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Dual rates?

Geronimo

Active member
#1
In my attempt to ease into flying again after a loooong hiatus, I'm wondering if dual rates might help. I see Josh uses 30% expo a lot to ease up that middle stick for smoothness.

What do you guys think? Reduced throws? Dual rates? Learn to fly slower? Call my mommy?
 

Grifflyer

WWII fanatic
#2
I think the best option would be to take out a trainer plane. If your Tx has the ability set up a dual rates on a switch do it. That way you can fly with limited throws and then with a flip of a switch use more throws. I use 20% expo whenever I remember to turn it on. On a lot of my planes I forgot to set up dual rates and expo lol
 
#3
In my limited experience I've found it's easy to over correct on the rates to where you don't have enough control authority. For myself, I'm liking the idea of staying with 30% expo and a higher rate setting (70% or so). I'm a noob but have spent a lot of time on the sim. I over corrected so bad on my maiden of my Timber that it wouldn't get of the ground in low rates.
 

Headbang

Master member
#5
I find for most sport planes and war birds having a set of rates at 30% expo and 50% throws, while having another at 30% expo and 100% throws helps new pilots a lot. When buddy boxing I keep control of the rates, flip to 50% for the student, and 100% when I need to take over. Key is to have that 100% available to get out of serious trouble.
 

sprzout

Knower of useless information
Mentor
#7
Soo....

This is kind of a loaded answer from me. :) When you fly planes of any sort, the faster air moves over the control surface, the LESS movement you actually want from that surface. If you fly a simple, slow fly type of trainer, having more movement is beneficial. But if you're flying say, a 100 mph warbird or hotliner style glider at full speed, a little movement of the surface instantly becomes a snap roll, or a sharp nose up or down.

So, what I've done (and apparently, is fairly common with 3D/acrobatic pilots), is set up dual rates to change via a switch. I don't use the "travel" function that's common in Spektrum radios; I use the dual rates to set up higher and lower rates. So, for example, on my Versa Wing that I use for combat, I set up Flight Mode on a 3 way switch. I can throw the switch to put in 40%, 55%, and 70% dual rates, respectively, which then controls my throws. Now, this way, I can throw the switch to allow hard, fast snap rolls and maneuverability at speed, but then, when we do our spot landings at the end of each round, I can throw the switch to give me more control when I have to "pancake" it in to a more precise landing. I set this so that it'll occur for Elevator and Ailerons on the Versa Wing, but I've also thrown in dual rates on the rudder for 4 channel planes as well.

The rates that I use are going to be personal for me and that particular plane; what I say that works for me on a Versa Wing may not be recommended for you on say, a Tiny Trainer. But, I would definitely experiment with the different rates - try setting the switches on 40%, 60%, and 100%, and see what works best for you. Once you know what one feels like, tweak them so you have different settings for speed and for maneuverability.

You can also set the expo in the same manner if you want to mess with it. I'd recommend one change at a time, though, so you know how each will affect your flying, but it definitely helps for different conditions!
 

Headbang

Master member
#8
Soo....

This is kind of a loaded answer from me. :) When you fly planes of any sort, the faster air moves over the control surface, the LESS movement you actually want from that surface. If you fly a simple, slow fly type of trainer, having more movement is beneficial. But if you're flying say, a 100 mph warbird or hotliner style glider at full speed, a little movement of the surface instantly becomes a snap roll, or a sharp nose up or down.

So, what I've done (and apparently, is fairly common with 3D/acrobatic pilots), is set up dual rates to change via a switch. I don't use the "travel" function that's common in Spektrum radios; I use the dual rates to set up higher and lower rates. So, for example, on my Versa Wing that I use for combat, I set up Flight Mode on a 3 way switch. I can throw the switch to put in 40%, 55%, and 70% dual rates, respectively, which then controls my throws. Now, this way, I can throw the switch to allow hard, fast snap rolls and maneuverability at speed, but then, when we do our spot landings at the end of each round, I can throw the switch to give me more control when I have to "pancake" it in to a more precise landing. I set this so that it'll occur for Elevator and Ailerons on the Versa Wing, but I've also thrown in dual rates on the rudder for 4 channel planes as well.

The rates that I use are going to be personal for me and that particular plane; what I say that works for me on a Versa Wing may not be recommended for you on say, a Tiny Trainer. But, I would definitely experiment with the different rates - try setting the switches on 40%, 60%, and 100%, and see what works best for you. Once you know what one feels like, tweak them so you have different settings for speed and for maneuverability.

You can also set the expo in the same manner if you want to mess with it. I'd recommend one change at a time, though, so you know how each will affect your flying, but it definitely helps for different conditions!
Most every transmitter out there these days has a dual rate function that is switch assignable. Most work very similar.
Not to be confused with flight modes, which are a completely different thing. Think of flight modes as having completely different model setups selectable on the fly via switches. Example of a good use of flight modes would be 1 flight mode for hand launching, another for flying. Launch mode would have different rates on the dual rate switch then fly mode as well as expo and some up trim on the elevator to give you time to gain airspeed. Flying mode would have your normal rates on a switch, and trims set for regular flying around. I use this same example on edf planes like the x-29 in order to give me time between launch and getting my hands back on the transmitter.
Us 3d pilots tend to have many flight modes. In gas planes a landing mode is handy to idle down enough to slow down. As well as re-trim for an empty tank. Other modes completely re-trim and add mixes and turn on and off gyros, drop the rates of different surfaces, ect, to change the planes handling completely.

In the case of sport pilots and beginners, you just need to worry about dual or triple rates assigned to a switch you can reach easily and will be comfortable with on future planes. I use the 3 position switch on the left top forward of the transmitter, always have, always will. Same as throttle kill is always the 2 pos switch right behind it. You do what works for you. It will become habit.
 

Hai-Lee

Old and Bold RC PILOT
#9
I am an experienced flyer and an instructor. I definitely use dual rates and Expo though I can happily fly without them. When a newbie starts their learning they tend to be very heavy handed on the sticks and so I reduce the rates for them and add significant expo, (Normally between 40% and 50%). This setting is what I also use for high speed aircraft where the control effectiveness increases with airspeed.

As for the high rate I tend to go for larger control deflections than recommended as many models loose control effectiveness as they slow down for landing. In my mind there is nothing worse than needing to save a plane from crashing only to find that the controls do not respond adequately.

My use of dual rates is for high and slow speed flight and I use expo to reduce the heavy handedness of my students though I do retain a minimum expo setting of around 30% for the sheer smoothness of control inputs across a wide range of airspeeds.

It works for me!

Have fun!