to train them how to use this growth proven method.

Now with the FAA intrusion, the fixed wing portion of the hobby is in serious trouble. We may have a 3 year window to try to turn things around, but considering I still haven't had anyone taking my efforts seriously, it don't look good. I will try once more this coming flying season. I have many ideas on how to grow this hobby and if anyone is interested, I will be happy to fill them on. I contacted Hobbico many times explaining how I can help increase sales, but Hobbico didn't listen and they thought they were too big to fail. Oh well. Ironically, I only have several trainers left, so I have the least to lose and the industry and many modelers have much more to lose the me.

If someone tells me they can't afford the hobby, no problem, I will teach them to fly and earn their solo wings (figure of speech) so when or if they can afford it, the will already know how to fly. I've donated a dozen airplanes to people who were financially strapped. Many of those planes were given to me. It seems that wives who husbands passed away couldn't find anyone to buy what they had, so they found me, and asked if I wanted a dozen airplanes and all the equipment that went with them. I told them that I already had a cellar full of airplanes that were given to me. Their choice was to hold on to whatever they had or throw them in the trash. So I ended up taking what they had off their hands. I tried to help local hobby shop sell RC airplanes buy having the shop owners send people to me to give their customers flight instruction or just a few minute taste of flying my trainer. It worked out pretty good for one local hobby shop, but the owner quit handing out my cards when several club members told him that they would do all the training. Now the hobby shop mostly sells RC land vehicles and quad copters, very few airplanes and only foamies. Now several local clubs lost their field, funny thing, within 10 of where I live, there are two fields that are all but deserted.

No AMA, club dues, airplane purchase, not a dime spent. Just come on out to my field and fly for at least an hour. That's about all I can do to help keep our hobby afloat. Unfortunately, it might much too little, much too late.
It's guys like you...and who taught me...who the hobby needs most.

My first trip to the field was nearly a total waste of time. I had brought:

1x nitro Spear, ready to go
1x nitro Mini Sportster, ready to go
1x nitro shortcourse truck, ready to go
1x Hobbico NexSTAR, engine/servos/plumbing all working but no receiver, receiver batt.

I had tried to fly the Spear and the Sportster. The Spear's engines weren't cooperating and it could barely taxi. the Sportster groundlooped incessantly. It rained a bit, ran the SCT some on the wet runway. One guy, Bruce, stayed behind to weather the storm. We got to chatting and he floated the idea of trying to fly the NexSTAR. I borrowed some electronics from the Spear, hurriedly got the thing set up, CG set, shoved some 20% car fuel down its' 46AX's throat, and Bruce took it off. Trimmed it out. Passed me the radio, I flew it around a bit, he coached. Time to land, I pass Tx back to him, down it came like butter.


Next time I come down I solo myself on the NexSTAR.

I hadn't planned on asking for any help...hell the foamies were there so I could crash without destroying an irreplaceable airframe!...it just happened. Organically. On the spot. It's a large part of why I call Peeler my home field...everyone there is like Bruce. More guys like the two of ya'll would be a godsend to the hobby.
 

fliers1

Member
Thanks for the kudos. My only purpose in this hobby is to provide help for beginners and to get more people in the hobby. Otherwise I have no interest in flying my own planes. I would love to get more females and kids in the hobby. We have a new YMCA where we can fly in the back of the building and a large room for training with a simulator.
 

Hai-Lee

Old and Bold RC PILOT
For decades I had a standing offer to let anyone fly my LT-40. This is a free offer to have anyone who I meet, on and off the field take at least 20-30 minutes straight flying time. I explain that if the plane goes in, it's entirely my fault as I'm the instructor. I haven't lost one yet.
I've explained this many times to other clubs, AMA, MAAC, and many industry members. Any one? Any one? Not a positive reply, if I get a reply at all. Now, what problem would anyone have with my offering a means to attracting more RC flyers to the hobby? Doesn't make any sense at all. I go on the forums and explain how I do things and that I can teach others how to do this. Did I mention that I don't use a buddy-box? I have had several testimonials printed in Model Aviation magazine and a couple of You Tube videos and still no one banging on my door asking for more information or how possible would it be to train them how to use this growth proven method.

Now with the FAA intrusion, the fixed wing portion of the hobby is in serious trouble. We may have a 3 year window to try to turn things around, but considering I still haven't had anyone taking my efforts seriously, it don't look good. I will try once more this coming flying season. I have many ideas on how to grow this hobby and if anyone is interested, I will be happy to fill them on. I contacted Hobbico many times explaining how I can help increase sales, but Hobbico didn't listen and they thought they were too big to fail. Oh well. Ironically, I only have several trainers left, so I have the least to lose and the industry and many modelers have much more to lose the me.

If someone tells me they can't afford the hobby, no problem, I will teach them to fly and earn their solo wings (figure of speech) so when or if they can afford it, the will already know how to fly. I've donated a dozen airplanes to people who were financially strapped. Many of those planes were given to me. It seems that wives who husbands passed away couldn't find anyone to buy what they had, so they found me, and asked if I wanted a dozen airplanes and all the equipment that went with them. I told them that I already had a cellar full of airplanes that were given to me. Their choice was to hold on to whatever they had or throw them in the trash. So I ended up taking what they had off their hands. I tried to help local hobby shop sell RC airplanes buy having the shop owners send people to me to give their customers flight instruction or just a few minute taste of flying my trainer. It worked out pretty good for one local hobby shop, but the owner quit handing out my cards when several club members told him that they would do all the training. Now the hobby shop mostly sells RC land vehicles and quad copters, very few airplanes and only foamies. Now several local clubs lost their field, funny thing, within 10 of where I live, there are two fields that are all but deserted.

No AMA, club dues, airplane purchase, not a dime spent. Just come on out to my field and fly for at least an hour. That's about all I can do to help keep our hobby afloat. Unfortunately, it might much too little, much too late.
Whilst we appear to be a very big ocean apart we share somewhat similar goals in the RC arena.

As a club member I was already helping where and when I could getting and keeping others flying but I recently formalised the position becoming a committee member supplying member support. This member support, (purely voluntary), includes flight instruction, ground instruction, model repairs, model upgrades, some radio repairs, building assistance up to actual complete building of members planes/kits, and even design services for those who want that special bird that cannot be found as a retail offering. One other service that even raises my blood pressure is performing the maidens for those members who doubt their own flying skills on the new model. Luckily most build and set up faults have been discovered before the test flights but still it can get the blood pressure up taking on the real unknown.

With the role comes the full maintenance of the club's trainer models as well as being at call after hours, (as long as I am awake). The club is actually growing in membership and there are plans to grow the membership a lot further in the near future. In the mix of new ideas to improve the membership is a period of free membership and with it access to the club member support services. The only thing we will not supply is new aircraft for the member unless the member wants a FB plane and of course the radio equipment. The insurance is very cheap for our club as we are park flyers and do not use any I.C. powered aircraft.

The support area also includes flight stabilisation and flight controllers from park flyer level to survey standard, (depends upon what the member wishes to use or purchase). Currently members also get planes gifted around as I tend to build and fly just like I have an addiction to the process. The club is soon to implement competency assessments on a voluntary basis for those who wish them and for those other clubs that require such qualifications before allowing visitors to even fly at their field. These assessments are backed and recognised by our insurer.

As for the repair services, I received a good rap from one new member who said, "I gave him a bag of foam crumbs and he gave me back my plane!".

My aim is to get everyone in a club which has no elitism, no politics, minimal costs, maximum benefits, and overall a friendly and supportive environment for all. A club has a bigger voice than many individual flyers and our little club has even had some government grants, (building or structure), and more are quite easily possible especially if the membership keeps growing!

Like it or not clubs are necessary if the hobby is to survive. If you want the hobby to continue find a local club and join it, or start one ASAP!

Have fun!
 

fliers1

Member
I've belonged to 5 different clubs in and around my area. There is only 2 of the five are still active. All others are gone or their membership numbers are down from hundreds to double digits. Several clubs have lost their flying sites. All the clubs I belonged to had a problem with growth, the didn't want it. If I brought in a new member, they would not allow me to train them, although giving the newbie a taste of flight training is how I got him to join the club.
This has been the case for most of the 45 years I've been in the hobby. You see, if I train them, they don't have to join a club. We have hundreds of thousands of open area in this part of the world and many of those I trained fly on their own property.

We have a county owned flying field that I have been using to get people into the hobby. But once I give them a test drive, they join a club and once the club leaders find out that I trained the student, no matter how skilled he may be, even up to solo status, the club tells him that he must pass their wings test before he can fly on his own. Guess what? In some cases, the student that I trained never seemed to become good enough to pass the club's test, or the club has to have 2 instructors available for the student to take his test. There never seems to be able to get those two together at the same time. I got this information straight from some beginners.

Yes, I agree that clubs are important, that is what I'm trying to do, which is train enough new members to help existing clubs and start new ones. Many instructors have burned out as a result of having too much of a work load. I've trained hundreds over the years from as many clubs and I hear the same story over and over. Beginners came to me because they couldn't get much, if any help from their clubs. There are two sides to every story and the modeling organizations only hear how great flight instruction is from club leaders. It's a different story from the beginner's side. But beginners dare not bite the hand that feeds them, by voicing any complaints about how bad their club's instruction system may be. Not even AMA can force club instructors to teach. This assessment always rubs solo pilot - veteran club members the wrong way, but like I said, I got this info from personal experience and from hundreds of beginners from as many clubs. I desperately want the hobby to grow and survive, but it doesn't look too good for our hobby's future.
 

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Daniel-J

New member
You can always negotiate the terms that suit you. When deciding to choose this or that hobby, you should take into account such problems. This is an adult life, no one will tell you how much and why it is until you know or show interest.
 

JennyC6

Elite member
Whilst we appear to be a very big ocean apart we share somewhat similar goals in the RC arena.

As a club member I was already helping where and when I could getting and keeping others flying but I recently formalised the position becoming a committee member supplying member support. This member support, (purely voluntary), includes flight instruction, ground instruction, model repairs, model upgrades, some radio repairs, building assistance up to actual complete building of members planes/kits, and even design services for those who want that special bird that cannot be found as a retail offering. One other service that even raises my blood pressure is performing the maidens for those members who doubt their own flying skills on the new model. Luckily most build and set up faults have been discovered before the test flights but still it can get the blood pressure up taking on the real unknown.

With the role comes the full maintenance of the club's trainer models as well as being at call after hours, (as long as I am awake). The club is actually growing in membership and there are plans to grow the membership a lot further in the near future. In the mix of new ideas to improve the membership is a period of free membership and with it access to the club member support services. The only thing we will not supply is new aircraft for the member unless the member wants a FB plane and of course the radio equipment. The insurance is very cheap for our club as we are park flyers and do not use any I.C. powered aircraft.

The support area also includes flight stabilisation and flight controllers from park flyer level to survey standard, (depends upon what the member wishes to use or purchase). Currently members also get planes gifted around as I tend to build and fly just like I have an addiction to the process. The club is soon to implement competency assessments on a voluntary basis for those who wish them and for those other clubs that require such qualifications before allowing visitors to even fly at their field. These assessments are backed and recognised by our insurer.

As for the repair services, I received a good rap from one new member who said, "I gave him a bag of foam crumbs and he gave me back my plane!".

My aim is to get everyone in a club which has no elitism, no politics, minimal costs, maximum benefits, and overall a friendly and supportive environment for all. A club has a bigger voice than many individual flyers and our little club has even had some government grants, (building or structure), and more are quite easily possible especially if the membership keeps growing!

Like it or not clubs are necessary if the hobby is to survive. If you want the hobby to continue find a local club and join it, or start one ASAP!

Have fun!
I've belonged to 5 different clubs in and around my area. There is only 2 of the five are still active. All others are gone or their membership numbers are down from hundreds to double digits. Several clubs have lost their flying sites. All the clubs I belonged to had a problem with growth, the didn't want it. If I brought in a new member, they would not allow me to train them, although giving the newbie a taste of flight training is how I got him to join the club.
This has been the case for most of the 45 years I've been in the hobby. You see, if I train them, they don't have to join a club. We have hundreds of thousands of open area in this part of the world and many of those I trained fly on their own property.

We have a county owned flying field that I have been using to get people into the hobby. But once I give them a test drive, they join a club and once the club leaders find out that I trained the student, no matter how skilled he may be, even up to solo status, the club tells him that he must pass their wings test before he can fly on his own. Guess what? In some cases, the student that I trained never seemed to become good enough to pass the club's test, or the club has to have 2 instructors available for the student to take his test. There never seems to be able to get those two together at the same time. I got this information straight from some beginners.

Yes, I agree that clubs are important, that is what I'm trying to do, which is train enough new members to help existing clubs and start new ones. Many instructors have burned out as a result of having too much of a work load. I've trained hundreds over the years from as many clubs and I hear the same story over and over. Beginners came to me because they couldn't get much, if any help from their clubs. There are two sides to every story and the modeling organizations only hear how great flight instruction is from club leaders. It's a different story from the beginner's side. But beginners dare not bite the hand that feeds them, by voicing any complaints about how bad their club's instruction system may be. Not even AMA can force club instructors to teach. This assessment always rubs solo pilot - veteran club members the wrong way, but like I said, I got this info from personal experience and from hundreds of beginners from as many clubs. I desperately want the hobby to grow and survive, but it doesn't look too good for our hobby's future.
You guys would both like Music City Aviators, then. You don't even need to be a member to fly at Peeler, merely hold an AMA card. The site itself is owned by Nashville Parks, you can fly anything provided it's safe to fly, the guys there are great(See how I gained my wings, as it were). I will be joining in an official capacity soon enough.

With the role comes the full maintenance of the club's trainer models as well as being at call after hours, (as long as I am awake). The club is actually growing in membership and there are plans to grow the membership a lot further in the near future. In the mix of new ideas to improve the membership is a period of free membership and with it access to the club member support services. The only thing we will not supply is new aircraft for the member unless the member wants a FB plane and of course the radio equipment. The insurance is very cheap for our club as we are park flyers and do not use any I.C. powered aircraft.

You'd have more growth if you changed the bolded part. I'd never visit your field on that basis alone; IC is the only thing I fly and it's half of why I'm a model aviator in the first place. I passed up two of the three fields in my area because they were electric only, hell it's why I don't have any plans on attending Flite Fest anytime soon. And if my experience at FPVFest is anything to go by it's not because people are disinterested in IC aircraft.

Back at FPVFest 2019 I was in my pit stall watching some other shenanigans and having a soda with all of my glow birds and cars on display. A father and son looked over at my stuff and stopped, 'whoa is that nitro?'. I put my coke down, smiled, said 'yeah want to hear one run?' They nodded, I fired up the 4-cycle in my NexSTAR, even let the dad feel how hard the thing could pull while at full blast. They both trundled away with grins on their faces afterwards and I'm pretty sure I sparked quite an interest in them with that little encounter. And I also brought nitro cars up there, was rippin' pretty good with them. Had tons of folks interested in that too.

People like engine powered RCs when they see them running in the right context. There's a 'wow' factor inherent in having such a small, yet fully functional, engine powering a model that electric will never capture.
 

Bricks

Master member
With our club just come out and fly or try, if you decide to join then AMA is required and that maybe changing. We are very laid back as I think the club is very freindly yes we have one or two older guys that do not want to have a lot of people in the club but most just ignore them. When i joined there was no FB airplanes now everyone in the club has at least one or more, they are finding out how much fun they are and cheap. I am the one that started the combat and now most of the club it is all they want to do.
 

Hai-Lee

Old and Bold RC PILOT
You guys would both like Music City Aviators, then. You don't even need to be a member to fly at Peeler, merely hold an AMA card. The site itself is owned by Nashville Parks, you can fly anything provided it's safe to fly, the guys there are great(See how I gained my wings, as it were). I will be joining in an official capacity soon enough.



You'd have more growth if you changed the bolded part. I'd never visit your field on that basis alone; IC is the only thing I fly and it's half of why I'm a model aviator in the first place. I passed up two of the three fields in my area because they were electric only, hell it's why I don't have any plans on attending Flite Fest anytime soon. And if my experience at FPVFest is anything to go by it's not because people are disinterested in IC aircraft.

Back at FPVFest 2019 I was in my pit stall watching some other shenanigans and having a soda with all of my glow birds and cars on display. A father and son looked over at my stuff and stopped, 'whoa is that nitro?'. I put my coke down, smiled, said 'yeah want to hear one run?' They nodded, I fired up the 4-cycle in my NexSTAR, even let the dad feel how hard the thing could pull while at full blast. They both trundled away with grins on their faces afterwards and I'm pretty sure I sparked quite an interest in them with that little encounter. And I also brought nitro cars up there, was rippin' pretty good with them. Had tons of folks interested in that too.

People like engine powered RCs when they see them running in the right context. There's a 'wow' factor inherent in having such a small, yet fully functional, engine powering a model that electric will never capture.
Yes possibly but then the club at its current location would not exist.

Because we carry no fuel the actual fire risk is quite low and so our insurance premiums are exceptionally low.
Being within 20 metres of domestic residences on one side of the fields and million dollar race horses on the other local noise restrictions and exhaust emissions are a bit of a problem.

Location within the city limits, in a populated area, and yet authorised and insured makes for a very convenient location and a huge possible membership. Long distances to travel to fly is something that actually adds significant costs that are best spent on models rather than on fuel and vehicle service costs.

I started on I.C. but seriously I do not miss it. The flying of the planes is what I enjoy most and not their power plants.

Have fun!
 
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