Flite Fest 2017 One-Design Racing

[SlingShot]

Hi All,

My $0.02 worth.

It occurs to me that scale building and racing are two completely different animals. I would like to suggest that, if an interest in racing with broad-based participation is an objective, then one-design racing should be considered. Decide how slow you want to race and then choose a plane from the existing FT lineup. Everybody flies the same plane, same motor, same ESC and same battery. It then all comes down to pilot and racing luck

 

[Craftydan]

That was somewhat the goal of the first NASBWACC . . . sorta an IROC of air combat, and while it was combat and not racing, from my experience there, you'll be hard pressed to organize this.


Which racer? which spec? What happens when the chosen set is less than optimal?

What if one racer wants to modify the build slightly? Disqualified?

Which motor/prop/ESC/battery? Use a 9.5x6 instead of a 9x6 . . . disqualified?

Gensace instead of Venom . . . Disqualified?

Don't like the spec'ed HK motor because you don't like HK? Picked up a similar motor to FT's pack . . . but not quite the same . . . Disqualified?

One of the saving graces of NASBWAC's combat was the scoring was by hit count and not by crossing a finish line -- having an outlaw class added to the fun, instead of confusing "who won". In the race you propose, such a class cannot be allowed to compete.

My point here is you've just spotted an ant-mound and you're contemplating making mud-pies with it. Some of these issues can be settled by consensus, some by decree, but you've got an uphill battle to build enough interest that the FTFF flightline is shut down for yet another race event.

 

[SlingShot]

That was somewhat the goal of the first NASBWACC . . . sorta an IROC of air combat, and while it was combat and not racing, from my experience there, you'll be hard pressed to organize this.


Which racer? which spec? What happens when the chosen set is less than optimal?

What if one racer wants to modify the build slightly? Disqualified?

Which motor/prop/ESC/battery? Use a 9.5x6 instead of a 9x6 . . . disqualified?

Gensace instead of Venom . . . Disqualified?

Don't like the spec'ed HK motor because you don't like HK? Picked up a similar motor to FT's pack . . . but not quite the same . . . Disqualified?

One of the saving graces of NASBWAC's combat was the scoring was by hit count and not by crossing a finish line -- having an outlaw class added to the fun, instead of confusing "who won". In the race you propose, such a class cannot be allowed to compete.

My point here is you've just spotted an ant-mound and you're contemplating making mud-pies with it. Some of these issues can be settled by consensus, some by decree, but you've got an uphill battle to build enough interest that the FTFF flightline is shut down for yet another race event.

Wow! Easy there big fellow. I´m suggesting an ADDITIONAL class. A "sport class" which by rule would be accessible. And yes, generally disqualified for any of those reasons mentioned. Back in the day we raced "Toads". All unmodified with stock K&B front rotor .40´s. Every one fueled up from the same can.

Out of curiosity, what's that about shutting down flight lines? For what reason are flight lines in danger? Are you saying it would be too time consuming?

 

[AkimboGlueGuns]

Wow! Easy there big fellow. I´m suggesting an ADDITIONAL class. A "sport class" which by rule would be accessible. And yes, generally disqualified for any of those reasons mentioned. Back in the day we raced "Toads". All unmodified with stock K&B front rotor .40´s. Every one fueled up from the same can.

Out of curiosity, what's that about shutting down flight lines? For what reason are flight lines in danger? Are you saying it would be too time consuming?

I believe what Dan is trying to say is that it might be more trouble than it's worth.

As for your other questions, The flight lines would likely be the same way that they are for combat events. Shut down unless you are participating. As far as danger to the flight line, there are several designs in the golden age build off that could very well push 100 mph, so having other traffic in the area would be less than ideal.

 

[Craftydan]

Sling,

I'm not mad, I'm laying out the headaches you're leaning toward. I have organized these things, and I don't think this is impossible, I just think it's more than most would like to bite off.

An additional class is a NEW race. The "Flite Fest 2017 International Air Races " is a bit overburdened as it is with two separate races. Perhaps more some day, but an IROC class on the first year -- particularly if the airframes in the other two classes can't compete -- IMO is a non-starter. My opinion, nothing more. You're welcome to prove me wrong, but this event will further fracture the pool of potential participants.

Actually, I don't see this as making the competition as more accessible, but less. If the planes must be identical, then the price of entry is building exactly the chosen plane, with little to no leeway. It might not cost much, but the inflexibility will drive away most builders. The other two races you'll have a choice of several designs (or make your own, if you start early enough) and how you choose to build it out is up to the builder -- you don't have to be the designer to fly.


If an organized event occurs on the flight line, where that event occurs the flightline is shut down, as well as neighboring lines. That's a safety issue, and it doesn't matter if it's rocket racing or flying puppies (honestly, not sure which would be more dangerous), the lines are shut down for the duration and cleanup of that event. In particular for a "race", you'd want the line cleared of all but your competitors anyways, if for no other reason as to keep obstacles out of the way.

I'm not saying it will be too time consuming, but too much of the same thing makes the pitch for "yet another" that much harder. If you want to pirate a flightline (the initial plan for the NASBWACC was to do just that) I'm not going to be "That Guy" and run you off . . . but flightline discipline will need to be stricter next year -- for good reasons -- so the odds of a pirate event occurring is dropping. You'll probably need some level of approval for the small event.

 

[SlingShot]

Oh well. Someone such as myself would be flying in with zero aircraft with the idea of throwing together two or three very quickly. If I was racing a Mini Mustang? Bloody Barron? Spitfire? Even a Storch or a Delta I'd be all over it. Racing is relative. You don't have to go fast. Just faster.

I will in any case look forward to seeing it. It sounds to me now that this event is more of a "Demo" of the racing concept with some cool planes. A sort of "Unlimited Class". How many participants and heats are you forecasting?

 

[Craftydan]

Agreed. Racing is always relative

The rules for the Golden era race are still very fluid, and while an "Exhibition Only" event has been floated by, I'm not convinced it will stick -- we may have a few "show-off" laps sometime before the race, and might have a few airframes that look GORGEOUS but not have a chance, but there will be a race. Only the design portion's rules are set in ever-hardening Jello, but the race, there's points still to hash out.

Fluid or not, one of the fundamental goals of each part of these contests is accessibility -- to race, you will have to build out something that ran through the design comp, but those plans must be available to the public, and while you should declare your mods, you shouldn't have to build stock.

How long, how far, how many heats, all depends on the participants, and how things hash out in the first few months of next year (when the plans will need to be available for builders). If we have 10 planes total, heats make no sense. 100? That would be crazy cool (I doubt it will happen, but cool) we'll need to break them up into some prelims . . . which subtracts freetime from the precious flightline clock. We'll have to see, but we'll have a better picture of that in May than we do now.

So how many competitors will we have? I know better than to guess at this point, but following the organic nature of FTFF, sound course of action is to just make room, nurture it to grow in the coming months and try to keep it as broadly appealing as it can be. The subject itself of scale golden era racers is constricting enough as it is, but it's a good theme that blends design with a practical use in mind that anyone can take part in, at any phase.