Faa proposed Transponder rules and how/if they change what we do as hobbyists

[PsyBorg]

I am afraid at this point the only thing that would even begin to slow this process is everyone telling their representatives that if they pass this crap they wont be in office after next elections. They backdoor'd the new proposals by piggy backing it on an education bill which is a really scumbag move by whomever wrote the bill and is championing it. That person alone needs to be removed from office NOW NOW NOW for doing something like that. Its obvious that person is corrupt and has taken or gotten something outside his normal pay to do this.

This is the ONLY thing that will effect any change in such short time. As Bruce said in his video they will ignore all of our pleas because they have been bought and paid for. The only thing worth more to them is keeping the "Power" they think they have.

If these scumbags did something like this over a hobby and toys imagine what other stuff you will never know about got / gets passed like this. If we let them get away with it then Its only gonna accelerate that end of government rebellion that is I am afraid at this point unavoidable because of things like this. It will only get easier and easier for them to do their business like this.

 

[Merv]

So...Digital transponders are ONLY required for those not flying at a FRIA (FAA-Recognized Identification Area). If you are a club that has a flying location, you should have already applied or are in the process of applying now to be identified as a flying site.....

So how do we apply for the FRIA? link please.

I don't necessarily like it, because there are slope soaring spots that aren't set up with a specific club, but are known flying sites (like Dave's Beach in Carlsbad, CA, or Sunset Cliffs in San Diego, or a number of locations in Santa Barbara, San Bernardino, and San Francisco county regions in California) that don't have club associations; it'll chase off a number of pilots, which kinda sucks.....

Can a FRIA application be made on a non Club site? Or is this something that needs official AMA blessing?

 

[Flying Monkey fab]

Can a FRIA application be made on a non Club site? Or is this something that needs official AMA blessing?

That's exactly where this gets so draconian! AMA only and nothing new after 12 months after so we'll be sqreezed out through attrition.

 

[Merv]

That's exactly where this gets so draconian! AMA only and nothing new after 12 months after so we'll be sqreezed out through attrition.

I don't know if AMA blessing is required or not, I'm asking.

If AMA blessing is not required, then I'm going to make a FRIA application for every acre of all of the 30+ places I fly. City parks, fair grounds, hay fields, corn fields the list goes on and on. Some of my flying sites are 400+ acres.

I doubt the AMA has that much clout with the FAA. That only AMA approved flying sites are going to be approved. Who knows, maybe they do have that much clout, then FAA would makeing the AMA a monopoly.

 

[earthsciteach]

I have a pretty optimistic take on this. Lets say that I opt for the "full" ident option. This means that I have a yet-to-be-made-public transponder that broadcasts information about my model just like ADS-B. I've opted to pay for this "thing," whatever that may be. I am now in full compliance. Therefore, I am no longer restricted to an AMA field. If I do this, I should be able to fly beyond LOS and at any altitude I chose as long as I comply with the already in place requirements for a given airspace type. I'd be happy to take a test/demonstrate my proficiency if I have this freedom. If I chose not to pay for the "transponder," I can still benefit from the "limited" proposed category. I can fly wherever I chose as long as I identify my location using my phone and stay within the 400 ft rule. (There has been some interpretation of a 400 ft bubble around an rc pilot, but I think this "requirement," is simply poorly worded on the behalf of the FAA. Properly, it should be defined as flying within LOS and at an altitude of no greater than 400 ft.) If I choose not to utilize either the full or the limited option, then I fly at a "community based organization" field recognized by the FAA. Currently, that means I'm flying at an AMA field. But, the AMA doesn't have to be the only community based organization recognized by the FAA. We just need a new CBO.

 

[Hondo76251]

@earthsciteach I hope you're right... actually, I do believe you are correct, but I worry about who will get that "beyond LOS" freedom...

It seems, to me, like they are paving the way for beyond LOS operation but I think they have Drone delivery in mind, not the model aviation community...

Do what we can to lobby and influence our elected "leaders" and hope for the best... thats all we can do now...

 

[earthsciteach]

I agree with your concern. Yes, they do have the interests of commercial drones in mind. I'm hoping that we hobbyists can exploit that to our own advantage.

 

[PsyBorg]

AMA currently is NOT an official CBO. the last ruling FAA put out stated specifically there are no official CBO's UNTIL they can make a determination of what they think a CBO should be. Unless I missed something in between that and the new whoopla AMA is like flying in yer own back yard.

The transponders may work well for fixed wing but to me they will only make multi rotors for freestyle and racing un safe by adding electricity management to already stressed systems with FPV gear, recording gear as well as more weight making things heavier and more apt to cause damge with the added inertia in a crash.

The Rule of flight is lighter is always best or has that changed?

And lastly Hiya Teach long time no see. Hope the holidays were good for ya and HAppy New Year.

 

[Hondo76251]

I agree with your concern. Yes, they do have the interests of commercial drones in mind. I'm hoping that we hobbyists can exploit that to our own advantage.

Like I said, hope you're right. But my faith in government (and in humanity in general) has diminished greatly in the last 20 years...

I'm just thankful I live in the middle of nowhere, I just feel bad for those who will feel the pinch first...

 

[JTarmstr]

No one is going to start a revolution over the FPV hobby, but that is not the only freedom thats been laid on the chopping block in the last few years.

People are feeling that a great deal of our freedoms have been in jeopardy recently. Thankfully we still live in a country where men with guns don't knock down your door for proposing dissenting ideas... YET.

I really feel like the reason discussion on things as simple as how to regulate a new aspect of an age old hobby get so heated and serious so quickly is because its just a small piece of a larger picture that most of us are dealing with. Its no longer just about foam airplanes...

I know, I just meant its dangerous to throw everything out the window because of one attack on our rights. we have the responsibility to respond firmly to defend our rights (life liberty and the pursuit of happiness), but to immediately state that its all going to heck and get ready for a revolution, I just think that is wrong. I have read to much history to be interested in any sort of armed revolution, it is a measure of last resort.

Personally my sentiment is that as the government becomes bigger and more bloated, many rights will be willingly (or unwillingly) handed over to the state and sometimes it feels like we are powerless. I love aviation and I hate the idea of some corporation like Amazon killing this hobby as I briefly knew it and all I can do is call my congressman who probably didnt even bother to read the stupid encyclopedia sized document that the FAA put forward. They totally could have come up with a compromise but instead congress just gave the FAA permission to do whatever the heck they wanted and a company with a net worth of 1 trillion dollars is going to get preference over some people who like to fly foam models.

 

[Flying Monkey fab]

I don't know if AMA blessing is required or not, I'm asking.

It says "CBO" and the only CBO right now is the AMA.
Yes, if they are going to coral amateur-built uas them anyone should be able to apply but that is not the way it is written.

We have over 3 million square miles to the USA and about 90% of that does not need to be remote IDd.

 

[Hondo76251]

We have over 3 million square miles to the USA and about 90% of that does not need to be remote IDd.

Some states are upwards of 90% BLM.

You can camp, fish, hunt... but how dare you fly a toy airplane...

 

[Flying Monkey fab]

Some states are upwards of 90% BLM.

You can camp, fish, hunt... but how dare you fly a toy airplane...

I'm not saying I'd go rogue but I have learned through 6 decades of life is that if no one sees it and no one reports it, it didn't happen.

 

[Hondo76251]

I'm lucky enough to live far enough out that you'd have to trespass for 4 miles in the closest direction to even see what I'm up to... rogue doesn't even do it justice... 😎

 

[PsyBorg]

We just have to make it as costly as possible for the Amazons and whom ever else wants to hog our airspace. If all this passes my next step would be to go to the local towns around and get them to ban over flights of drones. I am sure I can fire up TONS of sheeple already scared and misinformed about what we fly into a panic over delivery drones and whatever else follows. No free rides to deliver here. They will have to pay off each and every town they wish to deliver in. THEN if that happens the town councils that allow it and take that money need to be voted out of office for bad faith or no confidence in their abilities to represent our towns properly.


for now I will still..

Pledge Allegiance to the Flags for which I rip my Quads around
and to the Gaps thru which I fly
One Hobby with our Drones indivisible with
High Tech and Fresh Props for all.

 

[PsyBorg]

Ill post this here too since its the topic...

ANNNND there it is...

1. What are the costs associated with using remote ID and a USS?
   The FAA estimates that each person will pay the USS $30 per year to use a remote ID service provider or USS. See pages 103 and 196.
   
   
2. It says that recreational flyers will have to register each individual drone. Does that mean I will have to pay $5 to register every drone I own?
   Yes, as stated on page 210 of the NPRM.

Welcome to subscription based flying as I thought. Its not just done over your phone. 5 dollars extortion fee to the FAA PER craft and 30 dollars a year to a "service provider" How long before your ISP ups their prices for your internet to cover all the "Extra" traffic as their excuse.

I will go a step further and say insurances will be mandatory on top of all this and not just AMA or homeowners within 6 months after the remote id stuff goes into effect. So thats what march before the government ignores us and makes this stuff law. 2 years before full implementation and Ill bet any time after august 2020 you will be in line at the DMV taking a test with insurance id card in hand if you want to fly.

 

[jaysmc]

I want to encourage everyone here to file a public comment to the FAA on the proposed rulemaking. I know that many of you will feel that sending one letter couldn’t have much effect, but by law the FAA is required to read all public comments, and the more comments they receive, the bigger our voice will be.

My other major hobby is amateur radio, and over the years I have sent in several comment letters on various rules the FCC was proposing. I can assure you that on many occasions, the FCC has significantly altered or even dropped proposed rules due to feedback they received from public comments.

Yes, I know there is one difference here though: the FCC has been regulating amateur radio for over 100 years, so they are used to dealing closely with amateurs. In fact, several FCC directors have been licensed hams. In contrast, model aviation has been comparatively ignored by the FAA until recent times and I doubt any of the officers have any in-depth knowledge of the hobby.

Anyway, I have been reading through the FAA's proposal and making notes. I will begin writing my letter soon and I hope everyone else will as well.

 

[Merv]

AMA currently is NOT an official CBO.

It says "CBO" and the only CBO right now is the AMA.

It would appear we have a disagreement, I'm pretty sure both of these statement can not be correct, one is incorrect. It is possible both are incorrect.

If I recall the FAA used this exact term Community Based Organization, CBO, in the regulations they came out with a few years ago. The one that wanted your name and address, plus $5, and they send you a number.

Will CBO in this new regulation have the same meaning as CBO in the current regulation?

Anybody know if this video is talking about the proposed rule or is it something else? There are some familiar faces at about 1:50

EDIT: I no longer believe this video is accurate. I believe the FAA changed the rules after that video was posted in November 2019. At this point what Josh Bixler said about the phone app is a pipe dream.

 

[Captain Video]

I think it is time for Josh and Flite Test to weigh in on this whole FAA topic. Even a short press release would help us to understand the company line is.

 

[Merv]

I agree with @Captain Video. BTW it is Josh Bixler himself at 1:50 in the above video. We need less heat and more light.

If the above video is talking about the proposed rule, then it would "appear" its easy to get a FRIA (FAA-Recognized Identification Area). Just mark it on your phone app.