Help! X-29 EDF Conversion

[OliverW]

This plane's roll rate was already ridiculous, so I think I'll be dialing back my rates in general before flying it on the fan. Do you think I should set my battery alarm higher or lower than I would with the pusher? I would think this setup would draw enough to see more of a drop in voltage under load.

I would set the timer to 4 minutes and get it dialed in from there

 

[Yusernaym]

I'll try that. I generally don't use the timer, just set my alarm a little high and bring it in once it goes off. I'll leave my alarm at 3.6v, set the timer at 4 minutes, and bring it in when one of them goes off.

 

[OliverW]

I'll try that. I generally don't use the timer, just set my alarm a little high and bring it in once it goes off. I'll leave my alarm at 3.6v, set the timer at 4 minutes, and bring it in when one of them goes off.

I'd personally set it for 3.7-8 just so the battery does not get damaged from being run too low.

 

[OliverW]

All this talk about EDF's is getting me excited to finish my skyray!

 

[Yusernaym]

Do you have a build thread for the Skyray? I'd like to follow your progress.

 

[Yusernaym]

Actually, I just looked up pictures of the real Skyray, and it looks really interesting. If you need someone to beta test plans, I would be up for it.

 

[Yusernaym]

Update: it flew, past tense. The first few seconds of the flight were great. I got it in the air, leveled off, and flying straight, then started a turn to bring it around. Midway through said turn, I heard a pop, saw a thin trail of smoke come out of the back, and had to watch as my favorite plane slowly spiraled across the field into some trees under power, as I had no control. I found it just past the brush that brought it down in a number of pieces. It took me a few minutes to find the battery, which was thrown clear by a few feet and buried in some snow. The only piece I didn't recover was my brand new battery monitor, which got pulled off with the battery and could have ended up anywhere. Those monitors are less than $10 each, so it could have been worse. So, forensics. Plugging the battery back in, it connected to my transmitter, moved the servos, and spun the fan, so whatever took it out in flight didn't kill it. My best guess is that there was a short between the motor wires at the motor, causing some kind of overcurrent protection to kick in. That may have reset something, causing the dropped signal. I'll have to test to see if I can recreate the fault, and, if so, what I can do to resolve it before rebuilding. Speaking of which, the "core" of the plane is in great shape. The plan, as of now, is to make a new wing and nose, keeping the rest of it as is. I already took the wing off, and didn't see anything amiss inside. This is a strange moment for me. This is the first time I've had a major crash in months outside of prototypes, the last one being my Edge 540 back in July.

 

[The Hangar]

View attachment 182007 Update: it flew, past tense. The first few seconds of the flight were great. I got it in the air, leveled off, and flying straight, then started a turn to bring it around. Midway through said turn, I heard a pop, saw a thin trail of smoke come out of the back, and had to watch as my favorite plane slowly spiraled across the field into some trees under power, as I had no control. I found it just past the brush that brought it down in a number of pieces. It took me a few minutes to find the battery, which was thrown clear by a few feet and buried in some snow. The only piece I didn't recover was my brand new battery monitor, which got pulled off with the battery and could have ended up anywhere. Those monitors are less than $10 each, so it could have been worse. So, forensics. Plugging the battery back in, it connected to my transmitter, moved the servos, and spun the fan, so whatever took it out in flight didn't kill it. My best guess is that there was a short between the motor wires at the motor, causing some kind of overcurrent protection to kick in. That may have reset something, causing the dropped signal. I'll have to test to see if I can recreate the fault, and, if so, what I can do to resolve it before rebuilding. Speaking of which, the "core" of the plane is in great shape. The plan, as of now, is to make a new wing and nose, keeping the rest of it as is. I already took the wing off, and didn't see anything amiss inside. This is a strange moment for me. This is the first time I've had a major crash in months outside of prototypes, the last one being my Edge 540 back in July. View attachment 182008

Ouch, that sucks - I’m sorry! My X-29 lasted only a coup flights as well. Ok the 3rd flight I was bring it in but the battery was really sagging and I had barely any power. I had a great appproach lined up but suddenly it disappeared behind a house and I heard a loud smack! I guess I was farther out than I though! Thankfully the people were super nice and let us bring a ladder and retrieve the plane. I still haven’t gotten around to making a new nose for it though. Despite the cracked wing and chewed up bottom section of the nose, it was fine!

 

[Yusernaym]

Ouch, that sucks - I’m sorry! My X-29 lasted only a coup flights as well. Ok the 3rd flight I was bring it in but the battery was really sagging and I had barely any power. I had a great appproach lined up but suddenly it disappeared behind a house and I heard a loud smack! I guess I was farther out than I though! Thankfully the people were super nice and let us bring a ladder and retrieve the plane. I still haven’t gotten around to making a new nose for it though. Despite the cracked wing and chewed up bottom section of the nose, it was fine!

If you count this one, I have six flights on it. The main fuselage section is either really strong or I'm really lucky, with the wings and nose taking most of the impact.

 

[L Edge]

If you count this one, I have six flights on it. The main fuselage section is either really strong or I'm really lucky, with the wings and nose taking most of the impact.

1) Did you install the ESC so that it got cooled by the airflow of the EDF?
2) I would not use the EDF setup until you find out what is ruined? Puffs of smoke indicated a failure. When you set up your next plane, full bore the EDF and run it for a minute and then check the Esc, motor if overheated.
3) Again, you have to understand your flights are no longer than 4 min. I explained to you not to exceed 2 min for the first 2-3 flights and you were concerned about voltage. If you don't have a countdown timer on you tx, buy a cheap cooking one.

If you blow your approach and need to do a go around and finally land, it will cost you about one minute worth of energy. Say your up 3 1/2 min and then add 1 min, you dead in the water. Your engine will crap out, but you will still have surface controlsYour dead meat. It is not like prop stuff. The EDF's sucks the living daylight's out of the battery quick. And 2 minutes goes by rather quick.

 

[Yusernaym]

1) Did you install the ESC so that it got cooled by the airflow of the EDF?
2) I would not use the EDF setup until you find out what is ruined? Puffs of smoke indicated a failure. When you set up your next plane, full bore the EDF and run it for a minute and then check the Esc, motor if overheated.
3) Again, you have to understand your flights are no longer than 4 min. I explained to you not to exceed 2 min for the first 2-3 flights and you were concerned about voltage. If you don't have a countdown timer on you tx, buy a cheap cooking one.

If you blow your approach and need to do a go around and finally land, it will cost you about one minute worth of energy. Say your up 3 1/2 min and then add 1 min, you dead in the water. Your engine will crap out, but you will still have surface controlsYour dead meat. It is not like prop stuff. The EDF's sucks the living daylight's out of the battery quick. And 2 minutes goes by rather quick.

1. The ESC is directly in front of the fan's intake, oriented so air flows over the fins.
2. I have been very clear about this in every post I've made about the subject - I'll be testing to figure out what went wrong.
3. I'm aware of the reduced flight times. I had my timer set at 4 minutes, which was admittedly more than recommended for the first flight, but the crash was within the first 30 seconds, so that's not the issue.

 

[OliverW]

Do you have a build thread for the Skyray? I'd like to follow your progress.

I do not yet. I'll be posting progress pics in the "Anybody scratch building tonight" thread most likely.

 

[OliverW]

Actually, I just looked up pictures of the real Skyray, and it looks really interesting. If you need someone to beta test plans, I would be up for it.

Awesome! I'll want to make one before I see about anyone beta testing it. Especially since I have to hand draw the canopy and make sure the skins fit together, and find a battery hatch for it

 

[Yusernaym]

Testing has concluded, and I have a better idea of what the problem is, but I'm still a little lost as to the root cause. When you throttle all the way up and cut, the motor "hangs" at full bore way longer than can be explained by latency, and while it's doing that, you have zero response from the control surfaces. I think this indicates that the ESC is overheating, which tracks, as it was hot after my brief tests. I would appreciate the input of some more experienced people. If you have an idea of what that indicates, please let me know.

 

[The Hangar]

Testing has concluded, and I have a better idea of what the problem is, but I'm still a little lost as to the root cause. When you throttle all the way up and cut, the motor "hangs" at full bore way longer than can be explained by latency, and while it's doing that, you have zero response from the control surfaces. I think this indicates that the ESC is overheating, which tracks, as it was hot after my brief tests. I would appreciate the input of some more experienced people. If you have an idea of what that indicates, please let me know.

Do you have another ESC you could try out? Also, did your friend use the same EDF/esc before they gave it to you?

 

[Yusernaym]

The highest-amp ESC I have that isn't this one is only 35A, so not really. My friend pulled this esc out of one of his planes, where it had been used with a 64mm edf. This edf/esc combo hadn't been used or tested before I flew it aside from just holding it and making sure it worked. There's a reason the not quite flite thread I posted was titled "check your electronics." This crash could have been prevented if I did one proper preflight, but I didn't, and here we are.