Flying Monkey fab
Elite member
Okay, the title says my question. As my builds get bigger and I crash less, what are some building techniques between folding DTFB and doing full winter builds in ply and balsa?
Not sure what you are envisioning but here is a link to a Balsa AND FB build. The bird is still in my hanger, it hasn't warped and it was still flying the same as originally just about a month ago, (last time out).Okay, the title says my question. As my builds get bigger and I crash less, what are some building techniques between folding DTFB and doing full winter builds in ply and balsa?
I was intentionally vague so people could free associate.Not sure what you are envisioning
I was intentionally vague so people could free associate.
Thanx I'll check out your thread.
I have no problem with precision cuts as I have a laser but I don't like balsa due to it being a pita to source.Biggest difference to me is when building balsa scratch builds much less forgiving in the measurements and cuts.
Plywood and monocoat would be needlessly heavy.I'm wondering about other alternatives to balsa. I know when you start getting into really big stuff glass and plywood become dominant. I wonder if anyone has built something out of plywood and monocoat?
You must live somewhere totally remote (I feel sorry for you), I initially thought: " I can't buy balsa because it is super expensive and I need a lot " turns out that balsa in Germany is not expensive at all and available in different qualities and quantities (also very easy to work with).I have no problem with precision cuts as I have a laser but I don't like balsa due to it being a pita to source.
I agree and the fuselage is often the only place where plywood makes senses.Plywood has become popular because it's easier to source, is easily laser-cut, and allows for simple/fast tab-and-slot construction of factory kits.
This is the reply I was looking for. Thank you!Almost the entire realm of RC lies between DTFB and balsa, depending on how you define "balsa builds."
Cut and fold foam board planes blend easily into paperless foam sheet builds. This is not far from built-up foam construction like wilmracer's giant P-40 build, or carved foam like my new Dumod build.
And foam fuselage plugs for fiberglass builds can be made the same way. Pitts Challenger III Build
Or you can do a balsa and DTFB build like Hai-Lee mentioned, or use carved foam to replace balsa blocks in a traditional balsa plan. Or combine the techniques.
Do a DTFB fuselage, balsa wing, sectional foam cowlings, etc etc.
I don't share your personal bias there as I once owned a full-sized plane that was almost entirely plywood and fabric. The best plane I ever owned.Plywood and monocoat would be needlessly heavy.
Plywood should not be used as a majority material in aircraft building (<=personal bias), particulary in smaller planes like we fly which can't take the excess weight (<=fact).
Exactly the advantages I see. The question is simply how much is too much and where should I go other routes?Plywood has become popular because it's easier to source, is easily laser-cut, and allows for simple/fast tab-and-slot construction of factory kits.
I am in a weird way. East of the Mississippi is supposed to be not remote but I don't have a single hobby shop within a two-hour drive!You must live somewhere totally remote (I feel sorry for you),
3D printing. Way more complex shapes, flight characteristics closer to balsa (not bad necessarily, but planes have momentum), lower drag, and great resistance to moisture.
You'll have to be more careful on landings, so they're good for when you've stopped normally crashing, and only have mistakes when you're pushing the limits.
Also, assembly time is way, way shorter. Print times on some models can be high, but that doesn't really count as you don't have to watch your machine. I start prints at night, and then again the next morning before heading to work. I live in the middle of nowhere, so I can generally print a plane out faster than ground shipping would get a plane to me.
Also, if you feel like it, you can sand parts down, and paint them. The test section below was actually less work for me than fiberglass over foam. Though there are some bubbles in the paint, this rattle can was at the end of its life.
View attachment 148959
I also have a 3d printer and parts make perfect sense to me but the whole aircraft doesn't. I have seen some hybrids that make perfect sense. Carbon or hardwood spares, printed ribs, and cowlings, monocote covering.
Thanx I'll check out your links
Simply order online. A 1mm balsa sheet costs 0.99Euro plus 5bucks shipping (10bucks for longer carbonrods) from the Hobbystore, 2,20Euro from the local hobbyshop and 3,50Euro from the DIY warehouse.I am in a weird way. East of the Mississippi is supposed to be not remote but I don't have a single hobby shop within a two-hour drive!
Are you talking tissue used in ultralight rubberband planes or something I'm not familiar with?Have you tried Papercovering over foam or balsa ? It's a lot of fun and surpringly strong.
This should be pinned somewhere. Nothing I didn’t know but stated with a certain clarity.Just one more comment or thought for you. The shape of the structure is what flies and the weight should only be adequate to maintaining the shape. You can build a plane out of almost anything but the real trick is to build the structure strong enough and light enough.
many people tend to be sort of stuck in a single technique or 2 and have their own material preferences. With the modern range of available materials the planes we fly should be engineering marvels but sadly they tend to be built full of compromises and often far too much material and hence weight.
Using the properties of the various materials and selecting the material, for each and every part, in relation to its strength and weight requirements would be the best approach. Balsa has great compression and tension resistance in one plane but is very weak in the other planes. FB has good tension properties but fails in compression. Plywood has great tension and compression properties in multiply directions but is really a little heavy as it often carries laminations that are set at angles, (by the construction), that are not load bearing and only provide a degree of support against deformation.
Other materials have better properties but tend to be rather brittle and lack resilience.
On other concern in material selection is the jointing or materials. Balsa tends to rip or splinter around its glue joints of even fail well away from the joint by splintering. Plywood not only breaks but its also tends to delaminate at the point of failure. FB crushes and tears whereas FGlass, CF, and 3D printed plastics seem to shatter. My current work into structures is to improve the security of the material joints, stress transfer from the joints and joint security under impact forces through material selection and design.
Simply put you can build out of anything! The best build will use a multitude of different materials each selected as best for purpose. (Purpose can include price, availability, and tooling requirements). There is NO superior material but rather each material should be seen as having advantages and disadvantages. You chose based upon maximizing the advantages and minimizing the disadvantages.
I still build using FB BUT by using many other materials I now build at about half the weight and with far greater strength/durability.
Just a few thoughts!
Have fun!