RCExplorer.se Baby Tricopter Kit Build Log
- Thread starter LitterBug
- Start date
PsyBorg
Wake up! Time to fly!
What is your roll pids set to? I am wondering if loosening the I gains on roll would make the tail tilt fight less and soften that waggle a bit for you. Other then that that thing zips around nicely.
Are you bringing them to FFE? Id like to see them lil buggers in action live.
Are you bringing them to FFE? Id like to see them lil buggers in action live.
Oh yeah the Baby Tris will be at FFE. I thought you weren't gonna make it. I already have one potential test drive lined up. Will you be next in line PsyBorg?
Part of the problem was wind yesterday. Still trying to run defaults so @lauka can get an idea how it flies on different setups out of the box. Was too windy to get an in-flight tail tune which can impact it too. Capturing Blackbox logs now too so he has even more data to work with. Testing some 5152 props on the original undermotored Baby Tri payed off. They woke the 2100 motors up.
Cheers!
LitterBug
Part of the problem was wind yesterday. Still trying to run defaults so @lauka can get an idea how it flies on different setups out of the box. Was too windy to get an in-flight tail tune which can impact it too. Capturing Blackbox logs now too so he has even more data to work with. Testing some 5152 props on the original undermotored Baby Tri payed off. They woke the 2100 motors up.
Cheers!
LitterBug
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PsyBorg
Wake up! Time to fly!
Yeah I was not due to transportation but someone offered to swing by on the way there and drag me kicking and screaming. Things worked out and I can swing it. I will let the other person claim credit if he wishes but I don't want to say if he does not want to advertise in public should he not want to.
I would love to see it in action and yes I would love to try it but I don't want to risk Bills Law rearing its ugly bald head and doing something evil with your gear. I will have my goggles with me so I can ride along while you rip up the wild blue as I poke you in the ribs with a stick though.
5152 props? that is seriously aggressive. How much torque do them motors put out that they got better with them? You batteries must fully hate you now though I d be willing to bet. My batteries are getting angry with me using 5046 cyclones when temps are above 80 ish.
I would love to see it in action and yes I would love to try it but I don't want to risk Bills Law rearing its ugly bald head and doing something evil with your gear. I will have my goggles with me so I can ride along while you rip up the wild blue as I poke you in the ribs with a stick though.
5152 props? that is seriously aggressive. How much torque do them motors put out that they got better with them? You batteries must fully hate you now though I d be willing to bet. My batteries are getting angry with me using 5046 cyclones when temps are above 80 ish.
The motors on Baby Tri #1 are Edge Racing 2206 2100kv. Not sure at this point why I went with 2100kv instead of 2300kv, but it was one of my first builds. Maybe I wanted it to be tame. LOL. Hindsight my friend tells me I should have gone with 2300s. On the other hand Baby tri #2 has Cobra 2207 2450kv motors. MEH. They RIP but not my favorite motors. Debating upgrading Baby tri1 to F40 2300kv or my current favorite, Edge Racing Light 2205 2480kv. Have a set of those on my AWK210, and absolutely love them paired up with Strix 5x4.5x3 props.
FWIW I am not afraid of Bill's law and LitterBug's law says it's nice to share. Especially with cool peeps like PsyBorg! Think you have seen the way IFly crash.
Cheers!
LitterBug
FWIW I am not afraid of Bill's law and LitterBug's law says it's nice to share. Especially with cool peeps like PsyBorg! Think you have seen the way I
Cheers!
LitterBug
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MMmmmmm.... look how nicely the BBlog shows roll oscillation in the motor 1/2 traces 180 degrees out of sync from each other...
Going to drop roll P/D before heading to the field tonight. Hoping for non windy conditions and to actually do some tuning rather than just running defaults. Waggle-B-Gone!
Cheers!
LitterBug
Going to drop roll P/D before heading to the field tonight. Hoping for non windy conditions and to actually do some tuning rather than just running defaults. Waggle-B-Gone!
Cheers!
LitterBug
Roll wobble appears cross linked with some pitch wobble, but no servo wobble. Since the rear motor is almost never straight up, that feeds into yaw wobble as well. Need to knock out the roll wobble to get a better idea of what the tail is doing in order to tune that.
Are you running on BF or CF?
I was on DW's RCE site and he was suggesting the migration over to BF. I haven't done it on my V4Tri yet but with more exposure to the geekspeak of multirotors I'm feeling a little less apprehensive about it.
Thoughts?
Btw, your little tri looks very clean. You'll be in Ohio next month with it, right?
I was on DW's RCE site and he was suggesting the migration over to BF. I haven't done it on my V4Tri yet but with more exposure to the geekspeak of multirotors I'm feeling a little less apprehensive about it.
Thoughts?
Btw, your little tri looks very clean. You'll be in Ohio next month with it, right?
PsyBorg
Wake up! Time to fly!
Yeah but with the tri any wobbles in the front the tail will chase if my perception of how they would work is correct. Those would have to kind of be fixed before the tail could be set properly I would think. They Really are for mad men hehe .. chasing a tune like that hehe.
And yes Jim LB will be there Wednesday evening as well I believe.
And yes Jim LB will be there Wednesday evening as well I believe.
I'm running TriFlight0.7Beta2 NewYawControl V6, which has been based off BetaFlight 3.1.7. After going to the field tonight and having no correlation to changes made and flight performance, I realized that Motor 1 is the tail motor not one of the front motors, so the coupling is not what I was expecting and was adjusting the wrong stuff in the wrong directions. LOL LOL LOL LOL HA HA HA HA HA
I truly have become a TRI MadMan LOL LOL LOL LOL
HE HE HE HE
Cheers!
LitterBug
HO HO HOHO
EDIT: Jim, I live in Ohio. FFE is 2 hours from my house. The babies will be there unless I blow them up between now and then...
I truly have become a TRI MadMan LOL LOL LOL LOL
HE HE HE HE
Cheers!
LitterBug
HO HO HOHO
EDIT: Jim, I live in Ohio. FFE is 2 hours from my house. The babies will be there unless I blow them up between now and then...
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Well nuts. Was trying to redo a few things on Baby 1, check servo slop, bump up the servo voltage, etc... It seems I botched something up. Not sure if I was unsuccessful moving the 000 ohm resistor back on the F3FC, messed up the servo, or who knows what. Thought everything was going fine after getting it back together. Did disarmed tail tune, Tail speed increased as expected. Had it out back, got a good inflight tailtune, landed, disarmed, turned off tailtune, and then started doing some easy flying around LOS acro, then stabilize. At some point it started acting like it was getting blown around while in a hover yet it was dead calm out. Next thing I know, it starts a yaw spin. Dropped throttle, no reaction. Starts heading for the sky. Disarmed... still nothing. At some point it decided to stop and dropped straight down on the other side of the house in the middle of the street. Unfortunately did not have the OpenLog hooked up. Would be real interested to know what actually happened. Knocked tail mech off and creamed the battery. Frame appears OK.
Have a complete backup Baby PDB and F3FC. Think I will order another servo and tail pivot since these had some slop, then start over from scratch. Been meaning to swap the 2100kv motors out for something better. Guess this is the nudge I needed. Glad I have baby 2 as a backup.
Cheers!
LitterBug
Have a complete backup Baby PDB and F3FC. Think I will order another servo and tail pivot since these had some slop, then start over from scratch. Been meaning to swap the 2100kv motors out for something better. Guess this is the nudge I needed. Glad I have baby 2 as a backup.
Cheers!
LitterBug
PsyBorg
Wake up! Time to fly!
Man that is some bad luck mate. It couldn't have been a fail safe as I believe you set them up like quads to just drop. You haven't angered a neighbor who hijacked your signal did you? (bad joke sorry) At least it came down in the street and not someones car window or worse. Possible you pinched a wire when doing the changes and when it rotated one direction shorted or broke a control wire?
Servo is pretty much borked unless I can get a new top case section. Main output shaft got bent when it hit the ground and the top part of the case that holds the upper bearing got knocked out. Had a set of replacement gears on hand so threw those at it for mocking the rebuild. Can get Baby #1 95% back together and tested on the ground. Hopefully servo will arrive before leaving for FFE. Will get pics and document the rebuild.....
Baby Tri #1 COMPLETE REBUILD anticipated specs....
Frame: RCExplorer Baby Tricopter
FC/PDB: DTFc (for better native dRonin support)
RX: LemonRX LM0037 diversity
OSD/VTX: Diatone SP3. MinimOSD/VTX MWOSD 1.7
Camera: Runcam Swift with GoPro style lens
V/antenna: TBS triumph
ESCs: Spedix IS 30A
Motors: Edge Racing Light 2205 2480kv
Props: Strix 5x4.5x3
Servo: 25 spline TBD. Turnigy? Blue-Bird? Depends on which arrives in time for FFE
Serial Data logger: OpenLager
Cheers!
LitterBug
Frame: RCExplorer Baby Tricopter
FC/PDB: DTFc (for better native dRonin support)
RX: LemonRX LM0037 diversity
OSD/VTX: Diatone SP3. MinimOSD/VTX MWOSD 1.7
Camera: Runcam Swift with GoPro style lens
V/antenna: TBS triumph
ESCs: Spedix IS 30A
Motors: Edge Racing Light 2205 2480kv
Props: Strix 5x4.5x3
Servo: 25 spline TBD. Turnigy? Blue-Bird? Depends on which arrives in time for FFE
Serial Data logger: OpenLager
Cheers!
LitterBug
BT#1 Scratch Rebuild Time!
So this is the BT1 servo. It is toast in my book unless I can get a new case for it. It was completely locked up after the recent flyaway and smack into the ground. The main shaft was bent and I had a spare set of gears for it. Unfortunately the case is a bit cracked and the top bearing shield area broke off. I'll use it to get everything in place until the new one arrives, but I will not fly with it.
Started the scratch rebuild of RCExplorer Baby Tricopter #1. Got the motors on and the ESCs wired for correct rotation over the weekend. Debating on using a DTFc flight controller or going with the "stock" F3FC Racing and Baby PDB. I'll have native dRonin support with the DTFc. The F3FC is only supported in dRonin by one of the developer's side builds. Both have support with the latest TriFlight (BetaFlight)
Have a variety of servos ordered in addition to the "stock" RCExplorer servo. Takes a while for parts to come from Sweden some times, and I want to have it back together before FliteFest next week. Plan on testing some of the other servos on one of the babies at some point too. Two of the potential servo candidates have faster stats, so it will be interesting to see what affect that has on the overall feel.
Cheers!
LitterBug
So this is the BT1 servo. It is toast in my book unless I can get a new case for it. It was completely locked up after the recent flyaway and smack into the ground. The main shaft was bent and I had a spare set of gears for it. Unfortunately the case is a bit cracked and the top bearing shield area broke off. I'll use it to get everything in place until the new one arrives, but I will not fly with it.
Started the scratch rebuild of RCExplorer Baby Tricopter #1. Got the motors on and the ESCs wired for correct rotation over the weekend. Debating on using a DTFc flight controller or going with the "stock" F3FC Racing and Baby PDB. I'll have native dRonin support with the DTFc. The F3FC is only supported in dRonin by one of the developer's side builds. Both have support with the latest TriFlight (BetaFlight)
Have a variety of servos ordered in addition to the "stock" RCExplorer servo. Takes a while for parts to come from Sweden some times, and I want to have it back together before FliteFest next week. Plan on testing some of the other servos on one of the babies at some point too. Two of the potential servo candidates have faster stats, so it will be interesting to see what affect that has on the overall feel.
Cheers!
LitterBug
PsyBorg
Wake up! Time to fly!
I looked closer at that log with the video of the tail rotor. Does it always tune out at that angle to compensate for torque? I noticed it was constantly fighting to center tilting a little right even in straight forward flight. I know single rotor helis need to have side force to counter torque of the motors but the whole thing about a Tri is supposed to not need that with the counter rotating front motors.
If this constantly tunes out need that slight angle I would contemplate making an angled mount closer to that angle at neutral. At the very least it will make it a whole lot less wear and tear on the tilt servo under load forever hunting and fighting to keep a neutral state in forward flight. It will also get you slightly better flight times and less current draw on average.
If this constantly tunes out need that slight angle I would contemplate making an angled mount closer to that angle at neutral. At the very least it will make it a whole lot less wear and tear on the tilt servo under load forever hunting and fighting to keep a neutral state in forward flight. It will also get you slightly better flight times and less current draw on average.
One of the things I want to do is decase a Runcam HD V1. Should be able to get a better view of the tail without having to look through/around the FPV antenna.
The front motors are counter-rotating and the torque from both cancel each other out unless they are running at different speeds. The tail motor always sits at an angle to compensate for it's torque. There has to be some funny math to get the tail torque angle/speed correct. Any change in rear motor torque/thrust angle without any other motor changes will change roll/pitch/yaw. Changes in tail motor speed/torque without changing any other motors or tail thrust angle will also impact roll/pitch/yaw.
Really looking forward to playing with it at FFE. Hope that you will be able to spend some time with it too! Really want your input on tuning it in person. Tricopters really are a different beast and we are all madmen for falling under their spell!
Cheers!
LitterBug
The front motors are counter-rotating and the torque from both cancel each other out unless they are running at different speeds. The tail motor always sits at an angle to compensate for it's torque. There has to be some funny math to get the tail torque angle/speed correct. Any change in rear motor torque/thrust angle without any other motor changes will change roll/pitch/yaw. Changes in tail motor speed/torque without changing any other motors or tail thrust angle will also impact roll/pitch/yaw.
Really looking forward to playing with it at FFE. Hope that you will be able to spend some time with it too! Really want your input on tuning it in person. Tricopters really are a different beast and we are all madmen for falling under their spell!
Cheers!
LitterBug
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