lonewolf7717
Senior Member
oh my, i like that thumb tack idea! typically i go the route of either a small piece of tin cut from the top of a can or beans or soup or some small #6 flat washers. thumb tack seems like less mess and better adhesion.
Hobby King Red Swan Balsa Glider Build Thread
- Thread starter Joker 53150
- Start date
lonewolf7717
Senior Member
if comfortable with soldering, why not go ahead and open up servo to attach longer lead to board itself for a cleaner install? Granted things to get pretty small inside.
It works well, and gives you a reassuring "CLICK" as the magnet touches the tack letting you know the canopy is closed properly. In my picture you won't see any room between the tack and the balsa it's glued to. Usually there is a slight gap, but I glued the balsa in a little higher than I should have. The idea is that the balsa placement doesn't need to be perfect, and the tack will sink in only as far as it has to for proper canopy closure.
Where were you with that idea yesterday before I started cutting and soldering?
Although in this case it wouldn't have worked - those tiny servos use very thin gauge wires and all I have is the standard size which would have been too big to fit into the servo case. I would do that on a standard 9 gram servo though.
The covering finally arrived, so I can get going on the final work. Looks like this plane should be ready to fly in the next few days. I'll have to swipe the receiver from another plane for a while until I get around to ordering a few more of them.
While waiting for the covering I couldn't just sit around, so I started construction on the SunBird, a motorized glider similar to the Red Swan. It's also from Hobby King and it also suffers from crappy instructions, limited build assistance, and questionable laser cut quality. The build thread I started can be found HERE. The SunBird is a copy of the Bird of Time, but smaller in size. I've really been wanting to build the BoT for a while now, but it's way too large for my limited flying space. Well, it probably isn't, but if I start thinking I have the room I'll end up buying it and I don't want to spend the money right now.
While waiting for the covering I couldn't just sit around, so I started construction on the SunBird, a motorized glider similar to the Red Swan. It's also from Hobby King and it also suffers from crappy instructions, limited build assistance, and questionable laser cut quality. The build thread I started can be found HERE. The SunBird is a copy of the Bird of Time, but smaller in size. I've really been wanting to build the BoT for a while now, but it's way too large for my limited flying space. Well, it probably isn't, but if I start thinking I have the room I'll end up buying it and I don't want to spend the money right now.
Rudder/elevator only on the BoT. Unless you're Josh Bixler, at which time you can add motor control as well, as the original BoT was purely a glider without motor. I don't know what it is about that wing design, but I really fell for that style.
Me, too. I love the lines. These also have similar wing designs. Been thinking about getting them...
http://www.ebay.com/itm/190810739002?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1438.l2648
http://www.ebay.com/itm/190810739002?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1438.l2648
quorneng
Master member
Joker 53150
Nice build
3.7g aileron servos - well done
As you have in effect 'soldered in' the servo why not permanently fix it in as well and save a bit of weight.
I have 60 (that's right six zero!) 3.7g and 5g all permanently glued in and I haven't had to replace one yet.
Yes getting 32AWG servo wire can be a bit of a trial but particularly on big wing span gliders with small servos the weight of the connecting wire (and connectors) starts to mount up.
Nice build
3.7g aileron servos - well done
As you have in effect 'soldered in' the servo why not permanently fix it in as well and save a bit of weight.
I have 60 (that's right six zero!) 3.7g and 5g all permanently glued in and I haven't had to replace one yet.
Yes getting 32AWG servo wire can be a bit of a trial but particularly on big wing span gliders with small servos the weight of the connecting wire (and connectors) starts to mount up.
The servos are actually hot glued to the mounting plates, so I'll call them "semi permanent". If a servo ever fails I'll have to cut the covering to get at the wiring, but I can live with those odds.
The covering I was waiting for was a roll of white SoLite, so now the fuselage and wing covering can get finished. I'm starting off with the fuselage, not 100% sure what I'm going to do for a final design, but I've got ideas to work with as I go along. The fuselage is first covered with a full wrap of the white. It won't stay that way for long though. You can see in the picture how thin this material is. The standard weight films wouldn't be nearly as translucent as this film is. Some people hate using this stuff as it sticks to itself so well, but that is one of the things I really like about it. It's too lightweight to use on larger planes, but on something lightweight like the Red Swan it's perfect.
Step two in the fuselage covering is giving it some visual impact. Red was used across the entire bottom.
The line between the red and white was trimmed with a thin stripe of yellow. With wing covering underway I again used yellow between the colors, in this case a thicker line to go with the larger solid color panels. I like to think that's pretty artistic of me, but honestly if this ends up looking good it's about 80% blind luck. A little more quality time and the wing will be finished up. After that, it's just a few remaining details and the plane is ready for the maiden flight!
Step two in the fuselage covering is giving it some visual impact. Red was used across the entire bottom.
The line between the red and white was trimmed with a thin stripe of yellow. With wing covering underway I again used yellow between the colors, in this case a thicker line to go with the larger solid color panels. I like to think that's pretty artistic of me, but honestly if this ends up looking good it's about 80% blind luck. A little more quality time and the wing will be finished up. After that, it's just a few remaining details and the plane is ready for the maiden flight!
It's ready for flight! Well, almost ready. I only need to install the aileron pushrods and glue in a couple skids for the bottom and it'll be ready for flight on the next decent day.
Now that it's basically done I can see if my weight goal was accomplished.
Red Swan #1's AUW with an 850mAh 3S is 405 grams.
Red Swan #2's AUW with a 1000mAh 2S is 360 grams.
Only 45 grams difference (about 1-1/2 ounces). Damn, not as light as I wanted. But how could that be with all the stuff I cut out and the lighter building techniques?
Here's what I have concluded (guessed)...
- Battery weight between the 850 3S and 1000 2S is within 5 grams with the 1000 being lighter.
- The balsa I cut from the fuselage and wing added up, but not as much as I had hoped.
- There MIGHT be heavier balsa used on RS#2 which kept me from losing as much as I had wanted. When all else fails, blame it on poor Chinese quality!
- The prop on RS#1 might weigh 3-5 grams with the prop saver, while the folding prop on RS#2 weighs 30 grams!
With identical props RS#2 might have gotten down to about 330 grams, a 2-1/2 ounce difference.
I've added no dead weight or ballast to either to achieve balance. I was somewhat concerned if anything would be needed as I was cutting out all the extra balsa in the fuselage. Turns out it wasn't a problem. The ESC and battery on RS#2 are located at the back end of the canopy while on RS#1 they're pushed into the nose.
So it isn't as light as I wanted, but one of my goals was to make this plane soar/float better than #1, to take advantage of any thermal lift I can find. That big lump of folding prop is heavy, but needed to balance out the plane. I could go with a lighter folding prop or even a regular prop like RS#1, but that means I'll have to add weight to the nose to balance it out again, so I'm going to look at it in a positive light and say the heavy folding prop HELPS me instead of hurts me. Plus, since it is a folding prop I should get a more efficient glide. I'm not sure what to expect yet with climbing power compared to the 3S and standard prop of RS#1, it'll be interesting to find out how it compares.
Now, I just sit back and wait for good weather!
Now that it's basically done I can see if my weight goal was accomplished.
Red Swan #1's AUW with an 850mAh 3S is 405 grams.
Red Swan #2's AUW with a 1000mAh 2S is 360 grams.
Only 45 grams difference (about 1-1/2 ounces). Damn, not as light as I wanted. But how could that be with all the stuff I cut out and the lighter building techniques?
Here's what I have concluded (guessed)...
- Battery weight between the 850 3S and 1000 2S is within 5 grams with the 1000 being lighter.
- The balsa I cut from the fuselage and wing added up, but not as much as I had hoped.
- There MIGHT be heavier balsa used on RS#2 which kept me from losing as much as I had wanted. When all else fails, blame it on poor Chinese quality!
- The prop on RS#1 might weigh 3-5 grams with the prop saver, while the folding prop on RS#2 weighs 30 grams!
With identical props RS#2 might have gotten down to about 330 grams, a 2-1/2 ounce difference.
I've added no dead weight or ballast to either to achieve balance. I was somewhat concerned if anything would be needed as I was cutting out all the extra balsa in the fuselage. Turns out it wasn't a problem. The ESC and battery on RS#2 are located at the back end of the canopy while on RS#1 they're pushed into the nose.
So it isn't as light as I wanted, but one of my goals was to make this plane soar/float better than #1, to take advantage of any thermal lift I can find. That big lump of folding prop is heavy, but needed to balance out the plane. I could go with a lighter folding prop or even a regular prop like RS#1, but that means I'll have to add weight to the nose to balance it out again, so I'm going to look at it in a positive light and say the heavy folding prop HELPS me instead of hurts me. Plus, since it is a folding prop I should get a more efficient glide. I'm not sure what to expect yet with climbing power compared to the 3S and standard prop of RS#1, it'll be interesting to find out how it compares.
Now, I just sit back and wait for good weather!
quorneng
Master member
Yes, its very interesting building two geometrically identical planes too see how much weigh can be saved.
In general you tend to find any saving is quite small (if its a popular design its strength to weight tends to be reasonable) unless you radically alter the structure or the construction materials. 11% is not bad (provided you have not compromised the structure!).
In general you tend to find any saving is quite small (if its a popular design its strength to weight tends to be reasonable) unless you radically alter the structure or the construction materials. 11% is not bad (provided you have not compromised the structure!).
Radically altering things is always fun. In fact, I'm contemplating buying two more of these Red Swan kits to make some major structural changes. Not simply trying to make a lighter version, but bigger overall changes. I'm finding this a strong and relatively generic design that lends itself to some pretty crazy ideas.
Landing gear, maybe retractable?
EDF.
Shortened wing.
I've got some crazy ideas rolling around in my head right now...
Landing gear, maybe retractable?
EDF.
Shortened wing.
I've got some crazy ideas rolling around in my head right now...
rcspaceflight
creator of virtual planes
Radically altering things is always fun. In fact, I'm contemplating buying two more of these Red Swan kits to make some major structural changes. Not simply trying to make a lighter version, but bigger overall changes. I'm finding this a strong and relatively generic design that lends itself to some pretty crazy ideas.
Landing gear, maybe retractable?
EDF.
Shortened wing.
I've got some crazy ideas rolling around in my head right now...
That is why I want to buy a balsa build kit or two. It's nice to have all the pieces cut out, you just have to glue it, but I know I can build the pieces together anyway I want. I'm thinking of buying two kits and either build them together wing tip to wing tip to have a twin engine. Or stack the wings and make a bi-wing. (But not with the Red Swan. Probably the Cloud Dancer.) The alterations are endless.
Success! I took the RS out for a quick maiden flight today. The wind is gusting more than I want, but I didn't want to wait for a real break in the weather. Winds up to around 10mph and temp of 35F.
Usually I take-off or hand-launch from the pavement, but with the wind and an untested plane I headed out into the field and gave it a toss. Balance and handling was fine, with the only adjustment needed in the ailerons. There just isn't enough throw to give me good control so I'll do some tweaking before the next flight.
This quick flight was only 6 minutes, which is how long it took for me to lose feeling in my thumbs. I'd use a transmitter cover/bag to help keep me warm, but that is hard to do when I have to hand-launch the plane. My flying gloves have the thumb-tip and pointer-finger tip cut off so I can feel the controls - until my hands go numb...! In the 6 minutes I did about 50/50 mix of powered flight and gliding which used about 25% of the 1000mAh 2S battery (according to the Hobby King meter).
For the glide-slope, I didn't notice any real tendency to drop quickly and the plane seemed to glide well. When it was time to land I had to make a few runs at it to get used to how much it wanted to glide. I ended up throwing a little down elevator into it to force it down more quickly. The wind gusts didn't make it super easy, but it landed perfectly safely in the grass.
Along with the aileron adjustment I'll give it a good nut & bolt inspection before putting it into the rotation with the rest of the planes. Sadly, with the upcoming winter weather I think most of the planes will have a good layer of balsa dust before they see the sky again.
Usually I take-off or hand-launch from the pavement, but with the wind and an untested plane I headed out into the field and gave it a toss. Balance and handling was fine, with the only adjustment needed in the ailerons. There just isn't enough throw to give me good control so I'll do some tweaking before the next flight.
This quick flight was only 6 minutes, which is how long it took for me to lose feeling in my thumbs. I'd use a transmitter cover/bag to help keep me warm, but that is hard to do when I have to hand-launch the plane. My flying gloves have the thumb-tip and pointer-finger tip cut off so I can feel the controls - until my hands go numb...! In the 6 minutes I did about 50/50 mix of powered flight and gliding which used about 25% of the 1000mAh 2S battery (according to the Hobby King meter).
For the glide-slope, I didn't notice any real tendency to drop quickly and the plane seemed to glide well. When it was time to land I had to make a few runs at it to get used to how much it wanted to glide. I ended up throwing a little down elevator into it to force it down more quickly. The wind gusts didn't make it super easy, but it landed perfectly safely in the grass.
Along with the aileron adjustment I'll give it a good nut & bolt inspection before putting it into the rotation with the rest of the planes. Sadly, with the upcoming winter weather I think most of the planes will have a good layer of balsa dust before they see the sky again.
If I actually get another Red Swan, here's what I'm thinking of doing with it:
EDF, twin rudders, shorter wing, drooping wingtips, and landing gear. Nothing too major...
EDF, twin rudders, shorter wing, drooping wingtips, and landing gear. Nothing too major...
I probably could start it from scratch, but the kit would simply jump-start the project drastically. The RS is the right size, has the right proportions, and will just save me a ton of time. Plus doing the wing ribs from scratch has been my weak point, and I'm never happy with the results.
While I haven't designed and built a plane completely from scratch before I've gotten close with my Navion. The kit only included the most basic fuselage structure and the full wing, but I modified everything heavily and built much of the plane from scratch and I haven't been so nervous on a maiden flight since I started flying.
