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Marvel's Avengers/S.H.I.E.L.D. Quinjet

jfaleo1

Junior Member
#41
Last post on this till I fly it. All I need to do is write my registration on it and velcro the battery in. It's older (smaller) brother and the SS2 (which will likely crash horribly) are ready to go when I get a break to go fly. Hope you all appreciate the nod to what I imagine the engine manufacturer to be.;)
FYI based on static thrust numbers I am 1:1 T:W but realism breaks in and I think it is more likely .9:1 or .8:1.I am including the pdf from the CG calc site if you are curious but it has a high wing loading and it is heavy compared to what I want so we will see....:cool:
 

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Zephyr1

Well-known member
#42
Last post on this till I fly it. All I need to do is write my registration on it and velcro the battery in. It's older (smaller) brother and the SS2 (which will likely crash horribly) are ready to go when I get a break to go fly. Hope you all appreciate the nod to what I imagine the engine manufacturer to be.;)
FYI based on static thrust numbers I am 1:1 T:W but realism breaks in and I think it is more likely .9:1 or .8:1.I am including the pdf from the CG calc site if you are curious but it has a high wing loading and it is heavy compared to what I want so we will see....:cool:
Best of luck!! I've got all the pieces cut out and i'm just waiting for engine fan replacements! It really does look sweet.
 

L Edge

Well-known member
#43
I had a previous version and I know about where to start from that. However with 41 years behind me on this I start with 30 to 33% MAC (mean aerodynamic cord) and go from there. I know there is a calculator online but have not tried it, maybe I will and see what it says.
Nose heavy is always better but I can handle neutral or even a little tail heavy. Right now I am very close to neutral at 35% which is a little more tail heavy than I would like but I still can adjust a little bit with the battery placement or I could run two 4s 2200 packs instead of the single.
Calculator gives me about the same range I am in right now but I am aft of optimal.

Just realized your question may mean how will I actually test it. The answer is fly it:)
Yup, good luck!!!
 

jfaleo1

Junior Member
#44
Heading out to maiden or fail one or the other! Taking along v4, v3, SS2, and an ME-163 Komet from zephyr1’s plans. See how all this goes!😉😀
Oh and new video camera too
 

jfaleo1

Junior Member
#45
Well, that was mixed results at best. The old V3 took to the air again this time without the elevators warping constantly. Now I have a much better feel for the pitch down effect from the motors meaning thrust angle must be adjusted some. High throttle creates a significant nose down effect but it is not that bad during mid throttle range, nose must be trimmed down as power is reduced or it is difficult to land as stall sets in fast you will see in video as soon as I figure out posting it. V4 was very fast, on the ground.:rolleyes: First attempt twisted nose gear, second and third ran off runway. I need to extend the length of the nose gear, or shorten mains, and I think I will move nose gear forward for stability. also the pitching moment is likely an issue here as well, so this all may require major surgery or a complete rebuild. :confused: Video here to follow as well.
 

jfaleo1

Junior Member
#49
Fixed the retract mount, moved nose gear forward and down. AOA for takeoff is much improved, may still put smaller wheels on the mains.
Considering a moderate trust vector for takeoff and high power, something like a secondary elevator below the exhaust to vector some of the thrust upwards to push the tail down, likely two or three positions but I do have a dial available to me. May even just make it a secondary elevator but i think that will be overkill.
 

Namactual

Well-known member
#50
The secondary elevator sounds interesting. I would be wary of the leverage causing a sudden pitch up, lift and then stall before you had time to react, but that could be tweaked with the size of the elevator.

Looking forward to seeing what you come up with.(y)
 

jfaleo1

Junior Member
#51
The secondary elevator sounds interesting. I would be wary of the leverage causing a sudden pitch up, lift and then stall before you had time to react, but that could be tweaked with the size of the elevator.

Looking forward to seeing what you come up with.(y)
Well here is what I have come up with right now....
Added an elevator/thrust vector plate under the exhaust. The new surface is on the dial on the transmitter with no mixing until I know how much it takes to work, if it works at all. Had to switch from the 6 channel to the 8 channel Rx and added a servo but we will see.

I have also reworked the nose retract to make the aircraft sit less nose down but it is still not level.
 

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L Edge

Well-known member
#53
Until you get the nose pointing up, it will take fast speed and a bump to get it airborn. I have gone thru what you are doing and explored with a moving canard, moving a variable leading edge up about positive 10 degrees and also a thrusted vector nozzle to make it work.
It will be interesting if your extra elevator will pitch it up immediate and what will happen in flight.

Here is my ducted setup to give it aileron, elevator and yaw control. The yaw component is inside the ducting.
P1010005.JPG

I designed this to work with props as well as EDF's.
 

jfaleo1

Junior Member
#54
Until you get the nose pointing up, it will take fast speed and a bump to get it airborn. I have gone thru what you are doing and explored with a moving canard, moving a variable leading edge up about positive 10 degrees and also a thrusted vector nozzle to make it work.
It will be interesting if your extra elevator will pitch it up immediate and what will happen in flight.

Here is my ducted setup to give it aileron, elevator and yaw control. The yaw component is inside the ducting.
View attachment 127983

I designed this to work with props as well as EDF's.
You are right about the speed and getting nose up. I have near infinite positioning on the secondary elevator and have my nose down angle to less than 3 degrees. That in conjunction with the flapperons might work. If not hand launch and verify flight before major surgery to alter gear.

I am going to try a small amount of secondary elevator and do some high speed taxi testing before trying a liftoff.
If it works I will try mixing to the throttle to try to limit trim changes.
 

jfaleo1

Junior Member
#55
Well I finally got the Quinjet airborne took off easily with the gear reposition and the Makeshift vectoring. flew great (think the video is messed up on this one sorry) for two circuits, but one of the wingtips folded up and I barely got it down without severe damage but beefed up wingtips and gear reinforcements are needed once that's done it should be awesome. in the wind it took about 20 feet to get in the air.
 

jfaleo1

Junior Member
#56
Well I guess it was only really one circuit of the field but it flew and here is the proof.:D:cool: It was not pretty, it was windy, but she flew.
 

L Edge

Well-known member
#57
You are right about the speed and getting nose up. I have near infinite positioning on the secondary elevator and have my nose down angle to less than 3 degrees. That in conjunction with the flapperons might work. If not hand launch and verify flight before major surgery to alter gear.

I am going to try a small amount of secondary elevator and do some high speed taxi testing before trying a liftoff.
If it works I will try mixing to the throttle to try to limit trim changes.

Here is another concept to use have thrust vectoring at the exhaust.

P1010011.JPG

I used helicopter parts to give it 3 axis of control. The vert is for yaw and the horizontal was a set of elevons. Flew rather well. You should try a heli blade as a elevator across the exhaust with the servo in between.
.
 

jfaleo1

Junior Member
#58
Here is another concept to use have thrust vectoring at the exhaust.
I used helicopter parts to give it 3 axis of control. The vert is for yaw and the horizontal was a set of elevons. Flew rather well. You should try a heli blade as a elevator across the exhaust with the servo in between.
.
Looks like a great way to do thrust vectoring but not where this project was going. I was not looking to thrust vector but rather to alter what the airflow was to get a better chance of liftoff, which it did. Honestly I am not even sure it was needed after I changed the incidence.

I may use it on another project I am working on though.
 

L Edge

Well-known member
#59
Looks like a great way to do thrust vectoring but not where this project was going. I was not looking to thrust vector but rather to alter what the airflow was to get a better chance of liftoff, which it did. Honestly I am not even sure it was needed after I changed the incidence.

I may use it on another project I am working on though.

It certainly could be rotated for liftoff(had same problem for F-22 STOL) and it radically reduced distance for takeoff and landings. Purpose I show this stuff is to make available possible alternative solutions to problems. I even designed "thrusters" so that a single engine EDF can actually hover.
 

jfaleo1

Junior Member
#60
It’s a good idea and I have a future project it may work on. Just after a different operating goal here. I have about 3 winter projects that will all be trying something different and I may use the heli blade like you did to get the effect up in some thrust vectoring on one of them.