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Pumpkin drop event

Universal Power Pack/Swappable?

#1
Hey guys, first post, love this stuff, I have a little heli but my passion was always for planes - and now I can afford it. I'm all ready to crash my first 4 dollar foam plane! woo hoo! not even gonna paint it 😜

So that brings me to the swappable. At first I thought there was this universal power pack that could be switched between all these planes but as I continue to read and look at this plans it seems that each plane needs a slightly different prop/motor/esc and battery combo.

So you can aways drive a powerful setup a little slower, but you can't make a slower setup faster

***So what I want to know is:

Can I buy the electronics setup that would be powerful enough to fly the FT Racer/FT Spitfire/FT Baby Blender with the power that they show in the reviews. but still be able to use on a slower plane. I'm still a noob so a slow flyer to get the handle of the controls would be nice. My theory is that with a Tx that will allow me to adjust the expos and % throttle etc. I could tone down a powerful setup so I don't over power/correct and when I'm ready for the plane to go faster and turn harder I'll just turn those values up.

I'm a bit on the cheap side and I'd hate do dump $55-60 bucks on a setup that I will out grow, or that wouldn't power the spitfire/racer (I really like the way those flew in the review). Preferably I'd like to train on the spit fire it looked to have a low stall speed and easier to fly.

As I get better I'd like to turn up the speed. Is the way I want to do it realistic? Could I use the Tx to "dumb" down a decent power house and crank it up 75-80-85-90-100% as my skills improve. I'd rather spend a few extra bucks buying the right equipment and not have to replace it between planes.

I'm looking to start with the Fly Sky FS-T6, it's cheap enough and has a 20 mode memory so I could basically save the throttle and servo settings for the different planes as I transfer my power pod between them.

Sorry for the long winded explanation. if you need any more details let me know. Any help/suggestions would be appreciated.

Thanks!

oh! one more thing.... I noticed one of the suppo motors could use 11 or 15 volts. Is this accomplished just by changing from a 3s to 4s battery (provided the esc could handle it)?
 

Ron B

Posted a thousand or more times
#2
If you use a 25-30 esc then you should only need 2 motors to fly all of the swappable's by just swapping out the motors. You will also need different sized props.
 
#3
If you use a 25-30 esc then you should only need 2 motors to fly all of the swappable's by just swapping out the motors. You will also need different sized props.
Thanks! Apparently I'm overthinking it a bit. Mind if I ask which 2 motors you would recommend? I like the idea that one of the suppo and run on either 11 or 15 volts could I get by with one of those? and just switch out the battery packs provided the ESC supports both voltages?

thanks in advance
 
#4
Hey mate, welcome to the forums.

if you have a look at the different setups from the standard one to the 'beef' power system, the main difference is the motor.

I totally get you when you say you dont want to be spending an extra $55 on a setup that you will out grow.

My suggestion would be to actually purchase the beef motor and the 24 gram blue wonder/hextronic motor. I think one is $8 and the other is about $12. If you got a 25A esc it would work with both. and I'd suggest getting 2 batteries, I started off with a 2s 500mah battery, i think it costs about $8. and it flew a bloody wonder just fine. it will also fly planes like the nutball, the ft flyer, the delta, simple soarer etc. that with the cheap motor will give you tons of fun. but I'd also suggest getting a 2200mah 3s battery. this will be your powerhouse battery ;) it will have tons more thrust and longer battery life. if you put that in your bloody wonder it will turn it into a rocket ship. so just by upgrading the battery you upgrade your flight experience. then once you've mastered that you can put on your bigger motor and you can fly all the flitetest planes. also, lets say you have a friend who wants to fly you can easily have a 2nd powerpod with the smaller motor on it so your friend can have a fly without too much hassle or worying he will crash your fast planes.
 

rcspaceflight

creator of virtual planes
#5
Well... you could get a big motor and then put a smaller battery and smaller prop on it for the "slow" swappables. The down side is that the motor would have some unnecessary weight with it. Which you may need to make up the extra weight by using a smaller/lighter battery. With a smaller prop and smaller battery you're going to loose a lot of efficiency. Which means you won't see very long flight times. Is that a bad thing? Not really. But to get more flight time before you have to wait around for your batteries to charge, you may want spare batteries so you can go out, fly through 3 or 4 batteries, and then come in and charge all of them. Which 4 batteries costs more than 2...

So it's just one of those things. You could over think it, or just do what others have suggestion and just buy the right motor for the plane. Motors really don't cost that much. Plus it is possibly to destroy one. So even though motors are highly likely to outlast your plane, they don't always.

But there really isn't much of a disadvantage of using a "too big" of an ESC. And you aren't going to destroy one in a crash. You can smoke one with the wrong battery/motor and that would cause a crash, but a too big ESC isn't likely to release the magic smoke.

------

Long story short, it is good to have a few different motors and prop combinations. And it's also good to have a few different sized batteries. But it certainly is possible to over power the smaller swappables.
 
#6
Thanks for all the help looks like I'll go with the "the beef" package deal from lazertoys and probably add an extra motor (blue wonder) and battery and that ought to get me off to a good start. The specs on "the beef" motor say 24-26A max, and the package only comes with a 20A esc. also it also recommends a lager prop than what comes with the package does the smaller 8x6 prop put less strain on the motor and therefor use less amps?? or should I error on the side of caution and get a 30A esc??

I guess it's important to say that the planes I really want to fly are the FT spitfire, racer, baby blender and F-22 (BTW I know the f22 isn't a swappable). I assume I'll build more but those are the ones I see myself having the most fun flying.
 

rcspaceflight

creator of virtual planes
#7
As tempting as it is to start out with those planes, something like the FT Flyer is a much better starting point. Remember, the life span of an airframe for someone just starting out is about... ten minutes. lol. You don't want to spend a few hours building something that isn't going to last very long.

I think it's good to follow the "80% rule". Only use 80% of the capacity of your electronics. That is, only use 80% of the mah on your batteries. Only use 80% of the amp rating of an ESC. Only use 80% of the "C" rating of your batteries. And so on. It may not be necessary, but is probably a good idea to invest in a 30amp ESC.

I'm not sure what your battery choices are, but getting a 2S and a 3S battery is great if your motors can handle either a 2S or a 3S. The easiest way to power down a motor is to go with the 2S, and the easiest way to add power is going with a 3S.

A general rule of thumb is that 2 inches of pitch equals 1 inch of diameter of a prop. So a motor that can handle an 8x6 prop can also handle a 9x4 or a 7x8. (But a 7x8 doesn't exist.) Okay, bad example. But a motor than can handle a 5x5 can also handle a 6x3. A motor than can handle a 9x6 can handle a 10x4 or an 8x8. Again, I don't think an 8x8 exists, but they're just examples.
 
#8
if those are the planes you're wanting to build, great choices by the way. the order that i'd suggest you build them is the F22, the spitfire, the baby blender and then the racer, as from the reviews it seems this would be the skill level progression it takes to fly them. The racer is aparently pretty tricky to fly and isnt recommended for a beginner.

as rcspaceflight suggested, try building an ft flyer first, it shouldn't take too long to build, also it'll let you get used to cutting foam, if this is your first foamy you're scratch building. trust me, you'll be happier to do some horrible looking hinge bevel cuts on this forgiving airframe than on your beautiful looking spitfire. also the flyer flies very gently and is a great platform to start with. my suggestion would be to build that one, it should take you an evening. fly it a couple of times, then pull it apart and take all the electronics off it and build your next plane. i know the plane doesnt look quite as sexy as the spitfire or the racer, but i can assure you, after a couple of crashes the ft flyer it will look better than your crashed spitfire ;)

if you build the ft flyer first, once you've flown that a few times, with the blue wonder motor, you can then use the blue wonder and your small battery on the f22, that would make it a great trainer too. then just use the new motor on your powerpod for your bigger badder planes.

I started off with the FT Bloody Wonder, great little plane, but also not designed for beginners. but it can be built fairly quickly and it flies really well. perhaps thats another one for you to consider ;) (I do have a sweet spot for this plane)


oh and one more thing, when you're doing your order, throw in a bunch of servos. work out how many servos you need for the spitfire, the baby blender, the f22 an the racer. you might find that you want to have multiple airframes at one time. you dont want to have to destroy a plane just so you can get the nessissary parts for your next one.
 
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Zwierdo

Junior Member
#9
Wow, I don’t think that this thread could possibly have been timelier for me. I recently bought the 3-pack kit and power plant from Lazertoyz, and was wondering about my next motor/battery/esc setup. I flew quite a bit several years ago, but the foam core builds have renewed my interest in building and flying, and I am super excited to be flying again soon.

I started scratchbuilding the Flyer and the F22 prior to my kits arriving, so I haven’t even opened the plastic on the 3-pack kits yet. I’ve been bitten by the bug, however, and I’m already trying to figure out how best to power everything. I’ve got both of those planes done, and am currently working on a Bloody Wonder, with plans to build a Versa Wing, Simple Soarer, and especially the Racer. (Oh, who am I kidding, I actually want to have the whole fleet built and hanging on the wall!). Because of the snow here, I haven’t flown them yet, but I’ve got some minwax to try on the first couple that I built with $tree foam board. While shopping around, I found out that the foam board at the drug store down the street is the kind that has a plastic coat instead of paper, so I’m building my Bloody Wonder out of that instead, and may switch to that for the rest of my builds to protect against the wet snow, even though it’s a bit heavier.

Anyway, I have the blue wonder motor, and a couple of 850mAh packs, but only a 10A speed control. My next purchase is obviously a “Beef” setup, but I’m running into a bit of confusion. The Motor/Battery/Prop combinations are different, depending on the plane. The Baby Blender, Spitfire, Racer and Duster all use the EMax GT2215-9 (1180KV) on a 9x6 prop, but the Versa Wing and 3D use the 2210-11 (1470KV) on an 8x4 prop. It doesn’t seem like much of a difference, but it is causing me some confusion trying to figure out why there’s a difference, and does it even matter. Which motor is more the more accepted choice?

The battery choice is also a bit perplexing. The “Beef” setups also generally call for the 1300mAh batteries, except for the versa, which calls for the 1600. It seems like the prevailing wisdom on the boards though is to just get the 2200s. Wouldn’t that be a whole boatload of extra unneeded weight? Won’t the 1600s power just about anything that either of those motors above could handle?

Sorry this got to be so long. I’m just generally a bit confused about what exactly my next step should be. Thanks in advance!
 
#10
with your 850mah battery, is it a 2s or a 3s? either way it will easily carry your bloody wonder, but if its a 3s it will be much more of a rocket :)

The difference between the 1300, 1600 and 2200mah batteries will be their weight and your flight time. that's assuming they are all 3s batteries.
 

Craftydan

Hostage Taker of Quads
Staff member
Moderator
Mentor
#11
I'll also say my BW likes all my 3S packs from 1000 - 2200, but it loves the 2200 in the wind. the 1000 pack will bounce around and bobble a bit, but it's rock steady wiht the 2200.

It does fly faster and carry more throttle with the bigger pack, but with a mid-to-large sized motor on the pod, that will hardly be a problem.

From what I've seen, my Spit prefers the 2200, but overall it's a heavier plane running higher throttle and what it prefers is the deeper capacity.
 

Zwierdo

Junior Member
#12
with your 850mah battery, is it a 2s or a 3s? either way it will easily carry your bloody wonder, but if its a 3s it will be much more of a rocket :)
I should have thought to mention that the 850s were 3s packs. But with the blue wonder (and my ESC) limited to 10 amps, I was worried that the suggested props wouldn't be overly exciting on the F-22 or the Bloody Wonder. I think I might need to get myself a watt meter so that I don't accidentally fry anything.

I now just need to figure out what "Beef" setup to get when I'm ready to step up to a more powerful power plant.
 
#15
Hey Guys,

Since I started the thread I've continued to research and found that, for the time being, I'm going to purchase the hextronic 24g motor and the NTM 2826 1350kv motor and a 15-18a and 25-30A ESC's respectively. I've also got all the parts cut out for the old speedster. I figured I'd get the basics down with that slow 3 channel (and still look kinda cool while doing it) then pull the motor over to the F22 at some point. I'll build a second Power Pod for the spitfire Racer and Baby Blender and switch around props as needed. Also picking up 2 3s 1300's 20c's and 2 3s 2200 25c's. From what I've been reading this is good plan of attack.

I also picked up a power analyzer I saw in one of the FT videos it was a HK-010 but to find it I had to search for "voltage analyzer" "watt meter" or something like that. anyway being a noobie I think this is almost a must have device. This way as you setup your planes with different props/motors/esc's you hook up the power analyzer and see what how many watts and amps are being drawn and make sure you are within the limits of your equipment. maybe this could be done with a volt meter but certainly not with such cool display. ��

also with all the different planes it looked like the FlySky FS-T6 was the best bang for the buck. the 20 mode memory and being programmable for dual rates and expos sold me. I don't see a need for more than 6 channels at the moment (I'm still trying to think of cool things to do with the extra 2 I'll already have).

I've stretched my beginner budget to the limit. I've printed plans and had to trace the parts and cut the foam. The speed build kits start to look pretty good considering the time it takes just to cut out the parts. If I wasn't so sure I was gonna crash it in the ground and destroy it I'd prefer the slick lines of a speed build kit.

so I guess more of a narration than any questions, but I just wanted to drop an update and say thanks for the suggestions. I can't wait to post some pics of my maiden disasters ��

---Jes
 

shortbus1989

I do random gravitychecks
#16
My personal setup that I have used on the following planes.
FT Spitfire
FT Old Speedster
FT 3D (only hovers on fresh charge)
FT Delta
FT Flyer
FT Versa Wing
FT Viggen (pending build paint and test)
Setup
Hobbyking SS 25-30amp esc
Turnigy 28-26 1400kv
Slowfly 8045 prop
Zippy compact 1300Mah - Also Have a Zippy compact 2200Mah for the bigger planes
Orange RX610

Speedster
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qliZIRzAzAU

Spitfire review
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sDKAVogLi7A

Spitfire snow flight
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K3geNn8FMQ4
 
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shortbus1989

I do random gravitychecks
#18
I have considered it, just not sure if the motor would like it. The suggested prop size for 3s is 7x4, I am going to order some 9x4.7s for my quad so maybe I'll do some testing and let you know what I find.
 
#19
Hello,

I think you are over looking the most important part of the planes designs. The earlier swappable designs are for learning to fly not to look good. If you start with a plane beyond your skill level you will have a bad and disappointing experience. All of this talk about starting with a Spitfire or other advanced plane is the wrong way to look at it. If you start with a power system for a more advanced plane on a simple trainer plane you have just taken away some of the trainers forgiveness by making it to heavy or to fast.

If you have the experience to fly a Spitfire or other advanced plane you would not be asking the questions you are about powering these planes. You will have a much better experience if you follow the series of planes and their recommended power systems. It is a lot more fun to fly a Nutball than crash a Spitfire.

Good luck,
 
#20
RAMartinJr -

you certainly make a good point. I understand about having more fun flying a slow ugly plane vs crashing a cool one. My question was about making the cool plane a little slower. considering all the tech in the transmitters today, you could easily setup on of those sleeker planes to specs then add in lots of expo and 50% or less dual rates thus making a slower easier to manage plane. I understand it still needs enough power to prevent stalling but from the spitfire review it appeared to have a pretty slow stall speed which i think would be benificial to a beginner or a beginner transitioning to intermediate. all that aside, I went ahead and build an Old Speedster to help me feel out my controls and put around and work on my reflexes as it flies towards me. I have flown some little heli's and lots of RC cars so this isn't new to me though I am far from pro at it.

Back to the spitfire. I would like to think as I get better handling the plane I could reduce the expo and dual rate effect and give my self a bit more power and throw thus allowing the plane to increase in performance slightly as I better understand how it flies. I could be totally wrong in my asumption of how all this works but all my electroincs should arrive later this week and I'll give it a go. incrementally increasing the performance of a plane that you are already familar with flight charecteristics would build skills much quicker than having to relearn the characteristics everytime you switch planes.

Perhaps this is a good project for the flitetest group, how about an "all around" skill level plane that could grow with the pilot (and also looks cool). one that would fly with only rudder and elevator initially but then could add the ailerons later. and then a plan to increase the throws as skills increase. could fly well with the blue wonder but could add the BEEF later. with the right ESC from the start the motor would be the only upgrade needed and after you're familar with the plane you can let it rip!! Just a thought. I'm still pretty green :)

...Jes
 
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