Twitchity Hex - Oh boy, here we go again!

[jhitesma]

That's pretty wacky... sounds like a work around but glad you got it sorted. I'd assume they'll adjust those values once some polish is put in and it's something that's being sold to the general public anyways.

The reason is because of the clock rate on the controller. MW and CF are running at 8Mhz but Tau is running at 12Mhz which makes things a little different. Here's the explanation from the git pull request:

I've done some outdoor tests with Quanton. I used 1000Hz MPU rate and set the PWM range 1500..3000 to produce 125..250µs signal range (multiplied by 12, because of the 12MHz time base). The copter was measured and set up by auto tune and the PIDs were high (higher than usually). It was very windy but the copter was still very good to control. The Flightmode Level was like nailed.

I'm still getting my head around all the different frequencies involved (rate of the processor, rate of the various timers, rate of communications between the FC and ESC, PWM rate of the ESC to control the motor, rate of the signals from the RX to the FC....)

And yes oneshot on Tau is still very experimental which is one of the reasons why it has to be enabled through the uavobjects browser and hasn't been added to the GCS GUI yet. It's kind of tricky to detect the situations when it can't be used and there's still some debate about how to add it to the GUI. (It has to do with the internal timers used for generating PWM and the variations between different boards that Tau supports.)

 

[jipp]

yeah, that picture reminds me of my own experience. they left me open in traction for 3 weeks while going in each day and cutting out infected tissue/bone.

so, the new boards do not have auto tune.. so i will have to go back a version.. ok ill tackle that problem when im ready to do so. because from the videos iv seen of of autotune it works damn well.

here is a picture of my knee after july 5th. laughs.. you can still see all the scars from the hospital stay.. over 55 operations on this leg.
the tibula popped out too about 3" above the ankle.. i always forget that.. but it did heal, so i guess that is why.


chris.


p.s

the nurse asks me if she could cut my pants off. hah, i was like yes give me drugs.. but of course they were checking for brain damage, i was just in pain and wanted to be put to sleep. 2 days of compound fracture pain was old.. i wanted sleep I was closing the picture and notice the pants in your picture and it made me remember the nurse asking to cut my totally trashed pants off. i was like whatever lady, give me drugs and put me to sleep!

 

[cranialrectosis]

yeah, that picture reminds me of my own experience. they left me open in traction for 3 weeks while going in each day and cutting out infected tissue/bone.

so, the new boards do not have auto tune.. so i will have to go back a version.. ok ill tackle that problem when im ready to do so. because from the videos iv seen of of autotune it works damn well.

here is a picture of my knee after july 5th. laughs.. you can still see all the scars from the hospital stay.. over 55 operations on this leg.
the tibula popped out too about 3" above the ankle.. i always forget that.. but it did heal, so i guess that is why.
View attachment 42637

chris.


p.s

the nurse asks me if she could cut my pants off. hah, i was like yes give me drugs.. but of course they were checking for brain damage, i was just in pain and wanted to be put to sleep. 2 days of compound fracture pain was old.. i wanted sleep I was closing the picture and notice the pants in your picture and it made me remember the nurse asking to cut my totally trashed pants off. i was like whatever lady, give me drugs and put me to sleep!

And THAT is why we say TAKE THE FREAKING PROPS OFF!!!!!

Sorry dude. That looks painful.

 

[jipp]

lol, would make a good warning for props heh. yeah unfortunately i can agree it hurts as bad as it looks. and of course i turned 40 last oct... and the older i get the more things hurt.. when i was a kid man i could fall from a second story building, break a leg and not even think twice. even tho i do not mind getting older, somethings about getting old just suck!

chris,

 

[jhitesma]

yeah, that picture reminds me of my own experience. they left me open in traction for 3 weeks while going in each day and cutting out infected tissue/bone.

Ouch, I got lucky and was able to avoid traction and keeping the wound open. I got the external fixator for 6 months while confined to a bed - was only even allowed a wheelchair only for getting to/from the bathroom (thankfully I was granted that!) and my appointments. I did get to enjoy thrice daily cleanings where the pins went into my leg - thankfully a cute blonde who had been dating one of my roommates volunteered for that duty which made it much easier to endure

so, the new boards do not have auto tune.. so i will have to go back a version.. ok ill tackle that problem when im ready to do so. because from the videos iv seen of of autotune it works damn well.

It's not the new boards, it's the new firmware. The boards are the same. You just have to flash the older release of the firmware to get autotune on CC3D. But that may change with the next release which probably won't be too far off.

here is a picture of my knee after july 5th. laughs.. you can still see all the scars from the hospital stay.. over 55 operations on this leg.
the tibula popped out too about 3" above the ankle.. i always forget that.. but it did heal, so i guess that is why.

Ouch, you did get it bad! I did my tibula as well and they basically told me "oh yeah, those break all the time and people don't even realize it. We don't do anything for them they heal on their own". Which rather surprised me. I'm not sure exactly what was sticking out on me since I didn't get to see it. My accident happened right in front of a Harley bar so not only did I have plenty of eye witnesses to back me up, but upon opening my eyes for the first time after hitting the ground I was greeted by a large bearded guy in leather holding my shoulders on the ground saying "Don't bother to try and stand up son, I'm not going to let you take a look at that leg and risk you passing out on me."

the nurse asks me if she could cut my pants off. hah, i was like yes give me drugs.. but of course they were checking for brain damage, i was just in pain and wanted to be put to sleep. 2 days of compound fracture pain was old.. i wanted sleep I was closing the picture and notice the pants in your picture and it made me remember the nurse asking to cut my totally trashed pants off. i was like whatever lady, give me drugs and put me to sleep!

Yep, the EMT asked me the same thing and I just laughed and told him to cut off anything he wanted to as long as it didn't have a blood supply The doc only gave me a 40% chance of keeping the leg "and even that's because i'm feeling lucky today". Only took me a bit more than half a dozen surgeries and the last one was worse than all the others put together. But a week after it I was on crutches finally and starting to move around again so it was worth it. It surprised me how after 6 months of being scolded for pushing things in my PT and <gasp> touching my leg to the ground the morning after the last operation a large overly cheerful nurse showed up saying "Ok, if you want to push that morphine button again you'll have to walk to the wall and back for me first. Don't worry that steel bar will hold you up even if your bone won't!"

But I digress. About done with work for the day (this project is hell but it's starting to come together!) and going to try and take a few minutes to update those settings and see if I can't get this thing to autotune!

 

[cranialrectosis]

this project is hell but it's starting to come together!

Thanks for taking this one on for the team!

 

[jhitesma]

Thanks for taking this one on for the team!

I wasn't talking about the hex The hex has been a complete joy if not a test of my patience

The project at work is the one that's killing me :black_eyed:


The hex is alive with the brain. Fixing the motor output range got the ESC's responding correctly. Then I found out that I had motors 5 and 6 swapped which was another easy fix. Then I found out I had all of the motors going the wrong direction, which thankfully was another easy fix (just one checkbox!)

But it took me about a half dozen trips between the notebook and the front yard with my mom trying to get photos of me the whole time so by the time I finally got it airborne and was able to kick in autotune I didn't have the mobius going anymore figured I was experiencing a case of success only occurring in private and failure in full public view

After the autotune it was flying great though! The yaw problem with the afromini is gone and it's super smooth and stable - but still VERY responsive on the sticks. The throttle curve feels a lot smoother on Tau as well with hover closer to mid stick - but much above that is still kind of scary. I've yet to try a full throttle punch out - will have to wait until I can get to a field for that! It also descends better now - on the mini it kept wanting to flop over and flip when I'd let off the throttle, but on Tau it just slows down more predictably.

I did get some video of flying it after getting it tuned but before I bumped the "rates" back up and I'll try and get that uploaded later tonight.

Overall though I'm SUPER happy with how the brain is flying it and I haven't even got to try most of the flight modes on it yet or the OSD or add a GPS. So this project is far from over and now that it flies so well I'm extra stoked about doing more with it.

The one thing I'm just a little disappointed in is it just doesn't have the punch I was expecting from 6 2204's. As light as it is in this configuration I really expected more - oh, it gets going when it gets going...but it takes it a bit more to get going. I may try putting my good 1300 on it to see how it does with a lighter pack still as I suspect it's the extra weight that's holding it back. I also haven't put the HQ props on yet so there's still some more performance hiding in there waiting for me



I also pulled out the twitchity 230 and gave them a little acro show. Man that little thing is fun. Both my mom and dad loved seeing me flip and roll that thing all over the front yard


Should have video by morning...going to take a bit of time for this old compute to render them out

 

[jipp]

afternoon. the tibula gets no love. laughs. funny, what the doctor said about it but it must be true.. i only had one doctor on shift that night who said we can always take the leg we see if we can save it, all the others were ready to cut it off. he was the lead surgeon, so his word was the law. he was a old guy, in his 60s.. so he had probably seen it all. but his logic was sound.. we can always take it later, so that is why they had so many darn operations.. little bit each day they would clean it out. i lost 8" of the bone. i could not put weight on my leg for 1 year. i lived in a wheel chair for 2 years, 3 years to learn to walk. yeah, i wish i was in front of someone to help me so i did not have to go through two days of hell crawling for help. but, i just do not have good luck. so i had to do it the hard way i guess. LOL.

ok, sorry for high jacking the thread about accidents.
chris.

 

[cranialrectosis]

I concur this copter isn't the monster the G10 version is for punchouts. I haven't tried 4S yet as I am running 2300kv Cobras too but I had planned to with the BlHeli 12A ESCs. I love how this copter flies. The power is smooooothe as butter and it doesn't take much for the copter to get up to speed.

Have you flipped it yet? Try a barrel roll too.

The snow has finally melted off and I got a good tune on my Twitchity Mini-Tri today. I flipped it for the first time (yes the weather here has been that freaking aweful) today and MAN what a kick!

Now I'm off to finish my rebuild of the CF hex and should have that in the air this evening.

I FREAKING LOVE DAYLIGHT SAVINGS TIME!

Can't wait to see how this Brain all comes together. At some point folks are going to ask you for step by step instructions.

 

[jhitesma]

I concur this copter isn't the monster the G10 version is for punchouts. I haven't tried 4S yet as I am running 2300kv Cobras too but I had planned to with the BlHeli 12A ESCs. I love how this copter flies. The power is smooooothe as butter and it doesn't take much for the copter to get up to speed.

Have you flipped it yet? Try a barrel roll too.

It is SUPER smooth, that's for sure! I just find it interesting how a quad and hex compare. It feels like a small vehicle with the 2204 motors and 6" props...but it's actually bigger overall than my 370 knuckle with 8" props. I kind of expected the Tau (the measurement not the name of the firmware!) to come in lower on autotune due to the smaller faster motors and smaller props with the KISS ESC's in oneshot. It is slightly lower than the knuckle but not as much lower as I expected. And the knuckle wasn't running oneshot yet which should get its Tau down a bit lower still.

Can't say I prefer hex or quad - they're just different and it's interesting to compare them.

I will say it's so freaking stable I was willing to let it hover hands off in acro - I've never been willing to do that on any of my quads!

I haven't tried any flips yet, still pushing up the "rates" and I'd like to get the top on it before I do that Been tempted...but I just don't feel confident enough with it to try acrobatics in the front yard and haven't had time to get to the field.

The video was still rendering when I went to bed last night. I'll try and get it uploaded later today.

The snow has finally melted off and I got a good tune on my Twitchity Mini-Tri today. I flipped it for the first time (yes the weather here has been that freaking aweful) today and MAN what a kick!

Now I'm off to finish my rebuild of the CF hex and should have that in the air this evening.

So glad I don't have to deal with that white stuff. But the wind lately has been crazy, was so happy to have dead calm yesterday evening for a bit! Was hoping for more of that today but it's back to windy again.

I FREAKING LOVE DAYLIGHT SAVINGS TIME!

I love not having to deal with it - wish the rest of the country would catch up

Can't wait to see how this Brain all comes together. At some point folks are going to ask you for step by step instructions.

I'm looking to try and do some screencasting of setting it up....problem is I'm using a custom build of GCS and can only build for linux and my linux computers are way too slow to try and record the screen from. I really need to bite the bullet and move my good computer into the back so I can get more serious about videos.

Even the one I put together last night of the tuning flights is horribly edited because the computer just can't run editing software well and drops frames like crazy when editing. So cutting and splicing accurately is almost impossible.

I did do another test flight at lunch and am just absolutely loving how this flies. On both Tau acro and MWRate modes it's a dream in how it handles. Will probably try to get the FPV gear on it tonight!

 

[jipp]

yeah wind is strong today..

i have a question. i know most use GPS to hover around the one spot. but could we use a ping sensor? im looking at robotic stuff to see if there are more options for our airframes.

chris.

 

[jhitesma]

Debating trying one of my 1300 packs....put the watt meter on with my 2200 to see what kind of numbers I'm getting.

At full throttle I got about 82amps and 800watts. And could barely hold the thing down it was pulling so hard.

I guess it should be ok on one of my 1300 45-90c packs...if that rating is valid...would sure be pushing things though...not that I've been able to get anywhere near full throttle.

Heck that's just barely within spec on the 2200 40C pack I tested with.

Good think I picked up a couple of 2200 35-45c packs...but even with those I'm thinking I may need to pickup a few higher C packs for this beast!

yeah wind is strong today..

i have a question. i know most use GPS to hover around the one spot. but could we use a ping sensor? im looking at robotic stuff to see if there are more options for our airframes.

chris.

You mean sonar? People have used them, they're mainly useful for altitude hold and auto land though.

 

[jhitesma]

Gave it a go with the 1300.

Tau on autotune went from 0.0331 to 0.0282 (Though due to the wind today my noise figures jumped from around 12 to around 35) so that's a not insignificant change in response just by changing to a smaller lighter battery.

Flying on the new tune it was noticeable as well, still super silky smooth and stable - but even more responsive.

Really hope the wind is calm tomorrow and I get a chance to hit the field for a little bit...

 

[jhitesma]

And...here's the first video since the Brain install:

First 4 minutes are me making mistakes regarding motor connections and directions. Left that in since I figured some people may find it interesting to see what a hex does when every motor is spinning the wrong direction

The rest is two test flights - first on bone stock settings after autotune, then one more after I bumped the max rates up a bit (Rates work a little different on Tau than on MW/BF/CF you don't set a multiplier like on MW setups instead you set the maximum degrees per second it will translate at full stick.)

I still had an unusually large deadband on my RC inputs from when I was trying to figure out the issues caused by the reversed motors. And I haven't setup a throttle curve yet. Plus I was really pushing things around seeing how it would react. But I think it shows that it's flying MUCH better than it did on the afromini/CF.

Most of this was in acro. I did do a little bit in horizon just to see if it was working, and a tiny bit in altitude hold (though I didn't expect that to work since the baro is totally exposed right now.) Even in acro I can't get over how incredibly stable it is now! I don't think I've ever been brave enough to look away from a multi even for a split second when flying acro before like I did a few times in this vid!

 

[jipp]

yeah, i guess its a sonar, the element 14 webpage called it a ping sensor.. same thing tho. has two probes, shoots out, then bounces back.. and then it can do whatever you program it too.

i

the brain looks very stable tho thats for sure. very impressive. by the way what props are you using on the
hex, ( well ill be getting a twitchy hex down the road, looks to darn cool not to get one :d looks like its fun to fly and yet different enough to a quad. so quad, hex, tri.. seem to have there own mojo for flying.. just have to try each frame out to see what i prefer i guess. )
chris.

 

[narcolepticltd]

Success! man I'm glad to see the experiments are going well with this thing. Much better results!

 

[nilsen]

I didn't realise how large it is! Congrats on the Maiden

 

[Twitchity]

The brain board looks like it's treating you well. Looking forward to seeing what else you do with this frame.

 

[cranialrectosis]

I run 1800 45-90C or 2200 45-90C lipos. The 1300 45-90 just don't cut it for long and the 1300 35Cs don't cut it at all. I am seriously considering an 1800 4S 45-90C lipo although I know the motors won't take WOT.

Some things I note from your video.

"Stand back. This is extremely experimental". Yeah When I maiden a hex I am alone in the yard.

I cannot believe you launch this by hand. I note you don't try to catch it.

"It is so stable in acro mode". Yeah. This copter with a Naze almost flies itself. It will park and does so well. There is more ballast for light breezes and with the 330mm width it needs to be told to be twitchy. Horizon mode is just rock solid.

Flip it. Try a barrel roll. This copter will flip and roll MUCH more naturally with momentum. Fly it LOS like a fixed wing, you have the wide span that gives you superior flight control surfaces. When you can get this out to stretch its legs, you will be stunned.

Put lights on it. I know you don't plan to fly LOS much but when you can stretch its legs, lights help and with the PDB, are easy to install. It isn't FGA 6S fast, but the speed on this hex is subtle. It is less like a 600CC Ninja or Acro Quad. It has power like a big 1700CC V-Twin. Not the quickest off the line, but a serious contender in the stretch.

I put the top plate on mine and set the lipo on top. This allows me to put zip tie landing gear on the bottom and not scuff up the CF and lipos.

So far, the most damage I have been able to cause in crashes similar to the ones you have had (and one encounter with a rosebush) is sand in the motors and broken props. It has been, so far, as tough as my WarpQuad and much tougher than the FT kits or a 3D printed frame.

 

[jhitesma]

The brain board looks like it's treating you well. Looking forward to seeing what else you do with this frame.

For an initial quick and dirty tune - yeah it's rocking already! Started putting the FPV gear on last night, top deck is on but realized I didn't have the right size screws and nuts to mount the board cam, going to have to make a run to the hobby shop today and hope they have what I need this time!

Just wondering if I'll be able to get enough tilt on the camera