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Forest service ban?

nhk750

Aviation Enthusiast
#1
I was looking at some camping reservations and noticed these banners on the side of the US Forest Service page. Do you think it only applies to multi-rotors? what do they consider a drone? My airplanes are not drones? I may have inadvertently broken this unknown rule a few times. Is this an FAA rule? I know FROM FLYING GA, that in some National park areas you need to maintain 2,000 AGL. Jeeez, you need a degree to know all the rules!


IMG_1934.JPG
 

Snarls

Gravity Tester
Mentor
#2
I know you are not allowed to fly in any national parks. As for national forests and reservations I don't know, but I would not be surprised given all the recent issues with drones and forest firefighting.
 

LitterBug

Troll Spammer
#3
Pretty sure it applies to anything flying in any national park. Unfortunately, the handful of clueless people that crashed into hot springs, tormented wildlife, and irritated those seeking peace and quiet out in the wilderness have messed it up for everyone. Might be best to check with the main office for the location you are going, and ask if they allow it and/or have a waiver process.
 

TexMechsRobot

Posted a thousand or more times
#4
"Unmanned Aircraft Systems and Drones" seems pretty definitive to me. The picture is a quad but they're saying don't fly anything.
 

nhk750

Aviation Enthusiast
#5
They should change the picture and make it more clear, but I guess I'm like the bureaucrats, I dont like drones either...technically though, I am manning my aircraft, I'm just not present inside of it...
 

PsyBorg

Wake up! Time to fly!
Mentor
#6
Try splittin hairs all ya want.. Just have a big bank account for the legal process. This is and will continue to be a revenue stream for state governments just like car licences and mandatory insurances which I believe will be the next phase for our hobby. Then that will follow with more levels of certifications all thanks to the stupid people who will not follow common sense rules no matter what.
 

FlyingMonkey

Stuck in Sunny FL
Staff member
Admin
#7
I think drone pilots need to get unified, and show that there's tourism dollars being lost by banning "drones" from, well, everywhere.

Limited access, restricted flight times, guided drone photography tours, there's plenty of ways that they could integrate drone use into the other recreational activities already allowed. Heck, government forests allow UTV/ATVs hunting, boating, dirtbikes, horseback riding. All of those are more destructive to the land and animals than us flying our cameras around. But many of the public lands have allowances for them.
 

cranialrectosis

Faster than a speeding faceplant!
Mentor
#8
If I see someone flying in the forest they are going to hear from me.

If I go into the forest on horseback or on an ATV with a firearm and a chainsaw, the risk of me causing a fire is pretty small. I run mufflers and spark arrestors and I don't shoot tracers in the forest.

Unlike bullets, (tracers being the exception) lipos bring their own fuel to a fire. Lipo fires are hard to put out. You aren't going to stomp one out with your boot before it gets ugly. A lipo fire is ugly from the get go.

A damaged flight battery in the forest is a huge threat. If my chainsaw sparks a fire, I will step on it. If my plane hits a tree and the lipo catches fire 40' in the air, there is nothing I can do.

Imagine that situation and let that sink in. You crash into a tree and your lipo starts a fire and all you can do is watch your craft torch the forest...

I don't fly over people. Hitting a kid with a spinning prop would give me nightmares for life. I don't fly in the forest because torching God's country would end me as a pilot, laws or no laws.

I don't support a law banning lipos in the forest, but if I see you flying over the trees with a lipo, you are going to, politely, hear from me. :)
 
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rockyboy

Skill Collector
Mentor
#9
If I see someone flying in the forest they are going to hear from me.

If I go into the forest on horseback or on an ATV with a firearm and a chainsaw, the risk of me causing a fire is pretty small. I run mufflers and spark arrestors and I don't shoot tracers in the forest.

Unlike bullets, (tracers being the exception) lipos bring their own fuel to a fire. Lipo fires are hard to put out. You aren't going to stomp one out with your boot before it gets ugly. A lipo fire is ugly from the get go.

A damaged flight battery in the forest is a huge threat. If my chainsaw sparks a fire, I will step on it. If my plane hits a tree and the lipo catches fire 40' in the air, there is nothing I can do.

Imagine that situation and let that sink in. You crash into a tree and you lipo starts a fire and all you can do is watch your craft torch the forest...

I don't fly over people. Hitting a kid with a spinning prop would give me nightmares for life. I don't fly in the forest because torching God's country would end me as a pilot, laws or no laws.

I don't support a law banning lipos in the forest, but if I see you flying over the trees with a lipo, you are going to, politely, hear from me. :)
All this plus the idiots crashing quadcopters into the mineral mud pits in yellowstone that haven't been disturbed in over a century is why I do support this. I've had a lipo get all angry and smokey on a crash on the other end of the field. Luckily it was in short grass with morning dew and didn't go full on flame, but it certainly gave me a wake up call.

If you do want to fly in a wilderness / forest service area there is a way to do it. Get your Part 107 license and file a request. Just like if you want to fly in town or a commercial area or at a public event.
 

kdobson83

Well-known member
#10
So, Lipo fires are the reason for banning drones in parks and national forests? Sounds fishy to me. What if ur not using lipos? What if your RC plane has Nicad batteries or the new dry cell lipos in it? How come ALL RC isn't banned? I've got a Traxxas Stamped that runs on 2s lipos that in a bad crash could explode a lipo just as easily, but it's not banned. And not trying to start an argument, but an ATV can start fires just as easily as a lipo. Maybe not everyone has a nice newish well kept ATV, maybe they have an older model or don't maintain it and they run it into a tree and blam, fire. What if you want to fly your fire prone drone over a lake in the middle of said park? Hard to cause a lipo fire on water.
I'm sure they have their reasons however misguided they are for banning "drones". But unless the government and society itself stops blaming and punishing the whole for the acts of a few, this is sadly how things work. There is a PRIVATE owned public park system in Louisville KY called the parklands. Its a huge swath of park that follows a local creek for about 10 miles or so. Well kept fields just begging to be flown in. They have a no drone policy. I learned this by flying my FT Tiny Trainer there and was told I couldn't. I emailed the park system and pleaded my case. Nothing. They don't care that they can make money off of the hobby, they don't care if it is in a way, discrimination. They care only that the general public looks negatively on the "drone" industry and feel it is easier to just say no drones and not have to worry about the inevitable lawsuit or bad press over one bad egg.
It reminds me of when the company I use to work for would punish everyone for one person who was dumb. I called it throwing a grenade at the problem.

So, long story short, yeah, I'd say they mean you can't fly anything there. The reason, who knows. It's easier to say no I guess.
 

PsyBorg

Wake up! Time to fly!
Mentor
#11
I have not had the pleasure to ignite a lipo yet but Bills Law + the Law of averages dictates it MUST happen at some point. That is kinda why I like racing quads more as If there is a problem its normally in the open and its not a long way to get to if there is that odd chance a fire starts. That is one of my main fears in life. Burning down a house or worse others property.

I hadn't really thought of that issue with park flying regulation and was more against it because of seeing more and more idiots harassing wildlife with it. I know I wont do things like that so personally I do not want regulation but when you factor in the stupid people It HAS to be done in some form. I just despise the government involvement because along with their regulations come fees to feed the corrupt machine it has become.
 

rockyboy

Skill Collector
Mentor
#12
I've got a Traxxas Stamped that runs on 2s lipos that in a bad crash could explode a lipo just as easily, but it's not banned.
SHHH!!!! Don't let 'em know that - they will ban those too!!

An ATV can start fires just as easily as a lipo. Maybe not everyone has a nice newish well kept ATV, maybe they have an older model or don't maintain it and they run it into a tree and blam, fire.
SHHHH!!!! Don't let 'em know that either - we'll end up with annual inspection stickers on ATV's next.

What if you want to fly your fire prone drone over a lake in the middle of said park? Hard to cause a lipo fire on water.
With a Part 107 license and that explanation for the flight plan I'd think a waiver for flight over water should be easy to get. Not saying it is easy to get - just that it should be.
 

FlyingMonkey

Stuck in Sunny FL
Staff member
Admin
#13
I personally would like to see some access provided to drone pilots in public lands.

You might argue it's because I'm a drone pilot, but...

fred fire.jpg rangered.jpg
 

cranialrectosis

Faster than a speeding faceplant!
Mentor
#16
I don't like bans either. It is illegal to throw a football or fly a small foamie in a city park in Colorado Springs without a permit. There is a $250 fine if they catch you.

The city has never given a permit to fly anything in a park since the law was created in 2005.


Liberty means we are free to do what we choose without needing license from the government. Justice means we reap what we sow for better or worse.

The government position is that we have skipped out on justice and therefore do not deserve liberty.

I do not hold to that.

I do believe that we as pilots have an AWESOME responsibility to fly within our means and to be responsible for our actions. If you can't pay to repair your neighbor's roof, don't fly over it. If you can't afford to pay for the forest, don't risk burning it down.

IMO, bans like this demonstrate that our government has forgotten who it works for.

By all means, open public land for liberty and justice. This is what public land is for.

Just remember, justice is a B***H for people who don't look before they leap. :)
 
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nhk750

Aviation Enthusiast
#19
If I see someone flying in the forest they are going to hear from me.

If I go into the forest on horseback or on an ATV with a firearm and a chainsaw, the risk of me causing a fire is pretty small. I run mufflers and spark arrestors and I don't shoot tracers in the forest.

Unlike bullets, (tracers being the exception) lipos bring their own fuel to a fire. Lipo fires are hard to put out. You aren't going to stomp one out with your boot before it gets ugly. A lipo fire is ugly from the get go.

A damaged flight battery in the forest is a huge threat. If my chainsaw sparks a fire, I will step on it. If my plane hits a tree and the lipo catches fire 40' in the air, there is nothing I can do.

Imagine that situation and let that sink in. You crash into a tree and your lipo starts a fire and all you can do is watch your craft torch the forest...

I don't fly over people. Hitting a kid with a spinning prop would give me nightmares for life. I don't fly in the forest because torching God's country would end me as a pilot, laws or no laws.

I don't support a law banning lipos in the forest, but if I see you flying over the trees with a lipo, you are going to, politely, hear from me. :)
I actually flew at the beach once and it was forest service land. I dont think you can burn the ocean or sand down, unless you had a atom bomb on board...😳