FAA banning FPV Goggles

[jdawson]

I was reading that the FAA is has said that the use of goggles for FPV is not allowed in the USA.

This will have a very negative impact on the hobby.

http://diydrones.com/profiles/blogs/faa-issues-notice-clarifying-legal-model-aircraft-use

http://www.faa.gov/about/initiatives/uas/media/model_aircraft_spec_rule.pdf

 

[BankNYank!]

Do a google search for "federal aviation administration v. raphael pirker". There's lots of good reading there but more importantly, if you can read the judges findings you will see just how much jurisdiction the faa has over model aircraft.

 

[jdawson]

Good points... But still the FAA is not going in the right direction here. Making more rules that people will ignore is not the right direction. If they said this was for urban areas or areas where people could be hurt this would be a lot more logical and reasonable.

 

[RoyBro]

Do a google search for "federal aviation administration v. raphael pirker". There's lots of good reading there but more importantly, if you can read the judges findings you will see just how much jurisdiction the faa has over model aircraft.

I don't know...

The language seems pretty clear. I believe that the Trappy case only served to show that the FAA only had unenforceable policies in place and no real rules. The document referenced in the link seems to attempt to rectify that. It is a document to notify interested parties of their intent.

If this does indeed become an FAA rule, it would effectively ban the use of FPV goggles. This is where the AMA needs to step in. The guidelines set forth by the AMA for FPV flying are reasonable and safe. They provide for a spotter to maintain line of sight of the aircraft. But the FAA document states that a spotter cannot be used in lieu of the pilot.

In my opinion, someone at the FAA has a stick up their butt and is just being mean.

 

[Tritium]

That's it!

I have carefully checked the abstracts of my property back to its purchase from the Railroad in the 1800's and as legal Deeds must state exclusions of value (minerals as an example) otherwise they belong to the deed holder.
At no time during ownership by myself or previous owners has the airspace over the property been excluded from the deed.
In addition at some point in the past it is clear that the United States of America established imminent domain over the airspace which is above my property. I believe that after examination of my property abstracts that no notice of imminent domain seizure of the airspace over my property was made and more importantly no payment reasonable or otherwise for said seized property was made to any owner prior or present of my legally deeded property.

I therefore propose to sue for reasonable payment for said seizure of legally deeded property and damages for loss of past use of said same from date of unnoticed seizure to present time based on commercial value of the airspace usage past to present.

For fun we will use the FCC legal definition of Airspace to extend to the edge of Space at 50 miles.

Pay up Sam or mark my 800 acres as NO FLY ZONE!

I can play dirty too!!!

If you have country acreage in Texas then join in the fun!

I will settle out of court for the following concessions:

1. FAA make provisions for all RC aircraft no matter of size or weight to operate in Federal Commercial Airspace or lesser classifications of airspace either by line of sight or via means of video transmission back to the operator of the craft and all other applicable telemetry and control signaling.

2. The FAA shall provide a micro miniature transponder to track the craft in commercial space free of charge that shall be affixed to a craft operated by any individual of previously hobby classification RC Aircraft any time it is operated in commercial airspace or over 500' in distance over the surface.

3. Usage of hobby RC Aircraft for profit will be allowed without penalty and in fact must be encouraged and promoted positively as a new and growing technology business in America.

4. If The FAA decides that licensing is necessary for operation in Federal airspace then the program shall be patterned after the FCC's system for Ham Radio Licenses and it MUST be minimal cost.

Thurmond

 

[earthsciteach]

Thurmond, I'll happily make the solid rocket fuel for the missile defense system to protect your property. I'm pretty good at airframes, too. You can handle the "brain" parts. That stuff still confuzzles me. I will support the Independent Republic of Thurmond any day!

 

[Tritium]

I will just secede, declare war on the USA, give up without a fight and get Foreign Aid of Millions as a reconstruction bonus for a defeated enemy. Wait a minute was that a Black Helicopter that just flew over

Thurmond

 

[earthsciteach]

Your property is the next Japan! Not a bad plan, sir!

 

[xuzme720]

Do you need troops? and what's the troops share of the aid?

 

[Tritium]

Equal shares. I run a TRUE Republic!

Thurmond

 

[Tritium]

Your property is the next Japan! Not a bad plan, sir!

I have always liked to learn from the mistakes of others. Usually it is way less painful.

By the way it also looks like AMA membership is now Required by federal statute!

Id10T's when DRONES are outlawed then only outlaws (today read that as terrorist) will have DRONES.

Wonder how the Feds would like it if all of us that feed this nation said NO together one day. Starvation is a marvelous tool used in the past by OUR Government on the Indian Nations! Buffalo were not killed for skins but rather to remove the food supply of an enemy. Nah that would never happen in Emperor Obama's Land of the Sheeple.

I "MIGHT" be on a bit of a cranky rant here I just realized.............

Thurmond

 

[earthsciteach]

I find it interesting that, as I age, I feel less a part of this country. I'm pretty sure the opposite was true of my parents' generation. Its hard to feel as though you are on a ship that is traveling somewhere, but you are 100% certain that the course will not lead to the advertised destination. All the while, your fellow passengers seem to be perfectly content and oblivious.

 

[Tritium]

Thurmond

 

[earthsciteach]

+5 points for the obscure and appropriate song reference. It has been years since I heard that one.

 

[FlyingMonkey]

Unfortunately I don't think the AMA is going to cut it. If you read the recent "interpretation" they give (some) power any "community based organization" not just the AMA.

We have a rather quickly growing community based organization here at Flite Test. The FPV community as a whole is growing by leaps and bounds. The FPV industry has a lot to lose if this "interpretation" is recognized as law. So there's a pool of financial backing.

The FAA might have just given the FPV community the boost it needed to organize.

 

[RoyBro]

The FAA might have just given the FPV community the boost it needed to organize.

I'm with you Fred. FPVers Unite!

 

[FAI-F1D]

Oh joy! Well at least most of y'all are apparently somewhat ok. As for me, a free flight modeler, according to that wad of trash, what I do is illegal.

I tell you, when a government agency, whether it enforces such or not, claims the right to regulate whether and how I can fly a paper airplane in my front yard, they've forfeited their right to exist. From here on, I add the FAA to the list along with the dept of energy and the dept of education as a government agency needing to be abolished. Their time has come and gone. They're out of control and cannot be reigned in. It's just like the ATF, who haven't gotten the memo that in the age of 3-d sterolithography, I can build a fully functional automatic firearm in my garage and they flat out can't stop me.* Does the FAA seriously think they can regulate autonomous flight products being shipped in from China by the thousands? What a bunch of clueless idiots!

*No, I haven't done so. There are a lot of things I haven't done, because 3-d sterolithography is still slightly expensive.

 

[makattack]

I've had a long experience with the Government. I started getting Treasury Department paychecks when I enlisted in the US Army. When I left, I ended up working for a defense contractor building secure communications equipment for the Government - that agency that some guy had issues with and decided to violate the law to publicise his criticisms. My experience in both shows that the Government is just a large organization that is staffed by regular people who are well intentioned, but make mistakes. It's slow moving, cumbersome, and yes, wasteful. Yet, it's not out to get us. That is why there are processes in place. No one person can and should make a decision. It's inefficient because it's all design by committee, but that can be a good thing. It's part of the checks and balances. The FAA have released a document stating their intent. Now, it's our turn to participate and tell them what's wrong with it through our representatives and direct to the agency, and via our lobby groups (AMA, et al).

Back in 1993, under President George HW Bush, I saw a similar effort to control cryptographic technology. Anyone remember the hubbub over key escrow systems, DES being replaced, public key systems coming into use, etc? Well, the Government was worried that the NSA wouldn't be able to keep up with the much harder to crack public key algorithms (vs symmetric key algos) and were even worried about long keys used in symmetric algorithms. Well, the key escrow would have been a backdoor type implementation where any government agency with a warrant, could obtain the escrowed key to decrypt any traffic for law enforcement purposes. It didn't take for a reason. People rejected it. That didn't mean the NSA didn't spend a lot of time and money trying to promote it.

Anyway, here's my take: I personally feel a responsibility to be a responsible FPV pilot. I've taken the time and effort to get a FCC license, I print my name, contact details and callsign on my FPV airframes, I've even installed APM flight controllers on them to allow me to program in geofence, return to launch, and min/max ceilings for fly by wire flight -- all so that I can fly FPV in as safe a condition as I possibly can. I think it can be done reasonably with the right technology and skills.

 

[nerdnic]

Back in 1993, under President George HW Bush, I saw a similar effort to control cryptographic technology. Anyone remember the hubbub over key escrow systems, DES being replaced, public key systems coming into use, etc? Well, the Government was worried that the NSA wouldn't be able to keep up with the much harder to crack public key algorithms (vs symmetric key algos) and were even worried about long keys used in symmetric algorithms. Well, the key escrow would have been a backdoor type implementation where any government agency with a warrant, could obtain the escrowed key to decrypt any traffic for law enforcement purposes. It didn't take for a reason. People rejected it. That didn't mean the NSA didn't spend a lot of time and money trying to promote it.

You realize this actually happened right?

http://mobile.theverge.com/2013/12/...-a-back-door-into-rsa-encryption-according-to

Of course RSA denies knowing about or any form of relationship between the NSA.
https://blogs.rsa.com/news-media/rsa-response/

 

[FAI-F1D]

Anyway, here's my take: I personally feel a responsibility to be a responsible FPV pilot. I've taken the time and effort to get a FCC license, I print my name, contact details and callsign on my FPV airframes, I've even installed APM flight controllers on them to allow me to program in geofence, return to launch, and min/max ceilings for fly by wire flight -- all so that I can fly FPV in as safe a condition as I possibly can. I think it can be done reasonably with the right technology and skills.

Yeah, well I feel a responsibility to not do things that make my fellow man unsafe, too, but that doesn't mean I can't think that perhaps there are a bunch of folks in the government who are incompetent, and a few more that really are ill-intentioned. You know there are a few elected officials out there who think they should be allowed to carry guns to keep them safe, but that you shouldn't be allowed to do the same. Those individuals then hold press conferences in which they hold guns in ways that show they are less qualified to even be near a gun than you are. They are fat cats who love the power they've gained. It's human nature. We all want power. That's why I not only vote for, but actively support candidates who will work to reduce the size and power of government rather than expand it.

There was a time when we didn't need the NSA to spy on its own citizens because the citizens themselves were armed and took care of internal problems themselves. That practice was followed because we had a war to rid ourselves of a government that spied on its citizens and worked to confiscate their guns (forget about that bit in history class that Lexington and Concord were fought over gun confiscation, not taxes?).

The irony is not lost on me that in many states it is illegal to carry a gun into a church...there was a time when one of the pastor's key roles in his congregation was to teach them marksmanship...also that the members were required to bring their guns to church. My how times have changed!