TTP-1: Single sheet Combat wing

[arovillard]

Maiden flight:

I've spent some time designing a wing that was really cheap to build, very strong, very stable and capable of flying slow, perfect for wing combat!. The motivation came from having a lot of friend transitioning from flying quads to wings, so they can do it pretty well, but they don't feel very confident flying LOS.

There are already some amazing designs online for free like the Ft-arrow, but the build process ends up being too complicated for most of the people I've talked to, also I want a design that fits in one sheet of dollar tree foamboard (mine measured 508mm x 762mm) it had to include control surfaces and winglets within this one sheet.

So I came up with this design, I took it for a test flight and it's on rails! I was flying it with a 4s 1500mah battery and a 2207 2400kv motor. I was able to float around 25% throttle, and do some serious stunts at 60% throttle. I would love to get some honest and constructive feedback on my model

When you open the PDF, this is how to interpret it:
- All the pieces need to be cut out, on this design you don't fold anything.
- From the top right corner, this are the parts: winglet, elevon, top wing body, bottom wing body
- The wing is symmetrical
- I used popsicle sticks for reinforcement
- Electronics are: 2x9g servos, 30A esc, 22XX motor, 4s 1500 mah battery. (this is an overkill for this design, but it worked amazing anyways)
- I made a motor mount out of an aluminum L bracket, 3d printed one would work too or maybe plywood?

I'm not sure how to Tile the pdf for printing, so I included dimensions from the edges so it's easy to trace on the foamboard.

Anyhow, would love to hear honest and constructive feedback

 

[foamtest]

Cool looking design, I like the simplicity of it. It sounds like it would be a great combat plane just judging off of the efficiency of the power set up, being able to fly around 20% throttle is quite impressive. How long do you think you could keep it in the air for?

 

[arovillard]

Thanks! I'm very happy with how it flies. I'm hoping to get some flying footage soon (the snow is melting so all the flying spots are pure puddles right now). I've been running a very inefficient setup, because it's the one that I know my friends will have (racing quad people). 4s 1500mah is a lot heavier than I would suggest to use if efficiency is important. The ideal setup would be an 1806 motor and a 3s 1500mah. I feel this would give you a good balance between power and weight.
With my setup I can do fun flying at 50% throttle for at least 15min (never pushed it longer than that, specially since I'm a bit of an aggressive flyer, I tend to fly on the 60-70% throttle). I would be curious to how long you could get out of a lighter setup.

 

[arovillard]

So I experimented with a new technique to put this wing together, I decided to build the lightest version I could by just changing the assembly process. So this time around I decided to not use any hotglue to put both top and bottom parts together, also I decided to use a very light type of duct tape to secure the leading edges together! (brand was ducktape). With all the electronics installed (minus battery) it came to 280g. The version using gorilla duct tape and hot glue to reinforce was 330g.

I will be posting a flying video soon!

 

[arovillard]

Maiden Video:

 

[Captain Video]

Hi:
I like your design! I am currently constructing one using 3/8" insulation foam. I had it on hand but no foam core at the present. I will post picts and video when it stops being windy, rainy or snowy or all three. Forecast looks favorable for the Central Ohio area.

 

[awoehler]

Thanks for sharing. This has been added to my build list. Thanks for including the measurements on the plans as I prefer to transfer it that way then printing.

 

[arovillard]

Hi:
I like your design! I am currently constructing one using 3/8" insulation foam. I had it on hand but no foam core at the present. I will post picts and video when it stops being windy, rainy or snowy or all three. Forecast looks favorable for the Central Ohio area.

I would love to know how it turns out!! I'm from Canada and we don't get insulation that thin here, the thinner we can find is 1/2"

looking forward to seeing pictures and video!

 

[arovillard]

Thanks for sharing. This has been added to my build list. Thanks for including the measurements on the plans as I prefer to transfer it that way then printing.

Yeah, I prefer this method too, I can see how it would be a lot of work if the design was complex but for this wing it's really worth using the measurements instead of printing.

Hope you enjoy it!

 

[awoehler]

Was able to build most of it last night using the measurements, between chasing kids around. I used 1x5x200mm carbon fiber instead of popsicle to give it some extra strength they are set in from the leading edge and run parallel to it and cross each other in the center. I'm planning on building a swappable power pod area for the motor like the nacelle on the mini guinea that I have then I can swap my 1806 between the two. I believe I can build this using the scrap gets cutout from the prop area.

 

[arovillard]

Was able to build most of it last night using the measurements, between chasing kids around. I used 1x5x200mm carbon fiber instead of popsicle to give it some extra strength they are set in from the leading edge and run parallel to it and cross each other in the center. I'm planning on building a swappable power pod area for the motor like the nacelle on the mini guinea that I have then I can swap my 1806 between the two. I believe I can build this using the scrap gets cutout from the prop area.

I love the idea of the swappable power pod, I'm very interested in how and where it might fit. I would say the power setup is the one weak link of the design as there is no obvious motor mount to use. I personally 3-d printed myself a mount, but I know that most people would rather go for something tested and proven like the FT power pods.

 

[Captain Video]

Last night I have the main part of the wing constructed fro 1/2" foam insulation. I am tossed between a 20 amp esc for a 2205 red bottom (prop TBD) or a 1000kv generic Chinese import motor with a 5" prop. The servos and the rest of the electronics hopefully installed tonight. I have a pict but will post later today. I need to weigh it to see if my guess for the motor is accurate. I am using paint sticks to reinforce the wing construction.

 

[arovillard]

Last night I have the main part of the wing constructed fro 1/2" foam insulation. I am tossed between a 20 amp esc for a 2205 red bottom (prop TBD) or a 1000kv generic Chinese import motor with a 5" prop. The servos and the rest of the electronics hopefully installed tonight. I have a pict but will post later today. I need to weigh it to see if my guess for the motor is accurate. I am using paint sticks to reinforce the wing construction.

I would go for the red bottom, but probably both options will give you a good flying experience.

 

[Captain Video]

I am hoping that this will be durable enough for the FFOH19 Combat Flights. That is why I selected Paint sticks rather than Popsicle sticks. I was out of tongue depressor which would have been my first choice for weight and thickness. Still, a pretty good choice for durability, I hope.

 

[arovillard]

I am hoping that this will be durable enough for the FFOH19 Combat Flights. That is why I selected Paint sticks View attachment 127903 rather than Popsicle sticks. I was out of tongue depressor which would have been my first choice for weight and thickness. Still, a pretty good choice for durability, I hope.

wow!! that foam looks quite thick!! I didn't realize 3/8 was that thick! I think I change my mind... 1000kv and potentially opening the motor bay a bit wider to accommodate a larger prop with higher pitch (6x5 ?).

You want to make sure you can fly slow and fast to be successful at combat, the lower kv motor will help you do that considering you are going to be heavier than my foamboard one. I'm literally dying to see this thing fly.

Since you have the material for it, I would try to round the leading edge with sand paper (or exacto). at that thickness it will make a difference in flying slow.

 

[Piotrsko]

But, but, but, getting the leading edge sharper makes stalls much more nasty and unpredictable. And on a flying wing causes breakage

 

[Captain Video]

My apologies. The foam is actually 1/2". I had planned to round the edges tonight and treat the edges with smoothed hot glue as well. I have considered covering with colored packing tape as well but at the cost of additional weight. After I weigh it I will be able to make a more educated motor and esc selection. Will keep you up to date.

 

[arovillard]

But, but, but, getting the leading edge sharper makes stalls much more nasty and unpredictable. And on a flying wing causes breakage

really eh? I was under the impression that slow turbulent air over the wing would make it stall quicker, the sheets I use are 5mm thick so I find that 10mm won't affect that so much the air flow. But on 20mm thickness like Captain Video has, I thought it would start making a difference.

But maybe you have some insights that I don't Piotrosko, what would you recommend?

 

[arovillard]

My apologies. The foam is actually 1/2". I had planned to round the edges tonight and treat the edges with smoothed hot glue as well. I have considered covering with colored packing tape as well but at the cost of additional weight. After I weigh it I will be able to make a more educated motor and esc selection. Will keep you up to date.

oh yeah I see where you say that you used 1/2 instead of 3/8. Ok so now I'm even more interested in seeing how it works, because I can easily find 1/2" here in Toronto. and it will make for a far more durable wing!

 

[arovillard]

But, but, but, getting the leading edge sharper makes stalls much more nasty and unpredictable. And on a flying wing causes breakage

I found this thread, worth reading it... what I took out of it is that a very sharp leading edge is bad, a square leading edge creates a lot of drag. Maybe there is a happy middle ground?
https://www.rcgroups.com/forums/sho...r-square-leading-edges-on-flat-plate-airfoils