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Pumpkin drop event

Built the TT and lookin for feedback

BATTLEAXE

Well-known member
#1
Due to my lack of getting this flying the planes I build with some sense of control I decided to slow it down and build the TT. It was a quick and easy build. Made the 3 channel version. Check it out and tell me what you all think. 20190722_075151.jpg I used the power pod out of my Mini Mustang because it has the same thrust angle to the right that's called for in the TT. I put the wheels on it only because it had a tail skid off the vertical fin and it looks cool. It was the wheel assembly I salvaged off the once glorious Mini Scout which gave me the best flying experience so far. Might revisit that one some day.

I noticed Gryff posted a thread on the beefed up power pod nose he designed for the TT where he spun the PP 180 degrees and added a strip of DTFB to take crashes (which is something I do a lot) so it gave me an idea for a mod in the nose as well. I glued a small pad of DTFB on either side of the inside of the nose that rest up against the back of the pod to take the longitude force of a head on crash and distribute the impact to the sides of the nose. All the while still maintaining the thrust angle with the original power pod design. 20190722_075427.jpg
The trouble I am having is where to mount my receiver. A little back story... because I have crashed so many models beyond repair anymore I have currently just ordered my 3rd receiver. Now I'm not blaming the receiver quality only my placement of it in the airframe. The first AR620 went south when I placed said receiver in front of the battery in the power pod for the Bloody Wonder fiasco which redefined the term lawn dart. Actually stuck into the lawn tail up with a ominous thud that was heard in the house. Needless to say the battery launch forward and turned the receiver into a crushed pile of circuit board and plastic, and punctured my LiPo as well. Lookin back the stupidity makes me laugh now. The second AR620 was more short lived but not as epic of a failure. Because I have a over abundance of reverse props and was convinced that the FT Arrow would be a good choice to not only get the opportunity to use said props but could be a good bank and yank trainer with a wide speed envelope, it ended with more disappointment. I took it out for its maiden at a ball diamond adjacent to a farmer field. Again like so many other times it ended with a handful of uncontrollable crashes due to me just reacting to what the plane does instead of actually controlling it. long story short I lost the plane in a waist high crop of wheat that I didn't find until the next day. Now the receiver was behind the battery at this time but it still had its own demise even though it was Velcro'd into place it still launched itself into the back of the battery which disabled my throttle port. So I now am gun-shy as to where to put the receiver in this TT due to its lack of room inside the fuselage.

Has anyone ever mounted the receiver on the outside of the fuse?

Lookin at where this TT will balance the CG I will have to place it more in the tail section of the plane. I have the F Pack to use one the TT instead of the A Pack that is suggested because that's all I have, (I can't justify spending more money to get all the different packs if I cant seem to fly the majority of what I build yet, kind of getting frustrating actually). I have noticed on this model though that the wing placement is further back from the front of the nose then most models which now places the CG further back as well. Also forces the battery placement (850 mah 3s) well back into the fuselage as opposed to being anywhere near the power pod like in the build video. So because I really don't feel like placing the receiver in front of the battery under the power pod and there is not enough room anywhere else inside the fuselage being taken up by the ESC, servos, and battery. could I mount it on the outside of the fuse as shown? 20190722_084449.jpg
Any suggestions would be much appreciated and thank you for checkin out my post
 

Verris

Active member
#2
Looks good to me. I mounted my receiver behind the servos, in the tail as I was running a 4s 650 and a bigger motor, so the more tail weight I could get the better.
 

BATTLEAXE

Well-known member
#3
Looks good to me. I mounted my receiver behind the servos, in the tail as I was running a 4s 650 and a bigger motor, so the more tail weight I could get the better.
I was just lookin at a couple of other mods concerning the lack of real estate in the fuse and people are externally mounting the servos aft of their underwing location to free up space on the inside and to counter the generally nose heavy situation. I predicted it would be nose heavy so I used 9g servos and thicker control rod wire still with the straws that help with flex thinkin it would help with the balance as well. Still wasn't a lot of room left.
I might still mount the receiver around the location its at and still on the outside for now. if that placement works for the CG in flight I might mock up a faux canopy out of some soda bottle plastic to cover it for protection and looks. As per usual I'm expecting this will crash a bunch and I will have to build a new one due to collateral damage and I'll make those suggested adjustments later. In the meantime I am still waiting on the mailman to bring my new receiver.
Thanks for the ideas though and keep it coming. I appreciate all the advantages I can get
 

Verris

Active member
#5
You may want to look into the lemon brand RXes. They work with Spektrum and are much cheaper, as you seem to be going through them.

Lemon RX 5 pack

These particular ones (DSM2) will work with most Spektrum radios the exception being the DXe.
Just a note, don't try and fly these ones (DSM2) with multiple people flying. A few is fine, FliteFest is not. You will fall out of the sky.
 

BATTLEAXE

Well-known member
#6
You may want to look into the lemon brand RXes. They work with Spektrum and are much cheaper, as you seem to be going through them.

Lemon RX 5 pack

These particular ones (DSM2) will work with most Spektrum radios the exception being the DXe.
It's funny you mention the DXe because that's the one I use. I have paid upwards of $55 for the AR620 at the hobby stores. Just ordered one from FT for $39.99. My goal really is to not break them anymore though. Thx for the suggestions
 

BATTLEAXE

Well-known member
#7
Looks good to me. I mounted my receiver behind the servos, in the tail as I was running a 4s 650 and a bigger motor, so the more tail weight I could get the better.
After some close inspection in behind the servos inside the fuse it looks like you were right about where to put the RX. I cut an access hole in the bottom just aft of the servos and installed a 9" servo extension for the throttle wire from the ESC to reach the RX. I think it will aid in airflow to keep stuff cool as well. Been a big help Verris thx.
 

Hai-Lee

Old and Bold RC PILOT
#8
You may find that you would have the Rxs last longer and perform better if you looked for the genuine, lemon, or orange DSMX Rxs that either have a satellite antenna or the long wire antennas. When used in my local club with the antennas away from the planes internals the planes crash far far less due to LOS conditions!

You need to remember that cars. boats, and quads do not have antenna orientation issues and are a larger market that fixed wing planes. Longwire, satellite, and dual antenna radio systems are not required for those who do not use them in fixed wing craft. Many Rxs are not really suitable for airborne use and actually contribute to model crashes, (you get what you pay for).

Have fun!
 

BATTLEAXE

Well-known member
#9
You may find that you would have the Rxs last longer and perform better if you looked for the genuine, lemon, or orange DSMX Rxs that either have a satellite antenna or the long wire antennas. When used in my local club with the antennas away from the planes internals the planes crash far far less due to LOS conditions!

You need to remember that cars. boats, and quads do not have antenna orientation issues and are a larger market that fixed wing planes. Longwire, satellite, and dual antenna radio systems are not required for those who do not use them in fixed wing craft. Many Rxs are not really suitable for airborne use and actually contribute to model crashes, (you get what you pay for).

Have fun!
Do you think that maybe I haven't had a good flight experience yet because I have been using an antennealess RX causing me to lose signal without me even knowing it...? Maybe I haven't realized the loss of signal because I don't know what a solid signal feels like...? This is a possibility I haven't thought of. You make an interesting point. Everytime I try to fly it feels like I'm just reacting to whatever the plane wants to do instead of me actually controlling it. Does this make sense to you? Are these common symptoms to my problem? Need help soon :mad::oops::eek:
 

Verris

Active member
#10
For Lemon, I have had good luck with these. They have diversity and longer antennas.

https://www.lemon-rx.com/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=132

I just picked up one of these, I haven't tried it yet.

https://www.motionrc.com/products/a...mx-compatible-receiver-with-diversity-antenna

I have hjeard good reviews about the new spektrum antennaless modules however. The official spektrum ones I fly are higher end ones with as3x and telemetry built in, but they aren't cheap. For foamboard planes, I havent had a single problem with a dsmx clone. After flitefest I tossed all my dsm2 receivers.
 

Hai-Lee

Old and Bold RC PILOT
#11
Do you think that maybe I haven't had a good flight experience yet because I have been using an antennealess RX causing me to lose signal without me even knowing it...? Maybe I haven't realized the loss of signal because I don't know what a solid signal feels like...? This is a possibility I haven't thought of. You make an interesting point. Everytime I try to fly it feels like I'm just reacting to whatever the plane wants to do instead of me actually controlling it. Does this make sense to you? Are these common symptoms to my problem? Need help soon :mad::oops::eek:
I teach locally and the first thing I teach is that a plane is designed to fly and on a trainer to fly without your help. Most beginners think that they need to do something to make it fly whereas the truth is that your input should be limited to allowing it to fly and to keep it out of danger by course corrections and perhaps trimming it for level flight!

Once you let it fly your crashing will decrease.

As for LOS caused crashes you should read @mayan 's diary/post and see the marked difference the day he was able to remove most of the LOS events from his flying experience. In short time he has gone from a crash EVERY flight to flying some high performance birds, very well, in short time! Personally I went from being considered so dangerous that many would not fly with me to a point where I am considered a valuable committee member, test pilot, repairer, designer, and instructor just by eliminating LOS events by getting rid of LOS from my radio systems and using only the best antenna setups I could find.

If you are self teaching I have a rough draft guide that you might find interesting on things to remember and perhaps do when teaching yourself to fly!

Have fun!
 

cranialrectosis

Faster than a speeding faceplant!
Mentor
#12
I would recommend you post video of your glide tests and maiden flight.

If guys like Hai-Lee see the video, they can often see things the pilot can't.

It is possible your crashes are due to receiver issues. More likely though are CG issues, or aggressive throws and no expo issues, or reversed channel/flight surface issues. A Tiny Trainer should fly itself if it well trimmed out.

Here is the deal. Everyone builds two or three Tiny Trainers because the first one or two end up in a big, black yardbag at the end of a walk o shame. Everyone... We all over control it...

This game isn't about how beautiful your build is. It's like ice sculpture. Part of the art form is it's inherent impermanence.

If you want it to last longer, mount a good camera on your head or the brim or your hat. Film your plane from the rear so that we can see both your controller and the flight surfaces as you test direction. Then capture your maiden voyage on video and post it all for us to see.

If she crashes and burns you will have video to help you learn how to not crash and burn. If/when she flies we can all celebrate with you!

Welcome to FliteTest!
 
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BATTLEAXE

Well-known member
#13
I would recommend you post video of your glide tests and maiden flight.

If guys like Hai-Lee see the video, they can often see things the pilot can't.

It is possible your crashes are due to receiver issues. More likely thought are CG issues, or aggressive throws and no expo issues, or reversed channel/flight surface issues. A Tiny Trainer should fly itself if it well trimmed out.

Here is the deal. Everyone builds two or three Tiny Trainers because the first one or two end up in a big, black yardbag at the end of a walk o shame. Everyone... We all over control it...

This game isn't about how beautiful your build is. It's like ice sculpture. Part of the art form is it's inherent impermanence.

If you want it to last longer, mount a good camera on your head or the brim or your hat. Film your plane from the rear so that we can see both your controller and the flight surfaces as you test direction. Then capture your maiden voyage on video and post it all for us to see.

If she crashes and burns you will have video to help you learn how to not crash and burn. If/when she flies we can all celebrate with you!

Welcome to FliteTest!
All good responses. I have had one good flight with the Mini Scout one day about a week and a half ago. Got 2 batteries worth. Learned a lot from it not only on my progression with the flying side but building and design styles. Went out with the same plane 2 days later in the same spot with better weather and it all went to hell in a hand bag fast. This inconsistency now that Hai-Lee has mentioned the receiver thing has me thinking that could be a big issue. Either interference or LOS causing the uncontrollability issues. I do have flight video of that day... although it looks amateur it was comfortable for me. Every other flight around that one has been chaos. I'll see about posting that video in awhile. Thx for the help
 

BATTLEAXE

Well-known member
#14
I teach locally and the first thing I teach is that a plane is designed to fly and on a trainer to fly without your help. Most beginners think that they need to do something to make it fly whereas the truth is that your input should be limited to allowing it to fly and to keep it out of danger by course corrections and perhaps trimming it for level flight!

Once you let it fly your crashing will decrease.

As for LOS caused crashes you should read @mayan 's diary/post and see the marked difference the day he was able to remove most of the LOS events from his flying experience. In short time he has gone from a crash EVERY flight to flying some high performance birds, very well, in short time! Personally I went from being considered so dangerous that many would not fly with me to a point where I am considered a valuable committee member, test pilot, repairer, designer, and instructor just by eliminating LOS events by getting rid of LOS from my radio systems and using only the best antenna setups I could find.

If you are self teaching I have a rough draft guide that you might find interesting on things to remember and perhaps do when teaching yourself to fly!

Have fun!
I would love just let the plane just fly so i can see what I need to do to trim it out but they usually seem to have a mind of their own... straight to the ground lol. My first few planes that I demolished were an "I did not give them enough throttle due to lack of confidence" kind of thing so my bad. Once I got over that hump and punched it a little I was able to actually get some elevation to try to figure it out. 3 planes in and crazy uncontrollable flights I realized using something as big as a C Pack comparable size of plane was to much unrepairable damage per crash kinda ratio. So the F pack was purchased to scale down the size, speed, and collateral damage done.

Question... What format of video does the forum accept?
 

BATTLEAXE

Well-known member
#15
I would recommend you post video of your glide tests and maiden flight.

If guys like Hai-Lee see the video, they can often see things the pilot can't.

It is possible your crashes are due to receiver issues. More likely though are CG issues, or aggressive throws and no expo issues, or reversed channel/flight surface issues. A Tiny Trainer should fly itself if it well trimmed out.

Here is the deal. Everyone builds two or three Tiny Trainers because the first one or two end up in a big, black yardbag at the end of a walk o shame. Everyone... We all over control it...

This game isn't about how beautiful your build is. It's like ice sculpture. Part of the art form is it's inherent impermanence.

If you want it to last longer, mount a good camera on your head or the brim or your hat. Film your plane from the rear so that we can see both your controller and the flight surfaces as you test direction. Then capture your maiden voyage on video and post it all for us to see.

If she crashes and burns you will have video to help you learn how to not crash and burn. If/when she flies we can all celebrate with you!

Welcome to FliteTest!
I have some pics of my control surfaces and servo/control linkage set ups... These are pretty typical of all the planes I build so if you see anything here I can improve on it will be welcomed advice. I think I try to keep the geometry generally lineal but you may pick out something I don't see... don't hold back and let me have it haha. Check it out:

Spitfire Elevator Servo Control Horn Geometry Spitfire.jpg
Mini Mustang Aelerons
Servo Control Horn Geometry.jpg
I start out with low rates when I maiden
Hand launch every time
40% expo to soften center stick... (I know The Bix says 30% but I am a thumbs kinda guy so I used to be a reactive gamer style on the sticks, and I know the difference between pos/neg expo from bench testing)
I have gotten quite comfortable with the throw direction normal/reverse thing with the channels, watched many videos on this and I have a full understanding of aeronautics long before I got into the hobby.
I do a full system check before each flight of the ESC RX and control surfaces

If I am missing anything pls let me know
 

Hai-Lee

Old and Bold RC PILOT
#16
I would love just let the plane just fly so i can see what I need to do to trim it out but they usually seem to have a mind of their own... straight to the ground lol. My first few planes that I demolished were an "I did not give them enough throttle due to lack of confidence" kind of thing so my bad. Once I got over that hump and punched it a little I was able to actually get some elevation to try to figure it out. 3 planes in and crazy uncontrollable flights I realized using something as big as a C Pack comparable size of plane was to much unrepairable damage per crash kinda ratio. So the F pack was purchased to scale down the size, speed, and collateral damage done.

Question... What format of video does the forum accept?
Most post their videos to youtube first and then link them into their post.

As for the flying if you do the glide test route then in a sort time you will have a plane that will glide quite well and then you start launching with a little throttle to increase the glide distance. Keep launching with ever increasing throttle and soon it will be a matter of launching and watching it fly away on its own. Then grab the controls and gently contol the direction as well as altitude.

Works every time!

Have fun!
 

cranialrectosis

Faster than a speeding faceplant!
Mentor
#17
I don't see any issues from the photos. The build looks good. Actually, your builds are pretty sweet.

When you move the control surfaces, do they move in the proper directions? Show that in your maiden video.

I know this is REALLY basic and you called it out. But this is the stuff that jacks most newbies and if you record it, there is never any question after a crash. This is less a question and more a point about documentation to help you diagnose issues with a new build.

The worst place to be is crashing without being able to determine why so you can learn from the crash. Systematic, documentation, particularly video we can share online, is the best way I know to figure out what went wrong short of having an old timer fly the plane for you at the local club.
 
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BATTLEAXE

Well-known member
#18
I don't see any issues from the photos. The build looks good. Actually, your builds are pretty sweet.

When you move the control surfaces, do they move in the proper directions? Show that in your maiden video.

I know this is REALLY basic and you called it out. But this is the stuff that jacks most newbies and if you record it, there is never any question after a crash. This is less a question and more a point about documentation to help you diagnose issues with a new build.

The worst place to be is crashing without being able to determine why so you can learn from the crash. Systematic, documentation, particularly video we can share online, is the best way I know to figure out what went wrong short of having an old timer fly the plane for you at the local club.
Thx for the compliment on the how the build looks. I do take a lot of pride in the build process. I know its not about how the plane looks and more of how it flies but that's just how I roll. Inevitably it only gets uglier from here but the post build picks look awesome.

I get the whole documentation thing with each plane. It make sense. Every new plane I put the RX into (given I only have one, actually none right now, waiting for another AR620 in the mail. Ordered before I spoke with you guys about the LOS possibility) I go through all the control surfaces thoroughly.

On a more laughable note here is a before and after glimpse
20190706_000510.jpg 20190723_092701.jpg
How does someone take a small SE5 and destroy it like this lol

20190723_092718.jpg The Bloody Wonder that heavily lawn darted into the back yard and turned my first RX into dust
20190723_092752.jpg The Arrow that i lost in a farmers crop for 2 days and how I messed up my last RX

A couple of other post build shots
20190711_102956.jpg This Mini Scout was one that I actually put 2 full batts thru... one day. Couldn't fly it 2 days later
20190607_230356.jpg First plane I built took almost 2 months to build... After a dozen or so flight attempts though I couldnt get it to fly without ground looping, tip stalling and cartwheeling after take off. SHE GONE.

Anyway thx for the input so far and I'll post my maiden on the Mini Scout soon. Gotta figure out how to get a video onto YT

Peace bro
 

BATTLEAXE

Well-known member
#19
Most post their videos to youtube first and then link them into their post.

As for the flying if you do the glide test route then in a sort time you will have a plane that will glide quite well and then you start launching with a little throttle to increase the glide distance. Keep launching with ever increasing throttle and soon it will be a matter of launching and watching it fly away on its own. Then grab the controls and gently contol the direction as well as altitude.

Works every time!

Have fun!
Here is the link to the Maiden video and tell me what you think. Thx for all your help

 

skymaster

Active member
#20
most of us crash when we stay close to the ground. try to gain as much altitude as possible this will give you a chance to correct mistakes. some receiver don't like being close to the transmitter . if you loose control of you plane cut throttle and just glide, take it easy relax and enjoy. have fun.