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Twin F-100 Super Sabre Projects - Two Approaches to One Great Plane!

#41
DamoRC, Please there was no offense in my statement. I was an Air Force guy in a world of PHDs! I was schooled regularly. So much so that I wore a shoe around my neck like a Saint Bernard :) I really like the F-100 and what you guys are doing. I personally think that I am a better builder than flyer! And all my planes/ex-planes can attest to that. I do like a challenge though and so I am trying my hand at a foam board F-106. Like the F-100 not too many folks attempt builds on those two. So my hats off to you three for the F-100.
 
#42

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DamoRC

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#43
DamoRC, Please there was no offense in my statement. I was an Air Force guy in a world of PHDs! I was schooled regularly. So much so that I wore a shoe around my neck like a Saint Bernard :) I really like the F-100 and what you guys are doing. I personally think that I am a better builder than flyer! And all my planes/ex-planes can attest to that. I do like a challenge though and so I am trying my hand at a foam board F-106. Like the F-100 not too many folks attempt builds on those two. So my hats off to you three for the F-100.
None taken ;) . See, using original NACA documentation to make sure the duct will be genuine!

NACA.jpg
 

DamoRC

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#45
Finally made a start on the build. I'll gather the pics into a single document when its done.

Following the usual steps, printed out the plans and joined the sheets to make the plans for each part....

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...starting with the fuse pieces , cut the parts out and dry fit them into their frames.


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She's gonna be a bigger bird than I thought looking at the model in Sketchup - fuse looks like a slug standing on its head.

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Gorilla glued the score cuts and mounted the parts in their frames until they were set. Then I joined each section with hot glue. The tail section is not glued to the main fuse as I still have some work to do on installing the EDF.

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Added the canopy next (would not normally do this but I thought it would help her look more like a plane and less like a slug)

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Obligatory shot of the hollow fuse...

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Cut the tail feathers, reinforced with a little wood and dry fit to the tail.

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Current state of the build with internationally recognized standard of length for scale.

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Weather looking good here for the week (no rain forecast) so all going well she'll maiden this weekend.
 
#48
Gorilla glued the score cuts and mounted the parts in their frames until they were set.
I have used a few frames to shape my prototype + hot glue in the score cuts. I suppose the Gorilla glue makes for a lighter structure.
Can you describe the gain in strenght of your technic? 25% stronger? 200% ?

By the way, well done on the construction. How many hours do you put in the hobby per week !!? (..or you can keep it a secret :) )

au revoir
Gui
 

DamoRC

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#49
I have used a few frames to shape my prototype + hot glue in the score cuts. I suppose the Gorilla glue makes for a lighter structure.
Can you describe the gain in strenght of your technic? 25% stronger? 200% ?

By the way, well done on the construction. How many hours do you put in the hobby per week !!? (..or you can keep it a secret :) )

au revoir
Gui
Thanks! I don't have good numbers on what the strength / weight differences are. I started using GG so that I would have more time to get the glue into the opened score cuts (I fold them back to get the glue into the cut) and I wasn't able to do this fast enough with hot glue.

On the hours spent? I think just enough. Mrs DamoRC thinks way too much! I am "between jobs" at the moment so I have a little extra time.
 
#50
1. Very impressive, the uniformity of your creases and bends in your foam seem to be magic! How do you get them so uniform? Mine never look that good using a straight edge and my hand. Also great idea with the Guerrilla glue. Why haven't I thought of that by now!
2. You had mentioned that you were going to build a larger F-100. What are your dimensions. I take the PDF file and import it into MS Excel so that I can print them out multi-page. The straight import shows a 30 inch WS, I also resized them up to a 36 inch WS.
3. You may or may not be using Sheriff's prints? I note that you also have formers/jigs to improve your shape. So I assume you are using your own prints. Will you be posting yours?

Thanks
 

DamoRC

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#51
1. Very impressive, the uniformity of your creases and bends in your foam seem to be magic! How do you get them so uniform? Mine never look that good using a straight edge and my hand. Also great idea with the Guerrilla glue. Why haven't I thought of that by now!
2. You had mentioned that you were going to build a larger F-100. What are your dimensions. I take the PDF file and import it into MS Excel so that I can print them out multi-page. The straight import shows a 30 inch WS, I also resized them up to a 36 inch WS.
3. You may or may not be using Sheriff's prints? I note that you also have formers/jigs to improve your shape. So I assume you are using your own prints. Will you be posting yours?

Thanks
1 - Thanks - the creases are score cut on the inside of the part first using a straight edge and blade. Then they pretty much will always crease/fold in a straight line.
2 - Ehh - nope - not planning on making a bigger one - if anything I think that I could have made this a good bit smaller and still got the 70mm EDF in there (I should have listed to Sheriff about the split horizontal stabs because getting the EDF installed above the HS drove the scale for this build)
3. I am using my own set of plans for this and yes, I will be posting them once done.

@Sherrif - I am having a heck of a time trying to figure out the CG on mine. Per the online calculator that I normally use, it says the CG is approx 10 inches back from where the root meets the fuse. As a confirmation I looked at some 70 inch commercial models they say approx 13 inches back, which scaled to my 40 inch wingspan would be approx 7.5 inches back. On @thenated0g version (70 inches) I note a post that says the CG is 11 inches back. So my 10 inch calculated value seems way too far back - where did you put yours?

@Lynn Essman - Your Fly Fly model is 48inch span - where does the manual say your CG should be? Thanks in advance
 
#52
My CG is about 17cm (6.5 inches) behing the front of the wing root on a 29 inches wingspan. That would mean 9 inches on you model.

You can download my model from Google 3D Warehouse, display all the layers. There is a schematic wing that I used for calculation and it as 3 lines going across the wing root to indicate were the CG should be for trainer, advance, acrobatic flight caractéristics.
 
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#53
I will check on the manual and post. May different locations are out there. I think that my preference is somewhere between 1/2 inch forward of the manual's location. more when I find the manual?
 

thenated0g

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#54
i just checked mine and im pretty sure its 15 inches back on the 70". Let me go read my thread, i have a picture i think.
edit: 14.5" to 15.5". This is using an online calculator that takes the entire plane into consideration.
 
#55
My Fly Fly 90 mm EDF manual says 265mm from the front fuselage and wing intersection. See attached image.
The elevator throws should be more than shown for the up elevator. Up is more like 30-35mm to start. They are of course, full plan elevators.
Good start is more, then when you are comfortable with the CG you might want to tone down the up elevator. My moto is less power use more elevator until happy.

I have an old 90mm elf with 8 blade that I may stick into the 36 to 40mm. Not for speed but for lower power settings. I also have a 70mm that may be better all-around power set, but I live on the edge:) What edge I am never sure:)

I have the whole manual if wanted.
 

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thenated0g

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#57
being that we are not going supersonic i modified my main wings from the balsa plans i was using to draw off of. I moved the sweep a little less extreme and gave it a few inches more in the root and tip root and a few more inches of wingspan.
 

DamoRC

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#58
Thanks everyone for the prompt and helpful replies. It's nice to see that all three models agree well with each other putting my CG in the 8.5 - 9.0 inch range for the 40 inch span.

She's pretty much done. Flawed, but done. My friend who likes to take chase footage is flying tomorrow morning so I am gonna try to have her ready to maiden.
 

thenated0g

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#59
I forgot i had drawn up a "profile" version of my 70", in 48" wide. Looks like it calculated cg around 9.15". Going to make it a semi scale PSS plane (power scale slope). Be fully formed airfoil wings, but the fuselage would be a 2-2.5" thick piece of foam to keep it light. So from the side it would look scale as it flew by.
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#60
So let us know how it turns out. I attached a few pics of the elevator setup on foam..
Also my first shot at white foam a 78inch P-51 the side of fuselage are foam board. while the wing was made out of a Kenmore refrigerator card board. 16 inch prop and a 2500 super tiger motor. It's still in my shop! really
 

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