Professor Fates' Morane Saulnier N design and build

[ProfessorFate]

Always liked Fate ( Jack Lemmon The Great Race ) he had some flying bricks and wild looking stuff, so have I. Some I have are just flying bricks, others just fly like they are supposed to. The closer you are to a conventional shape, the easyer this is. Golden age pioneer age stuff is really interesting. DH2s FE2s French and English pusher biplanes and the Morane Saulnier type N. This was the 1st one to take a mounted machine gun ( French ) with steel plates, every 10 shots, one might bounce back at you.

Morane Saulnier N: WS = 48", L = 34", W = 2.5 - 3#, power 3s 3AH w/ Cobra Motor 10 x 5 prop 2.25" Black Spinner, 40A Esc w/ 5A BEC
Fuse: Fiberglass or Wood in front, LitePly frames n 1/8" dowels aft of wing shoulder, stained balsa covered in monocote
Wing: Balsa n Spar built using Profili for airfoil gen. Lifting airfoil close to flat-bottom 9" chord cover in cream or clear w/ stain

My goal, making this up free style as I go, but generally, following a 3 view, to make dimensions for a 48 inch WS Morane Saulnier N.
Been struggling with this, I draw a lot with paint shop pro ver 10 to look at things and figure them out get a sense for the scale, PSP lets me enlarge to full size n measure w/ rulers and grids and great precision.

A really useful formula I made up for scaling 3v drawings is what I call WRX
W = size you want (typically wing span), X = existing size of your drawing ( Wing Span again ), R = rate of expansion or enlargement W/RX.
If you draw this in just like the old pie formula d/rt and cover up the one you want to know, you are left with what to do. 3 formulas in one mnemonic.
Cover up R, leaving W size you want divided by X existing size of your 3view picture. This gives you % to enlarge.

W = 48 inches , My 3view X = 29 inches, 48/29 = 1.655 ok enlarge drawing 166%, that will give WS pic of 48 inches.
Cool huh? You might have just guessed b4 till you got it, but now you have a way to get it exactly the first time.

At WS of 48 inches, this gives a chord length of 9.25 inches to the Morane Saulnier, OK the 57 inch FT Storch also has a chord of about 9 inches and weighs 2.25 - 2.5 #.

I was all about building the Storch but undecided on how to build it with what materials. FGlass fuse or foam board? Balsa n Spar wing or foam board?
In hobby lobby picking up some of those ultimate surebonder acrylsticks, I got 2 packs, was thinking of dowels instead of BBQ skewers to attach the wing, and then a great build method occured to me using 1/8" Lite Ply frames with holes drilled around the perimeter that these 1/8" x 36" dowel rods would be inserted thru ( 29 cents each ). The outsides of the dowels flush also with frames outside. Now balsa slats 1/8 thick by 1/4 to 1/2" wide are glued on the dowels as runners to be stained and to leave a clear space between to see thru. With a total of 8 - 10 dowels on the circle of the frames this would be pretty light and stout too. This to be covered with clear Monocote. There is a youtube video of a cheap alternative to Monocote, clear or colored cellowrap and similar at the Dollar Stores, Hobby Lobby, Fam$, HEB, Walmart too.
These wraps can be had for as little as $1 a roll for as much as 10 feet / roll. You just have to glue it on with anything, 3m77, E6000, or other flexy heat activated glues. I will probably use my role of clear Monocoat but I did buy 10 rolls of cello to play with too. The guy on youtube video glues cello with 3m77 to a foam frame tight as a snare drum with hole in middle 16 inches across and demonstrates how tight and strong. Good idea.

Well this you see is on the proverbial drawing board first, while others might get out the foam n glue and stick stuff together, I sometimes play with paint shop till I like what I have then another better build method may come to me.

Now here's what I have been struggling with up to this point, that I want to streamline the Morane, make the fuse thinner and see if it still looks good or anemic, then work out the other shapes. This is going to be an impressionistic free style version of the Morane, not an exact scale of it.
The FT Storch at 57"WS, should have a chord of about 7 or 8 inches not 9.25, see it's not scale either but it sure flies n floats good!
The 48" WS Morane should have a fuse width of about 5.75 inches (my Apprentice is 5.75"wide); no, I want it to penetrate the wind like an arrow or a torpedo, not like a whale.
Below I tested this to see how it would look width-wise, and I think it will work and look good too.
So later in the design work, having made the determination for 4 to 4.5 inch max width, the current work is what to decide about the side view. I'll show a picture of my variation on this. I have lengthened the nose 6 inches for better balance, flattened the bottom, tapered the nose to take a 2.25" black dubro spinner and I checked to see if the largest motors X plate will fit inside the narrowed nose I made for the Morane, it needed 1.96", it works.
Trouble is now that I just don't want the simple appearance of a featureless flying torpedo or something like my gasser UltraStick, no pilot, just a flying "stick".

This will look like a Golden Age work of art with stained wood, clear covering in some areas, nice complex curves and maybe some cool looking wheels too!

No .... no build pics yet! This is the design work, BUT, the pictures are becoming... just like Buffalo Bill and the Red Dragon!
"One should never be afraid to try new things" ( HL ).

 

[ProfessorFate]

Where it's at now, checking ground clearance, wing placement, front fuse shape.

I don't know what other airplane this could be in this form, but I'm leaving out cables n extra stuff. Checking how it looks final and this w/ 3.5 inch wheels that I have ordered from RadicalRC.com should give 8.5 inches center line to the ground. Plenty of space for that 10" prop!

"The Russians don't even take a dump without a plan..." H4RO Adm.Painter

 

[ProfessorFate]

Started building carved fuse of foam

Sorry no pics yet have to work out problem with camera.
I made the front fuse just exactly like the side view of last picture out of foam.
Installed LG plate on bottom with 6/32 blind nuts recessed, and then the completed firewall also with 6/32 blind nuts to take my cobra 2820/10 to drive an APC 10x5 prop.
Last to go before glassing over fuse is to install the wing shoulders recessed into the foam as hardpoints then glass over the whole front piece.
3s 2700 lipo + motor + esc + spinner = 16.63oz
Fuse + LG plate + Firewall = 6.27 oz
Aluminum Landing Gear and big light 3.5 inch wheels = 5.54 oz from Radical RC
4 Hi Tech HS 645 MG = 7.76oz
Total is 36.2 oz so far
Left to do is wing shoulders n glass over all then make tail n stabs n wings .... 19.8 oz left to build with or it's just going to be a little heavy.
My weight budget is 19.8 oz left to build fuse and wings and end up with a total of a plane weighing 3.5# with 16oz wing load
The cobra motor with a 10x6 on 3s gives 57.4oz or 3.6# thrust. This plane may not be able to hover, it will be close
The cobra with APC 9x4.5 on 4s gives 71oz or 4.44# thrust. It could hover if I used 4s and came in under AUW of 4#, very likely to.
Pictures to follow when I fix my camera problem!
This build method does look different, may do this again for another plane.

Hey well did I say that some warbirds have a wing loading of upto 28 oz per square foot!!!
That would mean I could build this plane to 6.125# because it's chord is 10.5" and area is 3.5 foot^2!
No, it won't be that heavy.

 

[ProfessorFate]

Impatience gets me, glassed in the LG plate partially

View attachment 44412 View attachment 44412 View attachment 44412 Been wanting to test my 2 laminating resins and glass something too.
I laminated 2 layers of tight weave 5 oz glass cloth 4" x 4" with a long setting epoxy from Dewey Supply in Corpus Christi,Tx $70/gallon... used only an ounce or less for the test, for weight and strength test. According to definition of what it is, a square yard is supposed to weigh 5 oz, right so then I have doubled this so this is 10 oz and I have 16/1296 x 10oz = .1234567 oz what a coincidence, yep, did it twice just to check those suspicious numbers! Well I usu don't like grams but the unit is so small OK sample is supposed to weigh 3.5 grams, it will be probably weigh 4 grams as all I did was lay it on a tape covered board and squeegee it then leave it to cure, cannot wait to get it and weigh it then see how hard it is to break. That done with Zpoxy is very strong, but then Zpoxy is also very expensive, 8 oz cost like $16 or $256 for a gallon so I hope the Dewey stuff works just as good. and the test plate has to weigh about 4 grams!
Laminated in the Landing Gear plate covering the blind nuts with tape, to cut out later, laminated with Zpoxy, it is a pretty rigid epoxy when wet in fiberglass it has tremendous strength ( repaired broken handle to 100 foot tape measure with this ), figured I needed something rigid on landing gear, I covered it with packing tape so it layed down smooth and then eliminates the need to sand as well.
fuse weighs 6.7 oz now, really liking this digital scale but wish I had one you just plug in that needs no attention, you know in the mode you want and just put your thing on and weigh.
Firewall is installed buried 2" inside fuse now with blind nuts ready for motor X brace, and that's not the right landing gear, will use std aluminum landing gear and 3.5" wheels, but the motor is right, and strong on 3 or 4 cells 3 cell 10x6 will give plenty of thrust for a 4# golden age tail dragger.

Pics coming when I fix camera issue

"Push the button, Max!"

 

[ProfessorFate]

Figuring weight to glass fuse by the sample

Still no pics but I'm working on it
4x4 glass sample of 2 layers glass weighed .405 oz fig area as 286.5in^2 it would take 17.53 x .405 oz = 7.1 oz to glass
Not as rigid as I would like after 30 hours, but still I don't dare go much heavyer, may use the Z-poxy to laminate.
I have built things before that were just too heavy to fly, what a waste.
Not doing that this time. So I am re-examining the weight of construction to see how heavy and what wing load and thrust to weight ratio can be achieved.
6.7 oz Fuse right now glassed LG plate and has Firewall with blind nuts
7.1 oz 2 layers fiberglass
4.0 oz Wing Shoulder plates
17.8 oz Front Fuse Done
1 oz servo mount plate in fuse
8 oz 4 std servos
22.54 oz Batt Motor Esc prop spinner screws Land Gear n Wheels
2 oz 8 dowels for tail
18.55 oz Sig Somethin Extra Wing and tube for substitute
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
69.89 oz still needed Tail stabs,rudder wheel, ailerons
Wing Area = 3.5 foot^2
4.5# = 72oz Wing Load = 20.57 oz/ft^2

3s 10x6 57.4 oz thrust
4s 9x4.5 71 oz thrust
OK so looks like it won't hover because of thrust to weight ratio of 57 to 71 oz thrust ----- to 72oz model weight
But it will be a beautiful scale looking fun flyer, some warbirds come in with wingloads of 28oz and fly good so a wing load of 21 oz is something I can accept. Now to finish that build.

Pictures are coming.

 

[ProfessorFate]

Now I got the cam fixed, going fwd plans to put wing shoulders then f-glass the skin.






The 4x4 pc of glass is 2 plies of 5oz this is a test laminated with Dewey Supply epoxy and weighs .405 oz so this is going to conservatively make the skin weigh 7.1 oz for the front of the fuse. The pile of glue pot below sample is a pot of glass n Zpoxy I repaired a friends tape measure handle with. It is incredibly strong and rigid. Afraid to break it in my bare hands, it might take so much to break, that it might shoot up into my hand with all the force it would take.

I am going thru with this after installing recessed ply wing shoulders for the wing tube.
I ordered some .81" dia wrapped carbon fiber tube from Kitesandfunthings.com, not cheap either, $32 and you can stand on it, the 48 inch length will hold your weight but will weigh about 6oz. I will cut this in half giving two 24" tubes.

With this thick tube I cannot use the Selig 5020 airfoil I had planned on, but looked in Profili for a wing thicker than 9% and found the Piper Cub Wing full size uses USA 35B and it is 11%, on 10.5 inch chord, this gives me enough space to insert fwd of the main spar and put in the "D-Box" inside a glassed in slip sleave the wing tube. There is a good forum thread where these Piper Cub/ Taylor Craft pilots are discussing this airfoil and comparing it to others. This foil, tho, has a lifting shape and they said it was very good at lifting heavy loads too. Well that decides it for me.

Nope was never going to use the original parasol wing airfoil. Building/designing this for the best characteristics, not authenticity, that's why I lengthened the nose 6 inches and narrowed the fuse about 1.5 inches (for penetration and a smaller less problematic spinner).

I don't want any trouble, just a beautiful airplane that flies nicely and looks classy. The front glass part will be painted satin red, the back 24" frame n dowel construction will be stained a dark rosy wood stain color, you will be able to see thru the back, and it will be covered with clear monocote.
The wings will be covered in satin cream colored monocote.

Monocote is far better and stronger, more durable than any other iron on covering ( like is it DuraCover? no?), don't know why that other stuff is sold and used so much!

One thing you might see from the pic, it would be really hard to get your hand in from the pilot seat opening so I decided to do as much as possible on the outside before glassing so there would not be anything left to do inside except inner bulkhead of lite ply and a long hardware tray for servos, esc and battery. That will be hard enough to manage like building a ship in the proverbial bottle!
The Landing Gear plate is installed with blind 6/32 nuts already, now the 1/4" motor firewall is also all ready with 6/32 blind nuts, properly fit for the motor "X" mount, expect no trouble there, already cut holes for cooling and wires too.

The 10 dowels will be epoxied with Parabond under the glass skin of the back of the fiberglass fuse right behind the pilot seat.

I'm still thinking of making the ESC wires to bullet connectors longer, but we'll see. All gear internal is battery, 2 hi torque metal gear servos, and the ESC.
Think this is where I will try out the ESC innov8tivedesigns is sending me, it is 40 or 50 Amps and the BEC is 6 Amps instead of the 5Amps on my 40Amp5Amp Ztw from AltitudeHobbies.

As I slowly see things come together nicely, it is rewarding to be building something that is curvy and classy that does not look like a box like my Sig Somethin Extra. Beginning to enjoy and relish this rather than feeling a mad rush. I know I want to finish and fly this too.
Never have I ever built something nice.

 

[ProfessorFate]

Which airfoil, the wingtube is likely .75" OD

I really want to cheat on the chord length of the more slender S5020 meaning use the 12inch but chop the tail of the chord a little, kind of a squeeze to get the wing tube in this wing having only a max of 1/8 space top n bottom to glass in a wing tube sleeve. This airfoil is highly favored by the builder/designer at http://www.aerodesign.de/english/profile/profile_s.htm who builds and flies a lot of wings and conventional planes and likes this foil also for it's lift.
The fatter I go, the harder it is for an electric plane, already heavy to penetrate and fly. My Olympic 650 glider did not take wind so well that is, it would get blown backwards, don't want the foil too fat.

USA 35b chord right at 10.5 inch gives max thickness of 1.25 inches but what a fat chord too, won't have the ability to penetrate and glide that the s5020 will have. This is the airfoil used for the full size Piper Cubs.


Anybody have a Piper Cub that they know, has a USA 35b foil or close to it with a chord of about 10.5 inches? How do you like the way it flies?

I'm workin on this while also prepping wing shoulders to hold wing tube.
If I think I can get enough glass around the wing tube to hold it against the main spar, this fwd of the wing spar inside the "D Box", then it will work good with the s5020, it is easyer to go with the USA 35b but possibly at expense of performance.

 

[ProfessorFate]

Progress now needing to be glassed

Foam fuse needed 3 hardpoints Firewall, Landing Gear, WingShoulders

Ready to be glassed.

 

[ProfessorFate]

Messy, but, Let's Just Do It. Glassed bottom 2/3s Laminated with Deweys Epoxy




This took about an hour, really messy. Epoxy is a skin sensitizer, I did not use gloves and got in there with my bare hands.

Next time I'm starting off with Latex or Rubber Gloves. Cleaned up with Acetone then soap n water.

Fuse weighed 9oz at the start, with the wing shoulders, I mixed up like about 5fluid oz of epoxy in a small empty veg can Peas, labeled as 8oz.
Only used about 2/3s of the mix, so 3oz epoxy used, no? The other thing contributing weight will be the glass. So we'll see after it's cured in a 24 hours, budgeted for 7-8oz for the total glass job. On budget this makes the fuse 16oz.

The front butts to the spinner, the firewall, after digging out the foam in the front, will already have blind nuts, it's ready to just bolt the motor on and run the wires.

What I thought about it before starting, "I can't get my hands in there ... how hard to drill holes n place the blind nuts for the motor X mount while in the fuse or the same goes for the Landing Gear plate" it's all approached now from the outside, easy.

Only hard stuff is making servo/hardware tray to insert from the back, then hook up the hardware.

 

[ProfessorFate]

Fuse forward piece all glassed

If I remove the foam this 20.2 oz piece will weigh 16oz.
See the nose comes ready for the motor, did this before glassing.
The landing gear plate is also done this way.
I could have been hasty and forgot, that would have meant a lot of hard unnecessary work. Trying to work smart, not hard.
These blind nuts, best invention since sliced silicon.

 

[ProfessorFate]

Fuse - foam = 15.2 oz


"I saw the ghostly apparition out on the porch, and it seemed to just hang in the air....."


Fast easy way to smooth, take down hard protruding fiberglass edges or laminate droplets runs bumps pimples etc., a 4.5" grinder with a tiger disk and some ear plugs. 3 minutes and it's done! Got bumps n lumps, get a grinder and a tiger disk.

Couldn't resist running up that Cobra motor w/ 10x5 prop.

Hardware tray and 3 support frames then to the back 24 inches of the fuse, not glass

an easy cool cheap fast dowel n frame construct ... coming soon.

This next idea could be better than DTFB!

 

[jamboree1]

Now this is an interesting build. I'm not sure if you will come within your projected weight though but i never tried fiberglass. Love the looks of the Moraine, as memory serves me correct the original plane was reputed to be very twitchy to the controls but the fastest plane in it's class.

 

[ProfessorFate]

Correcting the picture of what I am building

And checking the balance to make sure I don't have to add weight, installing gear tray for battery, ESC, servos.

I have seen Peter Rakes Morane and I did not want the spinner and balance problems he had, that also come with other short nose airplanes like the Bleriot, so the nose is lengthened and narrowed and the Selig 5020 airfoil is what I will use instead of the original parasol.

In short I'm optimizing for performance and sacrificing authenticity while still keeping the appearance of a real golden age looking airplane. With the Curtiss pushers the redundant canard was often removed, and with the Morane the spinner also was sometimes not used. The wing sits lower along the line of thrust drawn straight from the motor to the tail.

Although it's just a drawing, this is the plan,or what will be built shortly. And no more fiberglass.

 

[ProfessorFate]

15.2 oz just too heavy, this is on hold, My FT Storch fiberglass 6.59 oz fuse



Hi, I sure like this FT community. Been a while and seeing this is electric, the 15.2oz fuse for the Morane seemed too heavy to start with, so I have put this on hold for a while till I figure out how to deal with it or make it a lot lighter.

That Storch video is really nice and I've been wanting to build a Storch for some time now, just did not want to use a material that would would break down so easy like foam board.

The front of the fuse needs 3 hard points, motor, landing gear and wing so I made a foam plug and covered it with fiberglass and laminated it with epoxy resin, the larger generic kind I buy by the gallon, it's cheaper and works really great, gives longer working time too. Guess I used about 5oz of epoxy last night on fuse. This is the glass I mentioned before from Dewey Supply, yall can find some similar business that sells resins and glass too. Epoxy has a far better shelf life than polyester resin and you just mix it 50-50. Polyester resin cost me too much because it's unstable and goes bad too quickly. You can buy epoxy resin for about $60-$70/gallon or smaller quantities like by the quart. Thing that makes it cheap, you don't use much and it will last years if you keep the lids screwed on it.

This fuse half only weighs 6.59 oz, No false starts, I'm gonna use this and do this. The back of fuse will be std wood built and covered and I have been wanting to use the idea I shared with yall about dowel and frame construction. Those hobby-lobby dowels are cheap and light. The 3/16 dowels are only 29 cents each.


This Storch will have almost the same proportions as the FT Storch 57 - 60inch wing and chord may be 8 or 9 inches wood wing lifting airfoil like you would expect on full size Cessnas or Cubs. Using Beef Suppo 2217-7 motor or any 22mm motor I have just like the FT Storch. For landing gear I'll make a removeable plate to hold the gear that can be taped on and easily removed too. Just in case I fly in a grass field and just want to belly land.

Glassing a foam plug seems like a good technique, boxing in a hardware area in the center to keep the foam out for servos, esc an battery would be good. I started the Morane fuse like this, dug out the foam because I did not make a box to hold the stuff, I dug the foam out really sloppy like and just did not like that. The foam would give strength to the fuse. Really at first I thought the glass would be strong enough by itself, there is where I made the mistake, digging out the foam plug. It was very strong before, but, empty, I should have made a hardware box and sprayed the foam back in, but I added more glass, and made it too heavy. The 4x4 inch test square of 2 layers was reasonably strong with foam behind it and the test piece was about .4 oz. The glass cloth was like 5 or 6 oz cloth, it's very common in Home Depot where the Bondo is found. My glass is the same but I got it at a place like Deweys in a big roll 12 inches by 100 or so feet long.

Just in case anyone tries this foam plug and glass fuse tech..... with a plane like this, boxy shape, build the mold female shaped from foam board and cover with something, easy like paint it and cover with carnuba wax, lay glass and tear away a few hours later leaving a 4th side open to work from ( bottom ). If I do another boxy fuse airplane, I will do this to get a smooth finish, then you have to do some trick with a plastic bottle or something to make a female round nose, bottle, foam, ????

The hard thing about a female mold is you cannot see the shape while you build like you can if it's a foam plug. It would work easy if you are sure of your dimensions first and not depending on sanding and shaping and guessing the proportion as you go.

On this Storch fuse I started out planning a completely empty fuse, no foam inside.

Does anyone here use that cello wrap you can find at all dollar stores and grocery stores? It's really cheap and strong, but unlike Top Flite MonoKote, it does not have heat activated adhesive, but also it's only $1-$4 a roll depending where you buy and what you buy.

One of the rolls of covering I have is a good looking true blue about 20 linear feet on the roll, now for $3, this is cheap and a good color too. Just an idea if someone out there is interested in trying a more economical way to cover a plane.

Colors I found that look good are the red,blue, chrome, clear, white. The other colors, it's up to you what you find and what you want to use. I started on this idea of cheaper covering, just been wanting to try and find something way cheaper than $17 for a 6foot roll! To use the bargain stuff, some does shrink, most does not, you would have to apply glue and stretch it tight and let it set. Some glues look good for this, contact cement, like Lepage green because it would not eat the covering, but it's contact cement, and E6000. Maybe others too. I have other colors but they look like gift wrap colors!!! There is a video on youtube shows a guy telling about cheap covering, he glues some of the clear or semitransparent red on a foam frame with what looks like a 16inch hole making a kind of tight skinnned drum from the wrap, he beats on it and shows you how tough it is. This is what got me started on a search for cheap covering alternatives to monokote, three 6 foot rolls for different colors come to almost $60.

Another funny thing is I bought a 20 foot roll of brown paper, thinking of covering and painting.

OK this is my start on the Storch, and the Morane may be on hold for a while till I figure a lighter plan for this plane.

 

[ProfessorFate]

Storch Fuse 6.2 oz + motor mounted, may redo Morane fuse, it's too heavy

 

[ProfessorFate]

Storch Fuse now 8.0 oz

The FT Storch is listed as being 2.2# ??
OK this is not paper or foam and will last longer, it's 8.0 oz like it is

Doing this is giving me ideas about re-working the Morane fuse.

The tail wood part came to 2.0 oz like you see it here, and I used lite-ply, $10 a sheet you can buy it in a 6 sheet bundle from Amazon it comes 12" x 48" x 1/8" thick, good stuff to build with and a good deal.

Using the dowel construction would have been nice, but then it does not give a good amount of area to hold a covering film, so I used the lite-ply instead. On another project I may yet use the dowels and the cello wrap for cheaper covering, this one I think, will get the monocote.

The power system I plan to use is the Beef 2217 suppo 7turn 1250kv motor with 3cell 2700 and a gws 9x5 hd/dd prop limit of 11,111 ( Dr Kiwi limit dd/hd 100,000/prop dia ). The max thrust of this setup is about 40 oz.

Alt power sys idea might be same motor 9 turn 950kv and a larger prop greater pitch for more thrust maybe better flight time and efficiency.

That's a 1/8" CF rod I used to check the side to side alignment of the tail to the front, it is off a little and this CF rod does roll straight. Length is 32 and 11/16 inches
The wing seat was originally for an 8 inch chord but I may make it 9 inches being closer to the proportions of the Flite Test Storch. I stretched the nose a little to avoid any balance problems

I really like rcfreds work with the fiberglass Bloody Wonder.

This idea here is to make a fuse of foam to get the shape you want, then cover it with 2 layers of 6oz glass (epoxy resin) and remove the foam

Alt. idea would be to plan to keep the foam, make a boxed in area for hardware, build foam around it, shape the fuse and cover with 2-3 layers of light glass .5 to 1.5 oz glass, this would lay down smoother, you would not have bubbles like I got in mine with the 6oz cloth, and the foam makes a very strong fuse like this.

Anybody know where to buy 1.5oz fiberglass in larger bulk for better prices, than that sold in the small 1 sq yard packages ???