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A plane question for quad people - tiny motors & ESCs

Monte.C

Monte.C

...
I'm really inspired by the FT EZ plans thread, and I want to do it my way with my own Rx and Tx and full controls and see how reasonably small I can get and still have it be FUN. I'm not familiar with the really small brushless motors or appropriate speed controllers or "flight controllers", but between fixed-wing people and quad people I'm certain someone has good answers.

I have a pair of 1406 3100Kv motors that I just put on a twin, expect to maiden this wkend, and I'm impressed with the power output on 4" props.
It looks like there are good options for 0802 motors or (if I need to step up in size) 110X motors. So far I haven't found any info on current draw for these. Hopefully something like an 0802 will do what I need?

Looks like my biggest question is for an ESC. These look like they're most often used on a quad (Tinyhawk? Whoop?). I guess it's all driven by a little square flight controller that serves as speed controller and stabilizer. I'd rather not get too into soldering on a circuit board or complicated setup/programming. I love the "plug and play" nature of a regular ESC. Is this possible for such a small motor?

Here's what I'd want to do:
my Tx
my Rx
2 0802 motors (with the option of 1 and a rudder instead of two)
2 ESCs for 1-2 Lipo cells (or 1 as needed)
a 1S lipo (option for 2S)
my FT-style Emax ES9051 4.3g servos (or smaller)

Searching for "1-2S ESC" doesn't give me much I can understand!
Any suggestions are very much appreciated.
Thank you!

And thanks @FoamyDM for putting this bug in my ear about Dollar General's 3mm trifold board. Darn you!
 
LitterBug

LitterBug

Techno Nut
Moderator
I run < 10A ESCs on 110x motors with 2" props, 15A Escs on 130x motors with 3" props, and 20A ESCs on 140X motors with 3" props. Some of the choice has to do with the type of flying, location I'm flying, and weights I'm dealing with. Anything 3" and up, I'm probably looking for speed, lifting power, and flexibility. 2" and less, I'm probably looking for a an easy flyer for indoor use.

I have a large variety of 4 to 7A 1-2s ESCs. Not sure if they are even available any more. I'd have to take a quick look to see. You will need a separate BEC for the servos. Those small ESCs don't usually have a BEC.

You could try searching for the EMAX Nano series ESCs.... ReadymadeRC still has a couple 12A. Not sure who else might have them. Most places no longer stock anything that small.
1604969641025.png
 
PsyBorg

PsyBorg

Wake up! Time to fly!
From what you say I am thinking 1104 OG Gremlin motors with 4 or 6 amp esc's pushing 2 inch props will get you in the range you seek. that would be a 2s setup. not sure if you could go as low as 1s though. I still have my OG grmlin using these motors and escs and they still rip like crazy.

you can get the 6amp esc's on amazon still.

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07BSWPY26/?tag=lstir-20
 
LitterBug

LitterBug

Techno Nut
Moderator
Found pics from some "old" builds. Still have these in various builds. Probably can't find any of these, but you could try googling for them
TinyESCs.jpg

20171108_225628.jpg


The 4A I have is a 4in1 tinyfish

ReadyToFlyQuads still has tiny things listed, but I have not bought from them in a LONG time. People seem to have hit or miss luck working with them. I never had problems with any of my orders.
 
PsyBorg

PsyBorg

Wake up! Time to fly!
Monte.C said:
Hey you probably don't realize how valuable these replies are. You just answered 1/2 dozen questions. Awesome!
The "EMAX Nano Series ESC 6A BLHELI Oneshot 125 1-2s 7g For multicopters Fpv racing" is for sale on the Emax website. Bam.
Click to expand...
I posted the link to them on Amazon in my above post as well
 
Monte.C

Monte.C

...
PsyBorg said:
From what you say I am thinking 1104 OG Gremlin motors with 4 or 6 amp esc's pushing 2 inch props will get you in the range you seek. that would be a 2s setup. not sure if you could go as low as 1s though. I still have my OG grmlin using these motors and escs and they still rip like crazy.

you can get the 6amp esc's on amazon still.

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07BSWPY26/?tag=lstir-20
Click to expand...
Ok thanks. Let's be real clear:
I want my Rx, 2-3 servos, two tiny motors & ESCs, 1s or 2s, and I guess a BEC if necessary. Ok that's a lot more weight than an EZ package.
I suspect an 0802 would run circles around whatever motors are in that EZ pack, right?
Stripped down little plane as light as I can make it, and made of thinner lighter FB.
You don't think two 0802s would do it?
 
LitterBug

LitterBug

Techno Nut
Moderator
Monte.C said:
Ok thanks. Let's be real clear:
I want my Rx, 2-3 servos, two tiny motors & ESCs, 1s or 2s, and I guess a BEC if necessary. Ok that's a lot more weight than an EZ package.
I suspect an 0802 would run circles around whatever motors are in that EZ pack, right?
Stripped down little plane as light as I can make it, and made of thinner lighter FB.
You don't think two 0802s would do it?
Click to expand...
Do the 0802s have screws to hold the props on? Most of those extra small motors are press on props..... (I don't like those)
 
Monte.C

Monte.C

...
LitterBug said:
Do the 0802s have screws to hold the props on? Most of those extra small motors are press on props..... (I don't like those)
Click to expand...
They're press-on. The 1406s I have were the smallest I could easily find that all my regular props fit on.
From a vid I learned the tiny motors on the EZ pack are press-on. (Duh. It's a toy.) But when I looked into it it seems more legit than I thought, to have tiny quad motors with press-on props, to a 1.5mm shaft.
 
PsyBorg

PsyBorg

Wake up! Time to fly!
yeah one of those 0802's is probably like 2 of those of those ezpack motors I would think.
Also crashing on a fixed wing is different then crashing a quad. I dont think you would have too much issue with press on props.
 
Monte.C

Monte.C

...
PsyBorg said:
yeah one of those 0802's is probably like 2 of those of those ezpack motors I would think.
Click to expand...
That's what I figured.
If I have to step up to 110X motors I will. (I'll still think they're microscopic.) I mean for screws and for power. But the whole point was to go take away the battery weight and weight everywhere else...
An empty plane is light as a feather.
 
Monte.C

Monte.C

...
Here's another consideration:
I'm not particularly after speed. When I was a kid and electric motors were little more than a toy, you could buy a power pod to tack on the top of your big glider, to climb up to some altitude. So I think for a small plane maybe the same is true, if it glides well, then with power...
I mean I'm not making a racing plane.
 
LitterBug

LitterBug

Techno Nut
Moderator
The other option for servos is the tiny linear servos Horizon Hobby uses on their UMX planes. Could also use something like the FC from one of those UMX planes. They have RX, Two servos, BEC, and ESC built in. The UMX Turbo Timber I have is 2S and Brushless. Not sure if they have any 1S brushless boards. I have a couple FrSky rxes that those linear servos plug into also. Will have to run down and dig some of that out of a bin....
 
Monte.C

Monte.C

...
A Hobbywing component description says:
"As the BEC voltage of 1S Li Po, which used by 1/12th scale race cars, usually goes below 4.2V and causes the receiver and servo to work abnormally, so a separate battery is needed to power the receiver. This booster can work as a receiver battery and save you the trouble of battery charging and maintenance. "

Got it. So it looks like you either use 2S or try to use 1s and add a booster of a couple grams more. Well anyway, 2s is still tiny.
 
Monte.C

Monte.C

...
LitterBug said:
The other option for servos is the tiny linear servos Horizon Hobby uses on their UMX planes. Could also use something like the FC from one of those UMX planes. They have RX, Two servos, BEC, and ESC built in. The UMX Turbo Timber I have is 2S and Brushless. Not sure if they have any 1S brushless boards. I have a couple FrSky rxes that those linear servos plug into also. Will have to run down and dig some of that out of a bin....
Click to expand...
Yeah I could go that route but it looks like a lot of figuring out stuff that looks foreign to me, if you know what I mean. And you know what, that direction looks like a beefed up version of an EZ pack. That's fine but it'll feel like a more normal plane and setup if I go the way we've been talking.
What I mean is... I can understand my receiver and servos and control options, and I don't feel limited - I can to twin motors w/ diff thrust, I can do rudder, I can do mixes... All that I can understand. It doesn't feel quite comfortable for me to buy a whole system for one plane setup.

For servos, you bet there's options, if I want to save a couple grams per.

Maybe I'm being stuffy. I just want to swap for some VERY light components.
 
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