First Ever MultiRotor Build

[THEORY101]

Hello!

If you can't already tell, I'm new here and only recently have I taken an interest into RC stuff. I find it cool and I really want to get into the hobby. If I start saying stuff that isn't correct, please correct me because I like being informed on these kinds of things

I did some digging around a while ago for some Quad-rotor frames and came upon a VTail configuration frame by Lynxmotion and I immediately wanted to build something with it.

http://www.lynxmotion.com/c-167-vtail-500.aspx

I think in the long run I would want to get into mainly FPV racing or FPV in general but I would love to have some insight into what I should do.

(Also I'd like to keep it low in terms of cost. Maybe around $350-$400 dollars. I have no idea if that budget is realistic at all but I just don't want to break the bank.)

Basically, I have two questions:
Would it be a good idea to start off this hobby by building something from scratch and spending a couple hundred dollars out of the box for the components and learning on that, or should I start small and work my way up?

If this is a good idea, then what are the best price to performance components that I could get for this frame without breaking the bank?

All the best:
THEORY101

 

[ElectriSean]

Definitely start small, there are tons of nano sized quads for < $100 that are very durable. I always recommend building over RTF stuff for the larger frames, but I'd advise against any type of v tail, tilt rotor or tricopter for your first, go with something more basic. It's a steep learning curve as it is, adding other complexities will just add frustration.

 

[PsyBorg]

Several questions to answer first.

Do you have any experience with RC anything?
If so do you own your own radio?
If so do you have a computer capable of mid level video games?
Do you have any mechanical or electrical skills needed for building like plan reading or the ability to do by watching some one else as well as decent soldering skills?

If several of these are answered yes then a build would be warranted but either way the smaller you start the more forgiving the quad will be for the inescapable crashing that will come with the set up and learning to fly process. I suggest you start out on a simulator while making the decision before hand so you get an idea how things work and what you can do before potentially doing a fair sized investment though.

Each direction has its benefits as well as drawbacks. Ready to fly is great to yank out of a box, charge a battery and put something in the air. Right up until that time you crash and need to repair. Then you have to deal with more expensive proprietary parts in most cases, some times long waits on replacement parts, and on some lesser manufactured models whether they even work out of the box at all.

with building you get the experience of putting it together and setting it up so you have that built in ability to know how to fix it. You also have the benefit of choosing what parts and how you source them. You can make a far better machine for the same pricing as pre built s in most cases. The draw back is a hard leaning curve as you have to be mechanically oriented, electronically based, and computer literate to be able to build and set it up before you even fly. Now don't panic as that is not as overwhelming as it reads. You tube university has everything you will need to learn and do already packaged in multiple ways to suit your learning style.

 

[JimCR120]

Theory,
Another important question, are you wanting to fly LOS (line of sight) only or also FPV (first person view)?

I notice this was your first post and you are jumping right in with the desire to build. Excellent! You are in very good company. Would you be so kind as to tell us more about yourself? Age, location, interests in the hobby and any other details you might like to share are typical.
Welcome to the forum.
&#8212;Jim

 

[THEORY101]

To PsyBorg:

The largest thing I've ever owned in terms of RC is a cheapy IR controller helicopter. And even then my experience is limited due to my dog wanting to destroy the thing before it ever took off.

As for radios, I've never owned one. I started some research yesterday and found that like the bog standard radio to get is either the FRSky Taranis DX9+ or Spektrum DX6 (I realize I might be completely wrong in this assumption but nonetheless). If you happen to know of any radios that would fit my certain situation then please tell me. I want to start off something oriented for beginners but once I get the hang of it, I'd still be able to get a fair amount of usage before having to buy something new.

My laptop does come with an Nvidia GeForce 940M. Most of the games that I play on Steam can hit at least 30 fps on decent graphics so I imagine that this would be able to run some simulators available. I also have an Xbox 360 style controller and Logitech Joystick if that will help in any way.

"The ability to do by watching some one else." I can do this and catch on to things like this very quickly. Decent soldering skills? I don't have any hands on experience with soldering but I think I can catch on quickly.

To JimCR120:

I want to focus mainly on FPV. I don't have much experience in line of sight flying so I don't think I'd be able to make much of an informed decision on what I want to focus on but I know that eventually I want to get in FPV.

 

[PsyBorg]

If you are already eyeing the Taranis I will assume you have the funds to go that quality out of the gate. May I and probably others as well suggest you take a look at the Tarnais QX7. Its the same radio only smaller and a few less physical switches.

As far as your soldering skills I advise you to get one of them cheapie electronics kits off Amazon and use that to practice on. The act of soldering is not hard at all. Its the method and repeat ability that trips every one up. If you use to high heat or stay on your connection too long you can burn traces or lift pads right off of pcbs. If too low you get a cold solder joint which is more resistive to current and also more fragile and prone to cracking or even breaking off. Still easy to do and learn with an hour or so of repetition. If you plan on being in the hobby look for a temperature controlled solder station that has an iron with changeable tips as well if you can afford it this early in the hobby.

I mention the computer as you will have to load and flash software to the various parts at some point or other so thast a must have. It also allows with that set up to easily use flight simulators that can help familiarize you more quickly on how things work. The main one I recommend is FPV freerider. Its very cheap I think under a 15 dollar donation for a full version. There is a free version with only one map that will serve well enough though. In my opinon it is the best scale-able and tune-able sim that feels the most like real flying if you know and take the time to tune it. Another and my second favorite is Hotprops. I am getting better at tuning that so It gets used as well. Third one I use is DRL. Not the worst sim , not the best sim, but it does have a reason to use it as well. To me its to video gamey more so then a training tool like hot props and Freerider. All should easily work with the game pad but I suggest to not even bother and wait til you get the actual radio as you won't have to unlearn an awkward feeling controller.

LOS at least for the early parts is a necessity as you have to see what the quad is doing to be able to "Maiden" it as you get a better perspective of what may need to be troubleshot or tuned. That and it gets the muscle memory of real flight in-bedded into your subconscious. Some people lean on auto leveling modes early on and I would suggest to not do that if you are going to a more race based style. It makes you be lazy and induces bad habits of allowing the computers do the work and not you. A little time in a sim before real flight will be more then enough to slowly get you in the air without too much problems if the build goes right the first time thru.

Most of all remember you have the knowledge and experience of this entire community to draw from so do not hesitate to ask questions or as you already are doing advise.

 

[JimCR120]

Another thing can help you decide, at the top of the forum page there is a selection, "GET STARTED". This can offer some direction in the various ways to get into the hobby. Certainly everyone needs to be able to fly LOS, and those who desire FPV flying can do so as they progress and when they feel ready. A camera is easy enough to install.

Both the Taranis and Spektrum radios are very popular. I'm confident you can find satisfaction with either line that will last many years.

Keep us posted regarding what you are more interested in and then those of us with experience in those areas can continue to share thoughts.

 

[THEORY101]

I think I will get ahold of a Taranis Q X7. Thank you for the recommendation, PsyBorg. And FPV Freerider works very well on my computer so I don't raw graphics power is an issue.

As for the quadrotor itself, do either of you have an experience building a VTail? The frames that Lynxmotion sell are 500mm and 400mm and the only difference between the two would be motor size, overall weight, and overall package. I'd like to know your thoughts. Also, if you know anyone who has experience with VTails, have them join this thread as well.

 

[JimCR120]

Have you seen this? If not it might answer some questions.

 

[PsyBorg]

All I know is that V tail usually means big which translates to expensive when you bite the dust. Not to mention something that big has a lot of inertia and is probably not the best thing for a new pilot. I would seriously start smaller. There are several videos online of people using Flite Tests Versa Copter kits to do V tails if you REALLY must start there. At least it will not be so big and likely to to do real damage in a bad situation. Smaller really is better to learn on in most aspects.

Here is one that shows another size V Tail for comparison with a Versa build.

 

[cranialrectosis]

I think I will get ahold of a Taranis Q X7. Thank you for the recommendation, PsyBorg. And FPV Freerider works very well on my computer so I don't raw graphics power is an issue.

As for the quadrotor itself, do either of you have an experience building a VTail? The frames that Lynxmotion sell are 500mm and 400mm and the only difference between the two would be motor size, overall weight, and overall package. I'd like to know your thoughts. Also, if you know anyone who has experience with VTails, have them join this thread as well.

This is THE episode.

This is the one that started it all. This is where David W invented the V tail quad.

FGA started here. I bought and built my first copter including my first Bat Bone tricopter after this. The Bat Bone was my second copter. I'm probably on number 30 by now...

Back then (way back then) there were no good props in 4" and 5". There were no 1806 or 2204 2300kv motors. They just didn't exist. The KK2 was an exciting new thing. Most folks ran 750kv to 1000kv motors and 10" to 12" props. I was the rebel and ran 1450kv motors and 8" props. 'It's so underpowered' people said. 'You want long props for long flight times', people said.

Back then a 400mm quad WAS small. I bumped my knuckle I quad down to 300mm. People thought I was nuts.

Higher KV motors and short props are quicker to respond, lighter and tend to last a bit longer and be more fun (IMO) than low kv motors and long props. That said, you can build a V tail that runs 5" props or 16" props. It is up to you and how/where you want to fly.

Lots of people got bit by the V tail bug. It's a wicked looking copter and while it will never be able to compete flat out with an X frame quad with the same electronics, they are fun to fly and that's what matters.

Armattan makes some popular (if expensive) frames and kits. The V tail and mini-V tails are popular.
http://www.armattanquads.com/v-tail-258/

There are some build videos around as well.
http://www.armattanquads.com/armattan-v-tail-355-build-tutorial-by-bmays/

I am looking at the Lynxmotion page. These are expensive for fiberglass. They sell T motors and suggest 1100kv motors and 8" props on 3S (not exactly a screamer). Their $500 copter will be a slow, heavy, expensive machine.

David Windenstall (the guy who invented the V tail in the first place) for his tricopter recommends MUCH less expensive 1300kv motors spinning the same 8" props as the Lynxmotion and on 4S for a MUCH, MUCH peppier copter of about the same size.
https://rcexplorer.se/product/tricopter-v3-kit/

If you want power plant advice, I would look HARD at David's examples on RCExplorer.

If you want a V tail frame, I would look HARD at Armattan. The $84 Lynxmotion frame is fiberglass. The $150 Armattan is carbon fiber. The Lynxmotion frame is not built to last on a 'peppy' copter. The Armattan is FAR less limited.

I hope all this helps. Please post pics. We don't see too many V tails anymore and I just LOVE how they look in the air.

 

[THEORY101]

Sorry for the whole literal year of inactivity with this post. Unfortunately life got in the way and I couldn't devote as much time, if any, into this as a hobby. I done a bit of research on the matter and I'd like to get some second opinions.

For a transmitter, I'll go with the FrSky Taranus Q X7 considering for the price, it has a lot of features. As for what to build or use to get into the whole hobby, I think I'll go with the FT Versacopter V2 with the recommended Power Pack E to try and start as a platform and work my way up. From then on, I'll probably get a hold of the Armattan 258 V-Tail. I'll probably branch out from there considering there are whole host of other things I can do within this hobby.

If there is anything else that seems out of place or something that seems to be missing, let me know!

I look forward to your responses.

 

[nwnugget]

You will not be disappointed with the QX7. It is an excellent transmitter.

 

[PsyBorg]

If you go the Versa Copter route do not bother with the NAZE as that will be soon unsupported. Go with a newer flight controller. Personal preference for brand or type does not matter as most are extremely reliable and fully functional to learn on. It boils down to "Feel" which you wont know until you use one for a time what you like more.

The Versa is an awesome platform that can be adapted to many configurations with the simple use of nuts n bolts and changing of boom placements so that will serve you well to experiment and learn on. Then you can go for a specific built carbon frame for your needs and re purpose or replace gear as you grow.

 

[cranialrectosis]

The QX7 runs OpenTX.

OpenTX is VERY powerful with tons of features.

It also has a massively steep learning curve. Plan to spend a few days just on that transmitter.

Oh, buy the USB cable for it. Not all cables are the same and fiddling with a transmitter that won't connect because you are using a cell phone charging cable really blows.

 

[THEORY101]

The cable is more special than a mini-USB to regular sized USB?

 

[THEORY101]

Anything to recommend for prop size? I was planning on 3D printing them in the first place instead of buying one

 

[THEORY101]

Here's where I am at right now:

In the FliteTest store I have ready to buy:

FT VersaCopter 280 kit

Power Pack E

And the FrSky R-XSR 2.4 GHz Accst Micro Receiver

The Q X7 I'll buy off HobbyKing because (to my annoyance) FliteTest no longer have it in stock

Anything else I seem to be missing from this list besides a battery pack for the quad itself and props for the motors?

 

[Pigfarm1403]

Start with a tiny whoop!

I was in the exact same position as you 6 months ago. If you have not already build one build a tiny whoop or a super whoop. You can make them for about 100$ which is a pretty good starting price. I learned to fly drones fpv with it and had no issue transferring from a whoop to a baby hawk. A baby hawk is another good fpv quad but it's not a diy. A great diy intermediate project is an FT gremlin. I am an intermediate drone flyer and these three planes helped me bridge the gap between being a noob and learning how to fly and FPV quad.

 

[PenguinWings]

Hey Theory!

Congratulations on the Versa Copter! I don't have much quad experience, so take the following with a grain of salt, but Pigfarm makes a good point about starting small. I'm flying a Gremlin right now and learning a ton on it and because it's so light, I don't destroy it on every crash. However, building was a bit tricky since it's so small.

Of course, sometimes you just have to say "forget you," make a choice, and follow it. I don't have a lot of experience: listen to Cranial and Psyborg more than me, but either way, here are some things I picked up (mostly by doing them wrong the first time):

1. Don't forget to get a plug for your battery to plug into.
2. Make sure you can solder cleanly on other stuff before soldering the quad stuff (did a poor job on my Gremlin and I've had some trouble since with bad joints coming loose).
3. Keep the motors away from a work bench with metal shavings on it! The magnets in the motors will make them stick to the insides... and, from experience, it's a pain to get them out.

For what it's worth, from a fellow noob.