Best 250 Size Quad <$50

[emanrocks15]

I was looking getting into freestyle quadcopters, and then later go into fpv. I was looking at this frame:

https://www.amazon.com/Crazepony-Ca...g_2?ie=UTF8&psc=1&refRID=2YNNG3981NGN5N9VH9HV

However, I would really like a 250 size quad but I don't want to spend a ton of money on a frame because all I have flown quadcopter wise is a Nano Qx and I don't want to see a really expensive frame destroyed while I am trying to learn how to fly. I was wondering about this frame or any variation of it, I know there is a ton of different variations.

http://www.banggood.com/H250-ZMR250...uadcopter-Multicopter-Frame-Kit-p-933185.html

However, it does't look super sturdy like the above Crazepony frame. Do you guys have any recommendations on good 250 size carbon fiber frames for less than $50?

 

[PsyBorg]

Sub 50 dollar real carbon fiber frames are gonna be thin ~1mm plates with ~3mm arms and getting it from China will not guarantee the quality of the frame you get as 95% of them are knock off versions stolen from real designers. Most of the times the issue is that holes are not properly drilled so the frame is not squared after build or some holes line up while others do not. Some people have actually gotten plastic frames when they ordered because the advertised frames were NOT the ones they showed in the pictures.

That being said.. I would suggest you look into the 210 size frames as that is where most pilots are at now going with 5 inch set ups instead of 6. I went with a more expensive RR5 Alien full Kiss set up to support what these guys do for the hobby but you can go with the FT210 frame for just a little over your 50 dollar mark and come up golden with a true carbon frame of good quality. Not only will you have confidence you get what you want you also support them as well. They also have variations on the frame kits as well as full out tested builds with their power pack recommendations you KNOW work.

Lastly the ZMR250 is a very popular frame as well IF you get a true ZMR 250 frame not a Chinese knockoff. Just research reviews on the exact product you are getting from the specific company before you dive in.

 

[emanrocks15]

What are your thoughts on the crazepony 210 frame? How long and wide are average 210 size frames?

 

[cranialrectosis]

All 210 sized frames should be 210mm diagonally from motor to motor.

The CrazyPony is a full size (5" rotors) racing quad with a 3mm unibody lower frame plate. Here is where the cheapness of the frame costs you the most.

If you fly fast and hard, you are going to break a boom. The real cost here is that when I break a boom on my Alien, I replace the boom. If you break a 3mm boom on a unibody, you have to replace the entire bottom plate which most likely means buying a whole new frame and rebuilding it.

Unibody is great on light little machines spinning 3" props. They carry much less inertia in a crash, therefore you are far less likely to break a boom. The tiny machines tend to be lighter and use thinner 2mm or 3mm carbon fiber to stay light. Breaks still happen, just less often.

On a 5" copter you have heavier motors and lipos. Most frame manufacturers use 4mm booms to handle the additional inertia the increased weight brings in a crash. You still break 4mm booms, it's just harder to do and with a modular system, cheaper and far less time to repair.

IMO unibody frames for copters running 2204 motors or larger is penny wise and pound foolish particularly with cheap carbon fiber and or <4mm booms. I think it just costs you more in the long run. YMMV.

The Martian frames are modular, cost about the same as the CrazyPony and sport the 4mm booms. They will not likely perform as well as an Alien from ImpulseRC and you may have to play with the fittings (like PsyBorg mentioned), but the booms buttress in the center for more strength.

If you are stuck at <$50 I would look at a Martian in the 190 to 250 size and buy one or two extra booms and maybe an extra lower plate. You are going to break them. Having spares cuts repair time down from 2-3 weeks to 20-30 minutes.
https://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss_2?url=search-alias%3Dtoys-and-games&field-keywords=martian+quad

Just so you have something to compare to. This is arguably the best there is today in the 5" prop size.
http://impulserc.com/alien-5-fpv-frame-2

 

[PsyBorg]

This is what you are in for if you want to race as well as what kind of abuse a good frame can take with zero damage. The crash is at the very end but its a very short flight hehe. BTW since we are on Flite Test AND I own one as well the Versa Copter is also a great starting platform and can take a decent beating. (I can not begin to remember how many times mine bit the dirt with only props bent or broken while I was leraning.)

 

[emanrocks15]

Thanks, for the help I like the Alien frames on amazon that you linked. I was wondering what flight controller would work great and is easy to learn how to use. I was looking at the Naze32 Rev 6. I am wanting to star LOS and then when I have mastered that go to FPV. What do you guys think about the build I am looking at doing?

Frame:

https://www.amazon.com/Crazepony-Ma...8&qid=1478896857&sr=1-5&keywords=martian+quad

Motors & ESC's:

http://www.banggood.com/Emax-RS2205...ropeller-Power-Combo-p-1052807.html?rmmds=buy

Flight Controller:

Naze32 Rev 6

Which props would work Better?

https://www.amazon.com/RAYCorp®-Pro...F8&qid=1478898528&sr=8-9&keywords=gemfan+5030

or

https://www.amazon.com/AvatarRC-Gen...98574&sr=8-2-spons&keywords=gemfan+5045&psc=1

Any lipo recommendations that are cheap but still have good quality?

 

[ElectriSean]

That motor/esc combination is what I run on my mini-tricopter, it's very nice. I don't know how much you save getting the package like that, but you may want to look into some BLHeli_S esc's, the racerstar ones that banggood sells are rebranded Cicada's and are very nice. Also pretty cheap.

You may want to look into getting an F3 flight controller. Nothing wrong with the naze, but they are pretty dated and will have problems if you decide to run betaflight.

I'm far from a prop expert, but with those motors/esc's you can easily run 5" tri blades or 6" 2 blades. Either of the ones you linked will work, but may be lacking in thrust.

I've heard good things about the infinity batteries that banggood sells, they will be the next ones I try. Rotorgeeks has some decent ones as well, definitely quality. My friend runs the HK graphenes with good results too.

 

[grnd flyr]

A few more ideas/links for ya, since shopping is part of the fun ...

Read the specs on that frame but - 1.5mmm carbon fiber fuselage - might prove weak...

...a couple more to consider, one unibody, one with replaceable arms:

RMRC Goby 210 - $39.99 Save: 20% off:
http://www.readymaderc.com/store/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=5004&cPath=76_729_733
The Goby is a pretty tough frame for the price, RCGroups has a thread on them for more info.


Armattan SCX 200 - $65.00, I got the Cobalt frame with matching blue arms, waiting for ESCs to come in for this build:
http://www.rccrazed.com/frames-arma...attan-scx-200-and-180-cobalt-frame-p-229.html

A couple things new from my favorite candy store at Armattans:

4X Armattan OOmph 2206/2300 KV motors - US$75.00
http://www.armattanquads.com/OOmph-2206-2300/


...think we will soon be seeing this idea copied by the other motor makers, cool stuff. QuadMcFly from RCGroups gave a brief description here:
http://www.miniquadtestbench.com/armattan-2206-2300kv-prototype.html


ARMATTAN 30AMPS BLHELI_S ESC/BB2 (4 PIECES) - US$50.00
http://www.armattanquads.com/armattan-30amps-blheli_s-esc-bb2-4-pieces/


ARMATTAN 20AMPS BLHELI_S ESC/BB2 (4 PIECES) - US$35.00
http://www.armattanquads.com/armattan-20amps-blheli_s-esc-bb2-4-pieces/


RCcrazed said they ought to at least have the ESCs in a week from now.
http://www.rccrazed.com/index.php

...fwiw...

 

[emanrocks15]

What would the advantages be of the BlHeli ESC's be? What do you mean by F3 flight controller? Do you have a link? What is betaflight? What are the advantages and disadvantages of the 5in tri blades? The frame I have listed is built for 5in props. Do you have any links for good 5in tri props? How would I figure out what size of battery I would need(Cells, Capacity, c rating)? Thanks for the great help, I have no idea what I am doing.

 

[ElectriSean]

BLHeli_S ESC's are just smoother. If the package deal works out cheaper, then go with it... http://www.banggood.com/4X-Racersta...hot-for-FPV-Racer-p-1074733.html?rmmds=search is what I'm talking about.

F3 denotes the CPU used on the FC board. The Naze is an F1 board. F3 boards run quite a bit faster, so can run lower looptimes and more stuff. Betaflight (vs Cleanflight) is the firmware that runs on the flight controller.

Tri blades give greater thrust at the expense of efficiency. Many people feel that they are the best balance of thrust and efficiency, I can't comment as I haven't tried any of the quad blades or hex blades etc. Since you're just learning, I'd start cheap, something like these: http://www.banggood.com/10-Pairs-Ki...ers-for-FPV-Racer-p-1067875.html?rmmds=search

For batteries, you want something in the 1300-1500mah range, in the highest C rating you can get. These will be in my next order, I've heard good things. http://www.banggood.com/Infinity-4S...60-Support-15C-Boosting-Charge-p-1062565.html

Those are 4S, you may want to start with 3S depending on how brave you are I'd definitely recommend getting some sim time in before you start ripping, these things are fast and touchy to get used to. FPV Freerider and Velocidrone are the 2 I use, they are a huge help in building muscle memory.

 

[emanrocks15]

The ESC's work out to be cheaper than the bundle, so I will definitely go with those. What would be a good F3 board? I probably will start with 3s, I don't want to be frustrated that I can't control the speed of the quad. The 4s batteries will only give the quad a power boost right? Also, would you recommend starting out with double blades or tri blades? Would the following batteries work?

http://www.banggood.com/Flower-Powe...lug-for-RC-Models-p-1073363.html?rmmds=search

Or

https://hobbyking.com/en_us/turnigy-nano-tech-1500mah-3s-35-70c-lipo-pack.html

Or

https://hobbyking.com/en_us/turnigy-nano-tech-1300mah-3s-45-90c-lipo-pack.html

I really want to get in the air quickly, I am super excited to make this jump. I have flown the Nano Qx for almost a year and half and I have been trying to master flying without the auto level feature on.

 

[ElectriSean]

Something like https://hobbyking.com/en_us/f3-deluxe-flight-controller.html is a basic F3 board, there are so many on the market now it's good to do some research. Any of those batteries should be fine, but the higher the C rating, the longer they'll last. As for props, I'd say get some of each and see what you like... You're going to break them eventually anyway, so get lots

 

[Ocean]

I've heard good things about the Racerstar gear. The motors especially are durable. I would go with the ESCs ElectriSean mentioned and these motors. It will be cheaper than that kit of motors.

As ElectriSean said there loads of F3 boards out there. The best thing to do is research them all and see which one you want to get. You may even want to get an F4 board, they are very cheap these days.

 

[emanrocks15]

Should I try the 5030 or the 5045 props first? Should I start with dual props? I have heard people say that dual props have nicer flight characteristics and they are cheaper than tri blade props. Also, do you have a place where I can find durable tri blade props for cheap? Does the PDP that comes with this frame have an xt60 connector to soulder on? Or will I have to buy cable and connectors for it? I have the frame, motors, ESC's, PDP, FC, batteries, TX/Rx, and I am trying to find props. Is that all I need, or would you recommend something else that I need or will help with the build?

 

[ElectriSean]

2 blade props are definitely cheaper, if you go that route get 5045. It looks like you'll need to get an XT60 connector for that PDB. You can probably solder the connector right to the PDB, but I'd recommend a short length of wire to prevent breaking. Definitely get a buzzer, something like http://rotorgeeks.com/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=136&search=buzzer My mini tri would still be lost in a wheat field without it

 

[emanrocks15]

Would the 5045 props be too much power for me since I am just beginning? I was looking at these for the 5045 props, are they good? Also, would these be okay for the xt60 connector on to the PDP?

 

[Ocean]

Yes those props are very durable and Yes.

 

[emanrocks15]

Thanks, for all of the great feedback. I now have my build plan done, and I am very excited to build it up and fly and crash.....lots.

 

[PsyBorg]

Be careful of them raycorp props. I ordered a set of the 5030 tri blades thinking I wasn't ready fro the higher power of 4s. The ones they sent me were so thin they would actually flatten themselves out from the high rpm and just sit there making a weird farting noise barely getting the versacopter off the ground.

 

[emanrocks15]

Oh, are you taking about the ones I talked about earlier in the thread? I decided to go with these.