Top Flite AT-6 Texan Electric Conversion

willsonman

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I recently received a Top Flite AT-6 Texan complete with Saito FA-82 four-stroke glow engine and servos. After a thorough safety inspection and cleaning I've started the conversion process. I ordered a new cowl from tower hobbies as the old cowl had holes in it for the muffler and glow plug. I removed the dummy motor from the old cowl and cleaned it using borax and a brush to cut the oil and grease. Cleaned up nicely.

The biggest issue when doing an electric conversion, I have found, is the appropriate power setup. I fly scale and one of the goals I shoot for is scale RPM. This in turn leads to issues with motor selection as you need the right KV motor and battery selection with a prop to actually pull the plane. The scale RPM is 2250 which is really out of the question to get speed. I decided on a 4S setup and the NTM 42-48 650 KV motor. Without a prop this will swing at about 11K RPM. I chose a 15X10 APC-E prop that will put the draw close to the max of 1300W on the bench but will unload in the air. An 85 A ESC that has a 5A BEC built in will do the job nicely. I've used this ESC in my L-4 Grasshopper with the same number of servos with no issues.

So, the other issue you face with these conversions is that the firewall is typically very far back from the prop location. Now you can spend the $ for a fancy adjustable mount or you can do what I did. Spent 5$ on some bolts, screws, and aluminum stock and make your own! The aluminum is 0.75" wide and 3/8" thick. I simply placed the stock in my vise and bent it to shape measuring the distance the mount needed to be. The manual states a total of 145mm from firewall to the back of the prop. My motor with mounting plate is 59mm so measuring carefully I made the mount 86mm. I drilled out the mounting holes and secured the motor to the bent aluminum with hex head bolts and nylon lock nuts. CA on the back threads to make sure they do not go anywhere. The firewall was drilled with new holes and T-nuts were installed. The motor was secured with more hex head bolts into the T-nuts. Pictures show where I am now.
 

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highflying

Senior Member
Awesome.
Definition: See above.

Looks like it's going to be great. You, sir are a pioneer in gas to electric conversions. It looks amazing.
 

willsonman

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Thank you sir! I should note that I am using a Zippy 4500mAh battery with a 45C discharge rate.
http://hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=23686
4.5*45=202.5 Amp discharge... This WILL kill you if you are not careful.

Motor: http://hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=34138
ESC: http://hobbyking.com/hobbyking/stor...ushless_ESC_85A_w_5A_SBEC_USA_Warehouse_.html

Of note is the on/off switch to the ESC. This ONLY controls the power to the Rx so there is a risk of interference on the ESC powering the prop. I will only connect the battery when I intend to fly. These high-power systems demand respect at every moment.

Weighing everything theoretically gives me about 8.5 pounds. 1300W/8.5=153W/lb. Should have plenty of power. Even if I have to add nose weight to balance I will still have enough power for scale flight (typically 100W/lb.).
 

Flynn

Member
This is awesome! I recently purchased a .46 gasser at a Swapmeet that was completely stripped down. I purchased the servos and a .46 equivalent electric motor from altitude hobbies and 70 amp speed controller. I was just going over what was left to get to have this bird up in the air. I will definitely be stopping by Home Depot and getting some aluminum and trying this out. Thank you very much for the post!
 

willsonman

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Sure thing! I converted a Goldberg Eagle 2 to electric a couple years ago and had no issues with it. I used an ExceedRC Monster 46 motor. Tacon Bigfoot 46 would be its equivalent now. Tacon is my favorite motor right now but the sizing was not right for this application. These conversions usually need nose weight so do not hesitate to make metal on the front end. Our electric systems usually are lighter than the engine, fuel tank, fuel, Rx battery combined. Do yourself a favor and pick up some lead shot while you are at it. Mix up some epoxy and put the shot in it makes adding weight to tight places a snap.With the T-nuts already in place on the firewall it may make bolting 2oz fishing weights super easy. We will see when the time comes to get the CG right.
 

willsonman

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So I got the ESC strapped onto the motor mount. I wanted it there for better cooling. This required an extension of the on-off switch. Simple soldering. Fuel tank tray was a perfect fit for the battery. I strapped down the Rx and got everything put together. As it was rather chilly I did it all at the kitchen table. I applied some throttle and at less than 1/4 throttle I was getting some serious air. I'm pretty sure this will work. :) so, while I had it all together I did a CG check... yup need nose weight. I broke out my 2oz. fishing weights and with all four of them it was much much better but still will require more. This was expected. The Saito motor that was in it was a 1 pound piece of machinery. My motor weighs in at half that. adding in the mounting brackets you are still at only 9 or 10 oz. The fuel tank was able to hold just over 14 oz of fuel and the battery in the same location is 18.5 oz.
Weight of fuel system: 14+16=30oz
Weight of electric system: 10+18.5=28.5oz
So factoring that the "fuel" weight is further back toward the CG this makes sense that I will need mass to offset the CG to the proper location.

So the fishing weights I'm looking at 10-14 oz at the firewall. If I use some lead shot with epoxy at the front of the cowl I'm guesstimating about 8 oz. So, in reality the electric setup is not saving any weight. I wanted to make that clear. Most folks believe that these conversions are lighter. It depends on the application. Also factor in that I still need to get the right prop shaft to accept the aluminum tru turn spinner. That is more weight on the very nose. Now, if I were to make a custom battery tray where the battery was length wise with the firewall this would more than likely change as nearly all the weight of the battery would be right at the firewall location, further away from the CG. Its a hassle to make and would involve cutting into the airframe. Not ideal. Possible, but not ideal. A 6 oz weight penalty is rather minor of a bird this size.
 

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willsonman

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So I got the plane balanced. With the spinner back plate on I am perfectly balanced and with the dome on (once I get the right adapter) it will be a tad nose-heavy. The way I like warbirds. Only used 8 oz of lead right at the front of the cowl. I also repaired a small portion of wood on the underside behind the wing mount. I also glued back on the scoop in front of the wing mount. I still need to program the radio so maybe tonight. I need to take another look at the aileron servos. One is more sluggish than the other. If they are the same I need to swap them out. Trying to Maiden on Saturday but we'll see. Weather is not looking good.
 

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willsonman

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Thanks! I finally figured out the spinner dome mount issue. I'd been trying to find an adapter shaft that would fit my motor or using a machine shop to drill and tap the center of the one I have. The options were pricey. I could have Tru-turn custom make one for heaven knows how much, or the machine shop could do it for $75-100! A custom bracket would have had to be fabricated to hold the adapter center wile it was machined. Here was the answer:
http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXB956
Its a prop nut that has an extension on it that is already tapped to accept the bolt. Already made for the application. Wish I would have ordered it with the replacement cowl and save on shipping. :black_eyed: oh well.
 

willsonman

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So I went through and programmed my rates, throws, expo, and found a few stuttering servos as well. My servo tester showed nothing wrong but I did not have good centering on the rudder and left aileron servo. The aileron servo was also not functioning sporadically as I was measuring throws. Replaced those two servos. I took the plane outside for a taxi test in the street. I did not even have to throttle up. As I wheeled the plane into position the left gear started to fold. *sigh*. So tonight I will fiddle with the mechanical retracts and figure out why its not locking when down. I'd rather it not lock when up than down. If I cannot resolve it tonight maiden will have to wait. The really great thing is that the toe-in looks really good. Just enough to help with tracking.

I did do a run-up of the motor to full throttle. This is definitely a powerful setup. I've been a spotter for many folks at fly-ins and I also usually stand in front of the tail for a gasser to do its run-up. This felt just like it. It was a confidence booster for me since I've never done one of these large setups before other than my L-4 which is designed for electric and weighs 3/4 as much despite a larger span.
 

willsonman

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I did take out the plane to the field on Saturday. Weather was great except for the cross-wind from the rear. I fellow club member that used to have this model said he would not even try. I took his advise. Some other time.
 

willsonman

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So, after weeks of waiting... Maiden flight report:

I had gotten the correct prop nut that would accept the spinner bolt so I did have all the hardware in place and CG was on the money. The Wife (being mother's day) saw me constantly checking my club field's weather report. We have a private weather station. So she graciously encouraged me to set out to the field. I got there and got the battery in and started assembling the servos for the wing and DOH! Forgot the wing bolts. 25 minutes later I was back at the field WITH the wing bolts.

Set up and ready I taxied around the field to check proper alignment and range check. All fine. I lined her up at the far end of the runway and slowly advanced the throttle. I eased back on the stick and she was off smooth as silk. I rolled into my turn easing back on the elevator and she continued to climb. Tail heavy? I trimmed forward about 7 or 8 clicks and she leveled out with a slight tendency to pitch up on full-throttle. Just the way I like it. I corrected the aileron trim. 3 clicks left. Did a circuit and put up the gear. Made another circuit and took her her up high. Real high. I eased off the throttle and did a stall test. Next to no stall and slight wing drop. Power up and I was out. Brought her back down a bit and checked the flaps. Slight ballooning but no change in tail attitude. Slowed her down a bit but nothing drastic. I did a few more circuits and realized the adrenaline was passing so I decided to not let my guard down and bring her in. Lowered gear and flaps and made a dirty pass. All looked good. Next was my approach and I made it high intentional as I did not want to lose speed and drop after such a good flight. She settled in on the runway about 2/3 in and hit a bump. Correcting that I was back on the ground rolling toward the tall grass. I could have waved off but I decided to just settle with the tall grass. She mushed in and no damage. After a minor walk of shame on my landing I turned her around and taxied back to the flight line checking things out. All looked good again. Power off and time to let the knees settle.

Overall she flies great. Looks like a great plane for FTFF. Successful conversion. If I prop down I can go to 5S with more speed but really, I'm happy with how she is. She flew great with just 1/2 throttle. Battery was not hot. Only barely warm.
 

Ron B

Posted a thousand or more times
way to go
I keep having to remember to breathe and let shaky legs have a rest between flights
 

willsonman

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Thanks guys. It was a great moment. I've not flown anything that large in some time and the fellow I got the airframe from recommended keeping speed up due to tip stalls. I think his IC setup had the CG more forward than me and that may have let to that. Given her characteristics I think she will fare quite well in higher winds. I may have to use more rudder but that is a given. Really looking forward to bringing her out to the public this summer. She is so quiet too. Really no louder than my smaller foam airplanes. The big prop disk gives a big presence too. The thrum of the prop beating the air sounds great at the low RPM and just makes for a nice and calm flight.
 

Flynn

Member
Thanks for the great flight report. I have my Orange Strega P51 E-Conversion ready and hope to maiden it soon. If all goes well, I'll bring that with me to FF. Can't wait to meet everyone!
 

bicyclemonkey

Flying Derp
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OK, so we need more pics and definitely some video!

I love e-conversions. People need to remember if they calculate weight for balancing b/wn an E-power system and the glo fuel system, that glo fuel planes are balanced WITHOUT fuel. Since the glo fuel tank sits up against the firewall, they're balanced dry so they will start the flight nose heavy and will be close to balanced as the plane uses up the fuel.

This thread probably needs to be in the balsa section btw, since it's not really a scratch build.
 

willsonman

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I agree, some pics are due. Video? I'll try. I'll try and at least get a hat cam video the next flight. A good point. CG is more nose-heavy at the beginning and better at the end on glow or gas. While yes, not a scratch build it is a scratch conversion. Not many have been documented for this particular airplane. I was basing on my own calculations and experience. Balsa section may be better, I agree.